ATD Chat Thread XV

[seventieslord]

There's an SIHR member selling some books. They are CAD$10 each. If they were less I'd have just bought them myself and then found them a new home among my ATD friends, but at $10 each I'd leave it up to you guys to decide. Let me know if you want me to get you in touch with him:

World Almanac Guide to Pro Hockey 1974-75
Hockey Stars of 1969
Hockey Stars of 1974
The Complete Handbook of Pro Hockey 1979
The Complete Handbook of Pro Hockey 1980
Illustrated Digest of Pro Hockey 1972-73 Edition
Hockey Scouting Report 2000
Hockey Scouting Report 2003

These are all good for bios, and I picked them out of a list of stuff he had available specifically for that reason. I thought a couple of you might be interested.

 

[JFA87-66-99]

There's an SIHR member selling some books. They are CAD$10 each. If they were less I'd have just bought them myself and then found them a new home among my ATD friends, but at $10 each I'd leave it up to you guys to decide. Let me know if you want me to get you in touch with him:

World Almanac Guide to Pro Hockey 1974-75
Hockey Stars of 1969
Hockey Stars of 1974
The Complete Handbook of Pro Hockey 1979
The Complete Handbook of Pro Hockey 1980
Illustrated Digest of Pro Hockey 1972-73 Edition
Hockey Scouting Report 2000
Hockey Scouting Report 2003

These are all good for bios, and I picked them out of a list of stuff he had available specifically for that reason. I thought a couple of you might be interested.

I really wanna get my hands on "The trail of the Stanley cup" especially volume 1. I'm always interested in hockey's early days

 

[ResilientBeast]

I really wanna get my hands on "The trail of the Stanley cup" especially volume 1. I'm always interested in hockey's early days

I was lucky enough that as a university graduation gift my parents bought me a complete set last year

 

[JFA87-66-99]

I was lucky enough that as a university graduation gift my parents bought me a complete set last year

Nice any idea how much they $$$

 

[ResilientBeast]

Nice any idea how much they $$$

I don't remember what they spent, seems like Volume 1 is the hardest to find, here's an idea of what they cost

https://www.abebooks.com/book-search/title/the-trail-of-the-stanley-cup/

 

[seventieslord]

Nice any idea how much they $$$

look on the net, there are always a few sets out there, and they're not always exorbitant. Prepare to spend at least $300. I spent $350 I think. This was about 9 years ago when it was actually very useful as a research tool... newspapers have greatly reduced its value to the point where it's a must in any serious hockey library, but not the first thing you reach for.

 

[JFA87-66-99]

​

look on the net, there are always a few sets out there, and they're not always exorbitant. Prepare to spend at least $300. I spent $350 I think. This was about 9 years ago when it was actually very useful as a research tool... newspapers have greatly reduced its value to the point where it's a must in any serious hockey library, but not the first thing you reach for.

Id be curious to see what is says about the game and some its players from the 1890's-1900's era.

 

[ResilientBeast]

NHA Goal Distributions

Season|Rover|Center|Winger|Winger|Defence|Defence|GPG
1909-10|24.3%|29.30%|18.20%|18.20%|6.8%|6.8%|12.93
1910-11|22.30%|27.60%|18.70%|18.70%|6.4%|6.4%|10.43
1911-12|0%|31.69%|23.84%|23.84%|10.32%|10.32%|9.28
1912-13|0%|39/23%|19.62%|19.62%|10.77%|10.77%|8.17
1913-14|0%|33.84%|23.29%|23.29%|9.79%|9.79%|8.62

Here's the start of my data collection for percentage of goals scored by each position for these 5 seasons. With the elimination of the rover the defence and center positions only gained ~4% more goals the following season while wingers gained over 5%.

The variation season to season in terms of percentages is a little sporadic, but center post rover usually accounted for at least 30% of a teams offence while each winger position accounted for ~20% and defense ~10%. While the league goals per game in the NHA dropped by a whole goal post elimination of the rover

For comparisons sake here is what the PCHA data looks like for the three seasons in which the leagues overlap.

PCHA Goal Distributions

Season|Rover|Center|Winger|Winger|Defence|Defence|GPG
1911-12|24.50%|27.60%|15.90%|15.90%|8.00%|8.00%|11.35
1912-13|16.80%|23.80%|17.60%|17.60%|12.20%|12.20%|9.91
1913-14|22.80%|24.40%|18.00%|18.00%|8.40%|8.40%|10.04

The PCHA data is in line with the NHA data pre-elimination of the rover accept that defensemen were responsible for a larger portion of the offence.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

NHA Goal Distributions

Season|Rover|Center|Winger|Winger|Defence|Defence|GPG
1909-10|24.3%|29.30%|18.20%|18.20%|6.8%|6.8%|12.93
1910-11|22.30%|27.60%|18.70%|18.70%|6.4%|6.4%|10.43
1911-12|0%|31.69%|23.84%|23.84%|10.32%|10.32%|9.28
1912-13|0%|39/23%|19.62%|19.62%|10.77%|10.77%|8.17
1913-14|0%|33.84%|23.29%|23.29%|9.79%|9.79%|8.62

Here's the start of my data collection for percentage of goals scored by each position for these 5 seasons. With the elimination of the rover the defence and center positions only gained ~4% more goals the following season while wingers gained over 5%.

