Speculation: Athanasiou Part 2

[mouser]

my guess is that he fears he's gonna be in the doghouse again and get 10-12min a night like last season, limiting his next contract

He can fear that all he wants, hanging out in Switzerland isn't going to make that fear disappear though.

 

[Shaman464]

He can fear that all he wants, hanging out in Switzerland isn't going to make that fear disappear though.

Zero minutes a night and no pay are far better than becoming a millionaire and playing 12 minutes a night.

 

[Claypool]

I think he doesn't want to play in Detroit.

IMO, that's why he won't sign. Doesn't like his TOI, doesn't like his coach, and wants to be paid more to stay in a situation he doesn't like.

Again, MO.

He's going to have a hard time finding a coach in the NHL that will give into the demands of a 23 year-old with 100 games of experience. He pulled the same thing in London and he got his way. Not going to happen in the pros, though.

All I can hear is FSN announcing "Steve Yzerman has decided to return to Detroit".

Yzerman's contract with the Lightning is up after next season. It's possible he returns to Detroit with only one year left on his deal in Tampa.

 

[Dotter]

He can fear that all he wants, hanging out in Switzerland isn't going to make that fear disappear though.

Yeah. Whatever his "strategy" is, it's not very well thought out. He's not helping his future... at all.

 

[njx9]

Let's say he signs the 1 year, and inevitably goes to arbitration next year. Does that have any effect on when he becomes a UFA?

I think he doesn't want to play in Detroit.

IMO, that's why he won't sign. Doesn't like his TOI, doesn't like his coach, and wants to be paid more to stay in a situation he doesn't like.

Again, MO.

I can see that - it's not that he necessarily thinks his play is that much better than his comparables, but that he wants more money to put up with playing here. I don't know that it's a great strategy for a guy with so much team control remaining, but I can definitely see the mindset.

 

[Ezekial]

Let's say he signs the 1 year, and inevitably goes to arbitration next year. Does that have any effect on when he becomes a UFA?

No. 4 seasons.


And if he needs more money "to put up with playing here" he can go right ahead and have fun in Europe.

 

[njx9]

No. 4 seasons.

Fair enough - then I can see why it still wouldn't be super intriguing for him if he either wants out or thinks he's worth a ton more.

And if he needs more money "to put up with playing here" he can go right ahead and have fun in Europe.

*shrug* I think it's clear that that's what he intends to do until the offer changes or he gets moved, given the money he's already lost.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

He disent want to be here.

He is trying to make rhe idea of him returning to Detroit appear so toxic to the locker room that Holland will trade him to avoid that.

That's his strategy. He is trying to be the worst husband in the world so the wife calls it quits and leaves him first.

 

[Ezekial]

He disent want to be here.

He is trying to make rhe idea of him returning to Detroit appear so toxic to the locker room that Holland will trade him to avoid that.

That's his strategy. He is trying to be the worst husband in the world so the wife calls it quits and leaves him first.

Killing your value is a terrible way to go about getting traded.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Killing your value is a terrible way to go about getting traded.

He disent care about his return value, none of them do.

He cares about not being here, that's it.

It's up to Holland to decide if his decreased value is more important than the negative atmosphere he may create for this franchise.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

Well Holland increased his offer to AA.

AA signs it or he just isn't interested in playing for Detroit.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Well Holland increased his offer to AA.

AA signs it or he just isn't interested in playing for Detroit.

Right

And not signing it tells you everything. He would rather not be here unless paid way more than he is worth.

Yzerman called Drouins bluff because he could, stacked young team with no pressing cap issues at that time, but in the end Drouin got what he wanted, out..

 

[Ezekial]

He disent care about his return value, none of them do.

He cares about not being here, that's it.

It's up to Holland to decide if his decreased value is more important than the negative atmosphere he may create for this franchise.

I completely agree that he doesn't and shouldn't care about his value to the Red Wings if he wants to get traded.

But Ken Holland also shouldn't and won't take a marginal return because AA doesn't want to be here.

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

I completely agree that he doesn't and shouldn't care about his value to the Red Wings if he wants to get traded.

But Ken Holland also shouldn't and won't take a marginal return because AA doesn't want to be here.

True

But does Holland want a young player in this locker room with this attitude who clearly doesn't want to be here?

What does he want less.. A weak return or a toxic locker room?

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Well Holland increased his offer to AA.

AA signs it or he just isn't interested in playing for Detroit.

Just the one year deal from $1.25 million to $1.5 million supposedly, The two year deal is still at $1.9 million or so.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

He disent care about his return value, none of them do.

He cares about not being here, that's it.

It's up to Holland to decide if his decreased value is more important than the negative atmosphere he may create for this franchise.

Then ask for a trade. It's ubiquitous enough now to do so. If you really don't want to be somewhere, be a man and tell them that. If he is so unhappy that he just doesn't want to deal with it... it takes two words to say to Holland. Trade me.

Don't ask for more than other players in your situation got, don't sulk and avoid signing a contract because you're scared you'll get 10-12 minutes a night (when all evidence shows that you got 14 on the average.

Hell, you just don't want to deal with being the young man on the totem pole in a rebuilding team where you're getting reamed?

