Speculation: Armchair GM Thread: the madness continues

[FlamerForLife]

http://www.tsn.ca/eight-teams-interested-in-avs-duchene-1.861434

Second time this offseason we've been linked with Duchene, although this time it's reported by Dreger so take it with a grain of salt.

According to TSN Hockey Insider Darren Dreger, as many as eight teams have contacted Avalanche general manager Joe Sakic about Duchene, but no deal appears to be close.

Dreger adds that none of the teams who have reached out feel confident they will acquire the centre, who has been on the trade market since February.
The Ottawa Senators, Montreal Canadiens, Calgary Flames, Vancouver Canucks, Los Angeles Kings, Nashville Predators and Columbus Blue Jackets are all believed to have reached out over the past few days, according to Dreger.

 

[Baxterman]

I can't see how it makes sense in terms of acquisition cost and salary for the Flames to add Duchene.

Unless they are in love with our defensive prospects I don't think we have the pieces they would be looking for, or at least what I would expect they would want.

Maybe something around Bennett and one of Andersson, Fox, Kylington plus a salary dump? But I am not sure I like giving up Bennett even for a guy like Duchene who is relatively young and I think Treliving values him even more than me.

As for the Avs I want a proven, young NHL defenseman back as that is a brutal group they have now.

And yes I realize that contacting them doesn't mean all that much, especially when reported from Dreger.

 

[Fig]

http://www.tsn.ca/eight-teams-interested-in-avs-duchene-1.861434

Second time this offseason we've been linked with Duchene, although this time it's reported by Dreger so take it with a grain of salt.

Let's poke around this for a second.

Let's say a Duchene trade revolves around Valimaki. The only D position available for the next 3 seasons (currently) is LD and that's sitting around with TSpoon, Kulak and Kylington. It wouldn't be horribly painful to fill that role with one of those 3. Duchene is signed for 2 seasons. The upgrade to our top 9 would be insane. I'd assume we'd be able to unload salary onto Colorado to make the trade work.

Sure, likely this turns into a rental situation, but for 2 seasons, we'd have a pretty sick top 9.

If the goaltending tandem fails, it seems like we might be able to flip Lack+ to Detroit for Mrazek and gamble again.


This move has its own pros and cons

Pro
- Deeper roster to attempt to go all in for cup 2 seasons.

Cons
- Less quality young assets in pipeline means a potentially short window and dwelling in mediocrity.


I used to hate the idea of sending assets out, but now... I'd be fine if Tre acquired Duchene. I can see the reasoning behind such a deal.

 

[Flames Fanatic]

http://www.tsn.ca/eight-teams-interested-in-avs-duchene-1.861434

Second time this offseason we've been linked with Duchene, although this time it's reported by Dreger so take it with a grain of salt.

I'm fairly certain it's Treliving being Treliving and inquiring on everything to have an idea of the market. He's always on the phone just gauging things.

I really don't know what we would move for Duchene though, that's the bigggest kicker. Sakic has been repeatedly labelled as asking for the moon, and I certainly would like Duchene on the team, especially if we can send Brouwer back, but the cost is scary.

 

[Mobiandi]

Sakic probably wants Gaudreau, Brodie+

 

[Bjornar Moxnes]

I'd do Bennett and Kylington for Duchene. No to trading Valimaki. Even Bennett and Kylington is iffy for me. If Avs want Brodie, offer MacKinnon and Zadorov to begin the convo, to end the convo with deal, yeah add more...

 

[Baxterman]

Let's poke around this for a second.

Let's say a Duchene trade revolves around Valimaki. The only D position available for the next 3 seasons (currently) is LD and that's sitting around with TSpoon, Kulak and Kylington. It wouldn't be horribly painful to fill that role with one of those 3. Duchene is signed for 2 seasons. The upgrade to our top 9 would be insane. I'd assume we'd be able to unload salary onto Colorado to make the trade work.

