Around the League 2018-19 Offseason Part II

[NJDevs26]

And I have no idea what the long term plan is in Detroit or Long Island right now.

Holland is 62 (which is actually younger than I thought) and Lou's 76...who said anything about a long-term plan?

 

[glenwo2]

Holland is 62 (which is actually younger than I thought) and Lou's 76...who said anything about a long-term plan?

If you've got time, use it.

 

[My3Sons]

At a certain point you have to be realistic about your chances in the near term though. That's been Holland's problem in Detroit the last few years. I get wanting to keep the playoff streak going but once that ended they should have been all-in on the rebuild with all the older players they had and not much left in their farm system. That was Lou's problem to an extent his last couple years here and arguably now. You can argue with Trotz in Brooklyn he still had to take a shot even once JT walked out the door but leaving Trotz out of the equation it really made no sense to make win-now moves once they lost JT and deHaan too for that matter.

Even with Trotz, what's the celing for the Islanders...a Cinderella playoff berth and punted in the first round? That's the absolute celing, Trotz can't walk on water and lead this ragtag group to a Cup.

I was a big tank and horde draft picks supporter before last season. The balancing act Shero manged to achieve last season was impressive. Draft well get as many young players into your lineup as possible and trade older players where possible. It’s tricky but probably better than the full on tank mode which sets a bad precedent

 

[glenwo2]

I was a big tank and horde draft picks supporter before last season. The balancing act Shero manged to achieve last season was impressive. Draft well get as many young players into your lineup as possible and trade older players where possible. It’s tricky but probably better than the full on tank mode which sets a bad precedent

Well it helped that Chiarelli is a moron and basically gave us the Hart Trophy winner for a song, a dance, and a Larsson....

Without Hall, I think the playoffs would still be a pipe-dream today.


Yes, Shero would've still did what you stated, but the rebuild would be proceeding at a normal rate as opposed to Warp Speed, thanks to Hall.

 

[My3Sons]

Well it helped that Chiarelli is a moron and basically gave us the Hart Trophy winner for a song, a dance, and a Larsson....

Without Hall, I think the playoffs would still be a pipe-dream today.


Yes, Shero would've still did what you stated, but the rebuild would be proceeding at a normal rate as opposed to Warp Speed, thanks to Hall.

I agree. Like I said it is tricky. I just don’t believe in mailing in a season anymore. It just creates a bad atmosphere. I don’t advocate doubling down on old vets. I would have played Santini over Lovejoy last year precisely because the team is still developing and I wouldn’t sign older UFAs or any UFA with term other than a real needle mover. That said I think the trades to bolster the playoff push were the correct risks even if Grabner was a flop in NJ. Making the playoffs unexpectedly will pay dividends down the road for the young players and probably Hall’s extension. Can you imagine if they were very bad last year after the putrid finish the year before? Even if the team regresses this season I expect a competitive team that plays hard and pushes back. Yes the roster is still young and has holes but in my view they are only a LD1 a 2C and a solid goalie away from being a dangerous team. Those are hard players to find but maybe they get the 2C in place this year and with some more percolating the other two come to the fore. When they do the team will be tough and ready to win. EDM will have to learn how to win all over agin after the toxic atmosphere from last season.

 

[Nubmer6]

If you've got time, use it.

Oh god. All these years I thought he said if you got THYME. No wonder all my dishes are over-seasoned

 

[Bleedred]

At a certain point you have to be realistic about your chances in the near term though. That's been Holland's problem in Detroit the last few years. I get wanting to keep the playoff streak going but once that ended they should have been all-in on the rebuild with all the older players they had and not much left in their farm system. That was Lou's problem to an extent his last couple years here and arguably now. You can argue with Trotz in Brooklyn he still had to take a shot even once JT walked out the door but leaving Trotz out of the equation it really made no sense to make win-now moves once they lost JT and deHaan too for that matter.

Even with Trotz, what's the celing for the Islanders...a Cinderella playoff berth and punted in the first round? That's the absolute celing, Trotz can't walk on water and lead this ragtag group to a Cup.

The Islanders ceiling to me is like the 13-14 Devils. Miss the playoffs by 3-5 points. That’s the absolute ceiling. I think if they finished in 14-15 and 15-16 Devils territory it would be a success.