The variation season to season in terms of percentages is a little sporadic, but center post rover usually accounted for at least 30% of a teams offence while each winger position accounted for ~20% and defense ~10%. While the league goals per game in the NHA dropped by a whole goal post elimination of the rover

For comparisons sake here is what the PCHA data looks like for the three seasons in which the leagues overlap.

PCHA Goal Distributions

Season|Rover|Center|Winger|Winger|Defence|Defence|GPG
1911-12|24.50%|27.60%|15.90%|15.90%|8.00%|8.00%|11.35
1912-13|16.80%|23.80%|17.60%|17.60%|12.20%|12.20%|9.91
1913-14|22.80%|24.40%|18.00%|18.00%|8.40%|8.40%|10.04

The PCHA data is in line with the NHA data pre-elimination of the rover accept that defensemen were responsible for a larger portion of the offence.

Yeah but it dropped by 2.5 goals per game the season before that

 

[ResilientBeast]

Yeah but it dropped by 2.5 goals per game the season before that

That is true as well

I'm trying to figure out why such a steep drop off happened.

My first guess would be rule changes, with this change players would be better rested and maybe less likely to be straight up outskated

Rule changes[edit]
Games were changed from two periods of 30 minutes, to three periods of twenty minutes, with ten-minute rest periods. The Spalding hockey puck was adopted as the standard puck.[7]

Also the first implementation of a salary cap, and the 3 best teams were pretty close in GF unlike previous years

 

[jarek]

Well.. the last two games prove the Leafs have a LONG way to go to being a serious playoff contender.

If our starting goaltender this year is even a tier below Andersen, is there any chance they are better than a bottom-5 team?

 

[seventieslord]

FML, TML

seriously

 

[seventieslord]

reposting with an updated list:

There's an SIHR member selling some books. They are CAD$10 each. If they were less I'd have just bought them myself and then found them a new home among my ATD friends, but at $10 each I'd leave it up to you guys to decide. Let me know if you want me to get you in touch with him:

World Almanac Guide to Pro Hockey 1974-75
Hockey Stars of 1969
Hockey Stars of 1974
The Complete Handbook of Pro Hockey 1979
The Complete Handbook of Pro Hockey 1980
Illustrated Digest of Pro Hockey 1972-73 Edition
Illustrated Digest of Pro Hockey 1973-74 Edition
Hockey Scouting Report 2000
Hockey Scouting Report 2002
Hockey Scouting Report 2003

These are all good for bios, and I picked them out of a list of stuff he had available specifically for that reason. I thought a couple of you might be interested.

 

[seventieslord]

There are four rookies on pace for the 6th, 9th, 9th and 16th highest scoring rookie seasons of the past 23 years this season.

Think about that. Over the past 22 years, one such season would occur every two years. And now we get to see four in one season.

And three from the same team!

 

[tony d]

Mike Illitch passed away today:

http://www.tsn.ca/tigers-red-wings-owner-ilitch-dead-at-87-1.669160

 

[seventieslord]

RIP Mike Illitch. One of hockey's best and most memorable owners.

 

[Iceman]

RIP Mike Illitch. One of hockey's best and most memorable owners.

Died with the Joe I suppose. Great owner.

RIP

 

[Iceman]

Is it just me that is disgusted that it's suddenly being acceptable and expected that players go through slumps?

(In general, no specific player in mind)

 

[Cyborg LeClair]

Is there an easy resource for finding where defenseman finished in point scoring among other defensemen?

 

[jarek]

Is there an easy resource for finding where defenseman finished in point scoring among other defensemen?

Hockey reference. Use the season finder to do a search on each season you're looking for.

Example:

http://www.hockey-reference.com/pla...=D&is_playoffs=N&threshhold=5&order_by=points

 

[seventieslord]

Hockey reference. Use the season finder to do a search on each season you're looking for.

Example:

http://www.hockey-reference.com/pla...=D&is_playoffs=N&threshhold=5&order_by=points

if you're not talking about the NHL or you're talking about a pre-WW2 player that played in a time when there were always a few multi-positional guys active, that may be slightly inaccurate.

 

[jarek]

if you're not talking about the NHL or you're talking about a pre-WW2 player that played in a time when there were always a few multi-positional guys active, that may be slightly inaccurate.

Right. Even for the NHL it isn't perfect. However, I can't think of a better free way to do it.

 

[Cyborg LeClair]

Hockey reference. Use the season finder to do a search on each season you're looking for.

Example:

http://www.hockey-reference.com/pla...=D&is_playoffs=N&threshhold=5&order_by=points

Thanks, that should work fine. Just sucks for guys with 20 year careers haha

 

[jarek]

Nyquist should get no fewer than 20 games. Disgusting.

 

[MadArcand]

Huh.

That was much worse than the infamous McSorley - Brashear incident, actually...