Sure, likely this turns into a rental situation, but for 2 seasons, we'd have a pretty sick top 9.

If the goaltending tandem fails, it seems like we might be able to flip Lack+ to Detroit for Mrazek and gamble again.


This move has its own pros and cons

Pro
- Deeper roster to attempt to go all in for cup 2 seasons.

Cons
- Less quality young assets in pipeline means a potentially short window and dwelling in mediocrity.


I used to hate the idea of sending assets out, but now... I'd be fine if Tre acquired Duchene. I can see the reasoning behind such a deal.

I know he hasn't put up great number last year but this is a 26 year old forward who has made the last two Team Canada's. Now you may or may not value that but I think it says a lot about how Duchene is viewed around the league and I can't see how a deal relvolving around the 16th pick in a weak draft is going to be enough. I could certainly see Valimaki invovled but he would have to be the secondary piece.

 

[Fig]

I know he hasn't put up great number last year but this is a 26 year old forward who has made the last two Team Canada's. Now you may or may not value that but I think it says a lot about how Duchene is viewed around the league and I can't see how a deal relvolving around the 16th pick in a weak draft is going to be enough. I could certainly see Valimaki invovled but he would have to be the secondary piece.

Yup. But honestly speaking, would Treliving pay that type of price for Duchene? No. Values off for sure.

I'm not saying the trade is imminent. I'm saying idea wise if Treliving started selling the farm, I wouldn't be horribly alarmed.

 

[CraigsList]

I'd do Bennett and Kylington for Duchene. No to trading Valimaki. Even Bennett and Kylington is iffy for me. If Avs want Brodie, offer MacKinnon and Zadorov to begin the convo, to end the convo with deal, yeah add more...

I'm not trading Bennett until I see how he does this year. Duchene is getting overrated.

 

[Baxterman]

Yup. But honestly speaking, would Treliving pay that type of price for Duchene? No. Values off for sure.

I'm not saying the trade is imminent. I'm saying idea wise if Treliving started selling the farm, I wouldn't be horribly alarmed.

I am think that we a 95% not going to trade for Duchene. If for nothing else that would be a lot of turnover especially in terms of major pieces to bring in Hamonic, Duchene and Smith in one offseason.

That said we didn't give up 1st round picks to lose in the 1st round so if you are going for it then it a little makes sense to really go for it.

 

[djpatm]

I'm not trading Bennett until I see how he does this year. Duchene is getting overrated.

Might not be worth anything after this year though.

 

[Anglesmith]

I'm really not high on Duchene at all. I know changes of scenery can work sometimes, but for a guy to be that bad for a full season, I'm wary of his mental fortitude.

 

[djpatm]

I'm really not high on Duchene at all. I know changes of scenery can work sometimes, but for a guy to be that bad for a full season, I'm wary of his mental fortitude.

Sam Bennett just had an AHL calibre season so by that logic....

 

[Flames Fanatic]

http://www.tsn.ca/eight-teams-interested-in-avs-duchene-1.861434

Second time this offseason we've been linked with Duchene, although this time it's reported by Dreger so take it with a grain of salt.

I'm really not high on Duchene at all. I know changes of scenery can work sometimes, but for a guy to be that bad for a full season, I'm wary of his mental fortitude.

For me it's the contract. The chance of losing him for nothing is just way too high.

 

[Anglesmith]

Sam Bennett just had an AHL calibre season so by that logic....

Sam Bennett was in his second pro season, and is 22 years old. He is still in a developmental up-swing. Matt Duchene is not. They aren't very comparable.

That said, even if you did want to compare them just in terms of having bad seasons last year, that's exactly why we signed Bennett to a two year, $1.95M deal. Not the case if we're taking on Duchene.

 

[InfinityIggy]

I would offer Valimaki + another prospect. Never been all that high on Duchene. That said he would really bolster our top 6.