 

[MadDevil]

The Islanders ceiling to me is like the 13-14 Devils. Miss the playoffs by 3-5 points. That’s the absolute ceiling. I think if they finished in 14-15 and 15-16 Devils territory it would be a success.

The big x factor for them to me is Lehner. This is probably his last chance to get a starting gig in this league and players with that kind of motivation sometimes have a really good season. If he can have a top 15 season they might be that annoying team to play against that wins more than they probably should. If he's not though their season could get ugly quickly.

 

[Emperoreddy]

The key difference with us is we were never hampered by big contracts during this rebuild.

Detroit is capped out. They have to trade away pieces just to get under. That is no way to manage a rebuild.

Isles should cash out as well on guys like Eberle. He most likely will not be apart of the future for them. Signing all these slugs and goons doesn’t help them at all either.

 

[MartyOwns]

the wings plan is similar to what the bkackhawks did when hossa’s shoulder pads gave him some pimples. zetterberg will go on LTIR, the wings will be fine, and we can all have a hearty chuckle about this during the next work stoppage

 

[Triumph]

the wings plan is similar to what the bkackhawks did when hossa’s shoulder pads gave him some pimples. zetterberg will go on LTIR, the wings will be fine, and we can all have a hearty chuckle about this during the next work stoppage

With Hossa, he was clearly in decline and even though he scored 26 goals it was thanks to the highest shooting percentage he'd had in a decade. Zetterberg was 2nd on the Wings in scoring last season and they can be under the cap without putting him on LTIR. So it doesn't make a ton of sense from the Wings perspective to want to have him gone.

 

[MartyOwns]

With Hossa, he was clearly in decline and even though he scored 26 goals it was thanks to the highest shooting percentage he'd had in a decade. Zetterberg was 2nd on the Wings in scoring last season and they can be under the cap without putting him on LTIR. So it doesn't make a ton of sense from the Wings perspective to want to have him gone.

no no...it makes a ton of sense for zetterberg though. but why take it from me? here’s what he said last year about the probability of him playing out his contract (which would be through 2021)...and wait juuuuust a second here...his salary just happens to be dropping this year anyway? like hossa?! oh my stars i feel faint

Zetterberg, 36, cited a longing for his native Sweden as part of his reasoning. But he also acknowledges what everyone knew when he signed the 12-year, $73 million contract in 2009: There was a reason it was heavily front-loaded.
"The only reason we signed such a long contract back in 2009 was because of the cap," Zetterberg said in the interview, which the Free Press had translated from Zetterberg's native Swedish. "It's pretty obvious, you try to fool the system. In reality, I think I have two years left. I don't think I will play through the 2020/2021 season."
gone.

i remember having the same conversations with blackhawks fans when hossa did it even more blatantly. you know those ridiculous contracts that were allowed at the time, that everyone knew were a wink and nod to lower a cap hit? now we’re supposed to be shocked when the players do exactly what they intended by then-legal circumvention? it’s a joke

 

[Blender]

no no...it makes a ton of sense for zetterberg though. but why take it from me? here’s what he said last year about the probability of him playing out his contract (which would be through 2021)...and wait juuuuust a second here...his salary just happens to be dropping this year anyway? like hossa?! oh my stars i feel faint



i remember having the same conversations with blackhawks fans when hossa did it even more blatantly. you know those ridiculous contracts that were allowed at the time, that everyone knew were a wink and nod to lower a cap hit? now we’re supposed to be shocked when the players do exactly what they intended by then-legal circumvention? it’s a joke

The worst part is all of these teams are avoiding the penalties for it due to "injuries".

 

[MartyOwns]

The worst part is all of these teams are avoiding the penalties for it due to "injuries".

agreed, but i can actually see that to an extent. hossa has some pimples or what every mystery disease he has. zetterberg had major back surgery a few years back (he hasn’t missed a game since jagr was a devil and salvador was our captain, but let’s put that aside). it’s the fact that they could keep playing if they wanted to. there are treatments, they were able to do it when they were making a lot more money a year ago. but now, the $ drops, they disappear and the team gets cap relief after collecting a couple of cups from assembling all star teams with these bullshit contracts.

and stay tuned, because next will come the third act of the farce, where they start trading contracts of these newly crippled retired-kind-of-but-not-really players so they can sign MORE guys and worse teams can hit the cap floor. and we’re supposed to say ‘oh no i hope his back feels better soon’ ‘oh gee i hope his skin clears up before the big dance’ etc etc get the f*** out of here with that nonsense