And I know he doesn't care about his trade value... but if you actually wanted to be gone because you just hate Detroit now and any other team would be better? You're not helping the likelihood of you getting your wish by sulking about a contract offer over in Switzerland. Other teams, teams you could have been traded to, are watching and seeing a guy who they eventually will have questions about relying on.

 

[Redder Winger]

Right

And not signing it tells you everything. He would rather not be here unless paid way more than he is worth.

Yzerman called Drouins bluff because he could, stacked young team with no pressing cap issues at that time, but in the end Drouin got what he wanted, out..

Apples and oranges. Drouin was under contract. Athanasiou isn't.

So many wild assumptions about Athanasiou are being treated as fact.

Detroit only upped the one year offer, not the two year offer.
How much they up it matters.

Until we hear what the offer is, how can you make any kind of judgment about it or Athanasiou's reaction to it?

 

[Zetterberg4Captain]

Apples and oranges. Drouin was under contract. Athanasiou isn't.

So many wild assumptions about Athanasiou are being treated as fact.

Detroit only upped the one year offer, not the two year offer.
How much they up it matters.

Until we hear what the offer is, how can you make any kind of judgment about it or Athanasiou's reaction to it?

Of course it's assumptions but the longer it goes on the more they become true.

 

[Winger98]

The 1.5 QFO is a helpful boost for sure, I'd be ecstatic if tomorrow morning at work I read he signed that deal. I'd be a little anxious thinking about the big 3 RFAs next year, but it will be interesting to see how they take care of that situation when/if it comes up.

Maybe a bit too pessimist, but I think Holland will approach it the same way he seems to always approach it - someone will get hurt and he'll LTIR his way out of it. Except it doesn't really happen and guys like Kronwall will try to get on the ice even if he has to use his stick to push him across the blueline. Which would help explain how his production on the powerplay has went down.

this is probably true.

I theorize that Ken Holland has basically all but planned his retirement this year. I don't think the replacement will be Draper (not ready) or Ryan Martin. So I imagine it is very likely to be an outsider selected to replace him.

Co-GMs. I joke, sort of. I wouldn't be surprised to see Wright jump both of them and get it, though.

And I know he doesn't care about his trade value... but if you actually wanted to be gone because you just hate Detroit now and any other team would be better? You're not helping the likelihood of you getting your wish by sulking about a contract offer over in Switzerland. Other teams, teams you could have been traded to, are watching and seeing a guy who they eventually will have questions about relying on.

Not to mention the fact that he doesn't have a contract, no one can watch him play, and no one is going to deal for him and worry about having to deal with these same contract issues. If his agent is selling him on this idea, his agent needs to be fired.

I think a contract is closer than anyone makes it out, though. Athanasiou is in Switzerland more to get in shape than to get a job in what will essentially be a european training camp. It's frustrating. It's stupid. This hold-out doesn't reflect on him well at all. But it is what it is.

 

[TheMule93]

 

[Redder Winger]

Of course it's assumptions but the longer it goes on the more they become true.

Unless they're wrong.

 

[Ezekial]

Maybe a bit too pessimist, but I think Holland will approach it the same way he seems to always approach it - someone will get hurt and he'll LTIR his way out of it. Except it doesn't really happen and guys like Kronwall will try to get on the ice even if he has to use his stick to push him across the blueline. Which would help explain how his production on the powerplay has went down.

That's what is so GD frustrating about the situation, he's obviously not cut out for it anymore.

I remember a couple times watching the PP before Kronner came back and Daley had a couple keeps that made me go "no way in hell Kronwall gets to that."

(I haven't used this gif since the moment we were picking 9 with Vilardi on the board )

 

[Redder Winger]

This hold-out doesn't reflect on him well at all. But it is what it is.

Dude doesn't have a contract.
He can't report to work without one.

How does this reflect badly on him?
If you look at some of the national writers, like Wyshinski, they put this on Holland's plate - not Athanasiou's.

Locally, the media are all glorified PR hacks for the Red Wings.

If you take your cues from them, well, they've done nothing but defend the Red Wings' stance in this negotiation. So I see why you disagree with Athanasiou.

But even allowing for that - how does that reflect poorly on the guy?

How many people this year are complaining about Jacob Trouba after last year's "hold-out."
How is it a hold out and not a lock out?

Language choice reveals bias.

I think stalemate is a good word.

Negotiations are a two-way street.

 

[TheMule93]

(I haven't used this gif since the moment we were picking 9 with Vilardi on the board )

I hope the gif works out better this time

 

[Shaman464]

Dude doesn't have a contract.
He can't report to work without one.

How does this reflect badly on him?
If you look at some of the national writers, like Wyshinski, they put this on Holland's plate - not Athanasiou's.

Locally, the media are all glorified PR hacks for the Red Wings.

If you take your cues from them, well, they've done nothing but defend the Red Wings' stance in this negotiation. So I see why you disagree with Athanasiou.

But even allowing for that - how does that reflect poorly on the guy?

How many people this year are complaining about Jacob Trouba after last year's "hold-out."
How is it a hold out and not a lock out?

Language choice reveals bias.

I think stalemate is a good word.

Negotiations are a two-way street.

Negotiations imply he has something to negotiate with. Based on the CBA he's a holdout.