 

[Calculon]

Don't see the Flames as having the pieces necessary to attain Duchene, nor being able to re-sign him when the time comes.

So hopefully this is just Treliving being Treliving doing his homework and not him getting desperate. This upcoming season already has enough similarities to 2009-2010.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

I think when you look at the Avs blue line, a prospect like Fox or Valimaki would be a pretty good starting point.
I'd do something around Fox for Duchene only because Fox isn't under contract. Although that shouldn't be a concern. Can't see him playing 4 years of college.

Fox + Shink.

Bennett Duchene on the third line could be the recipe to a cup IMO. Fox could turn out to be a star though. Definitely risky.

 

[Mr Snrub]

Duchene is a decent player but so, so overrated. I'd do something like Valimaki straight up for him, but little beyond that. I said this the last time we were beating this horse, but I think if Bennett had the opportunities and deployment last year that Duchene did, he would've outproduced him while being about as good defensively.

 

[Baxterman]

Duchene is a decent player but so, so overrated. I'd do something like Valimaki straight up for him, but little beyond that. I said this the last time we were beating this horse, but I think if Bennett had the opportunities and deployment last year that Duchene did, he would've outproduced him while being about as good defensively.

Decent player? He is a hell of a lot better than that.

Would you trade Backlund for Liljegren? If not why would Colorado give Duchene away for Valimaki?

 

[Mr Snrub]

Decent player? He is a hell of a lot better than that.

Would you trade Backlund for Liljegren? If not why would Colorado give Duchene away for Valimaki?

I personally wouldn't, but a mid first is probably what Backlund would've demanded if we'd traded him at last year's draft.

Duchene is several years removed from being a real offensive force, cannot play defense, has a bad attitude, is overpaid, and has failed miserably after being asked to lead for his team. To me, considering he doesn't fill a legitimate need for this team (can play RW, rarely does), he's not worth any more than a B prospect, a second line player, or (if we still had one) a second round pick.

 

[djpatm]

As crazy as it sounds, I'd have a hard time trading Backlund for 1st OA depending on the draft.

Players like him are so hard to develop.

 

[CraigsList]

As crazy as it sounds, I'd have a hard time trading Backlund for 1st OA depending on the draft.

Players like him are so hard to develop.

Last 5 1st OAs:

2013 MacKinnon
2014 Ekblad
2015 McDavid
2016 Matthews
2017 Hischier

Bye bye Backlund. If a team wanted Backlund THAT badly for 1st OA, Treliving would be crazy not to say no.

 

[djpatm]

Last 5 1st OAs:

2013 MacKinnon
2014 Ekblad
2015 McDavid
2016 Matthews
2017 Hischier

Bye bye Backlund. If a team wanted Backlund THAT badly for 1st OA, Treliving would be crazy not to say no.

I get it. I'm just biased as Backlund is my favorite Flame. It'd be really hard to look past the hype of every first overall (besides this draft). But with hindsight it really depends on if Backlund can keep taking steps towards that Selke trophy and how MacKinnon, Ekblad and Hischer perform in the next few years.

Ekblad and more so MacKinnon get free passes all the time for being on a bad team but Backlund makes all the bad players he's saddled with better. "Career year, make borderline NHL'ers look like top 6 players" better. That's a rare quality.

 

[CraigsList]

I get it. I'm just biased as Backlund is my favorite Flame. It'd be really hard to look past the hype of every first overall (besides this draft). But with hindsight it really depends on if Backlund can keep taking steps towards that Selke trophy and how MacKinnon, Ekblad and Hischer perform in the next few years.

Ekblad and more so MacKinnon get free passes all the time for being on a bad team but Backlund makes all the bad players he's saddled with better. "Career year, make borderline NHL'ers look like top 6 players" better. That's a rare quality.

Absolutely. I will be really sad if Backlund leaves us for money in UFA. But I don't see him doing that, he's been a loyal guy to the organization.