 

[Blender]

agreed, but i can actually see that to an extent. hossa has some pimples or what every mystery disease he has. zetterberg had major back surgery a few years back (he hasn’t missed a game since jagr was a devil and salvador was our captain, but let’s put that aside). it’s the fact that they could keep playing if they wanted to. there are treatments, they were able to do it when they were making a lot more money a year ago. but now, the $ drops, they disappear and the team gets cap relief after collecting a couple of cups from assembling all star teams with these bull**** contracts.

and stay tuned, because next will come the third act of the farce, where they start trading contracts of these newly crippled retired-kind-of-but-not-really players so they can sign MORE guys and worse teams can hit the cap floor. and we’re supposed to say ‘oh no i hope his back feels better soon’ ‘oh gee i hope his skin clears up before the big dance’ etc etc get the **** out of here with that nonsense

What do you mean "next"? Trading them has already happened and continues to.

 

[MartyOwns]

What do you mean "next"? Trading them has already happened and continues to.

i meant next for zetterberg, hossa, parise in a few years, etc etc

 

[Triumph]

no no...it makes a ton of sense for zetterberg though. but why take it from me? here’s what he said last year about the probability of him playing out his contract (which would be through 2021)...and wait juuuuust a second here...his salary just happens to be dropping this year anyway? like hossa?! oh my stars i feel faint



i remember having the same conversations with blackhawks fans when hossa did it even more blatantly. you know those ridiculous contracts that were allowed at the time, that everyone knew were a wink and nod to lower a cap hit? now we’re supposed to be shocked when the players do exactly what they intended by then-legal circumvention? it’s a joke

But there he's saying he has 2 years left and now he's quitting early, so something changed.

Likewise the NHL changed the rules about these kinds of contracts, and the only reason the NHL changed the rules about them is that the league wants to get salaries and cap hits as close to back in line as possible, otherwise their system would be all messed up at this point - it already is, that's why players only make 90% of what their contract actually says.

I think had they not changed it, you would see Zetterberg retire, but because of cap recapture, teams don't want them to. And again, who knows - some guys will want to play through those years, I think. In Hossa's case, the team probably didn't want him to.

 

[Blender]

i meant next for zetterberg, hossa, parise in a few years, etc etc

Hossa has been traded already.

 

[njdevils1982]

Hossa has been traded already.

cant wait for his number to be retired by the yotes

 

[Billdo]

As soon as I saw the tweet about Zetterberg not being able to train I immediately though "oh, so they'll LTIR him, no worry about the cap, and they'll have that cap hit to play with." It's sad that this is what it's coming to at this point yet we are the only club who has been punished for violating "the spirit of the CBA." Yes, I'm still bitter. Don't @ me about it.

 

[Triumph]

As soon as I saw the tweet about Zetterberg not being able to train I immediately though "oh, so they'll LTIR him, no worry about the cap, and they'll have that cap hit to play with." It's sad that this is what it's coming to at this point yet we are the only club who has been punished for violating "the spirit of the CBA." Yes, I'm still bitter. Don't @ me about it.

LTIR doesn't mean 'no worry about the cap' - that's why we've seen Pronger and Hossa and Savard and Bolland and Horton and Clarkson and Grabovski and Vitale other permanently injured players be traded, sometimes along with reasonably significant assets.

I don't see how the Wings replace Zetterberg's salary in August. They've signed all of their RFAs, Franzen is definitely injured, almost all the UFAs are gone (Nash isn't, I suppose, but who knows why he would sign there), and they're in a rebuilding year. If I were the Wings, I'd want Zetterberg to play this season and perhaps try to deal him to a contender at the deadline with the understanding that he would retire at the end of the season. The Wings have a lot of big contracts ending this off-season and could eat the cap recapture for two years - Zetterberg would miss out on some cash, but he never intended to get that money in the first place.

 

[MartyOwns]

Hossa has been traded already.

oh jesus i can’t keep up anymore

 

[Bleedred]

cant wait for his number to be retired by the yotes

Right next to Pronger’s!

 

[Devils Dominion]

Right next to Pronger’s!

Clarkson almost won a Cup with Vegas

 

[Bleedred]

Clarkson almost won a Cup with Vegas

We could have won it if we had kept him.