Speculation: Anthony Cirelli offer sheet

[NjdevilfanJim]

He's RFA after this season. A great two way player and has 39 points in 54 games. How's the cap situation in Tampa? Could you see some team making a move on him? I love the guy and if i was a GM (which i will no doubt be some day) i would have no problem paying 6-7 million for him.

He is a good player and ups his intensity in playoffs but no way I'd pay him 7 mil more like 3 to 3.5 for next deal seems like the more normal progression

 

[AndreRoy]

Killer is not going anywhere nor is Johnny the other two perhaps. But I doubt any of the 4 move. The vampire on the roster is going to be Point. That bridge contract they gave him will be a death nail to him in Tampa. There will be no way they can sign him after that contract and remain a cup threat. It would be in the teams long term interest to cash out on Point in the offseason. This would provide the cap they need going forward for a few more years. If they can find a home for Palat as well all the better Cirelli is ready for more responsibility as are Verhaeghe and Stephens who are young and will be cost controlled for a while yet. Getting Segi and Cernak signed will be more important than what Points next two years will be worth because hes gone with next contract anyway. Does it hurt you bet but From what we have seen in Cirelli he can and will step up into Points place and do just as well. and Point will bring a good return.

ZERO chance we move Point. Are you insane? LMAO at the thought of us keeping Killorn and trading Point.

 

[DarthProbert]

I'd give 6-7 million to Cirelli in a heartbeat. People scoffing at that either overrate draft picks or don't understand how valuable Cirelli is.

Or don't understand that the whole premise of an offer sheet is to offer more than the player's current team is willing to pay. I think 90% of the posters here think the Lightning are just supposed to back off if an offer sheet is for a fair salary and nothing more.

 

[Whileee]

Bolts' problem is that most of their bigger contract players have full no trade clauses for next year, including Johnson, Gourde, and Palat.

Killorn would likely have to be traded to fit both Sergachev and Cirelli under the cap, and they would still have a tough challenge. Killorn can submit a 16-team trade list, which will limit trade options, but he is a strong player on a good contract.

If they trade Killorn for futures they would have about 16M in cap space to sign Sergachev and Cirelli and fill another 7 roster spots. Assume they fill the other roster spots at around 900K each and they would have about 10M to sign Sergachev and Cirelli.

 

[JoVel]

ZERO chance we move Point. Are you insane? LMAO at the thought of us keeping Killorn and trading Point.

Yeah, that's f***ing dumb. Trade Point to keep Killorn and Johnson.... lol

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

Would have no problem giving him a 5-6 year deal just under $4,227 million then.

...but why would Cirelli sign that? If he got a 3-year extension like Point, then he's almost certainly guaranteed more than that AAV on the contract that follows if he continues the way he has. If you want him to leave a nearly-every-year threat in the playoffs, I think you have to offer him considerably more money on average than we could (hence the 7 million talk on the previous page).

 

[Smartguy]

The only challenge I remember being talked about for Carolina matching was the real cash paid out in bonuses. We'd actually be squeezed pretty hard if Cirelli was offered 7m AAV for 5 or less years (compensation of only 1st+2nd+3rd) depending on who made the offer sheet.

Is the main 1st in an offersheet the same 1st as the year the OS is offered in or do those picks begin for the following years? I'd assume the former.

EDIT: And for what it's worth, our only really bad contract at this point is, I think, Yanni Gourde.

Well you can’t OS till July 1 so it’s the following June draft pick. On bad contracts I was more saying I presume if it came down to it they would move out players like Palat and Killorn ETC. to make it fit

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

Well you can’t OS till July 1 so it’s the following June draft pick. On bad contracts I was more saying I presume if it came down to it they would move out players like Palat and Killorn ETC. to make it fit

Thanks for filling me in--I couldn't remember and CBA to look up the order of events in the summer. Worst case scenario we move Killorn (who should not be a problem moving) and buyout Palat (or maybe he or another player waives if the org. tells everyone that's what's going to happen).

 

[Byrddog]

ZERO chance we move Point. Are you insane? LMAO at the thought of us keeping Killorn and trading Point.

I did not imply that it was going to be done only it would be the smart thing to do. Please feel free to give me a scenario where Point can be re signed after this bridge. He will garner 9 to 10 mil. Selling off Killer, Palat, Johnny in order to sign Sergi long term and a bridge to Cirelli and Cernak that will expire at the same time Point is due another 3 mil. You must extend your window as long as possible. Am I insane perhaps I like point as much as any player on the team not named Kuch or Vasi but to sacrifice him in order to keep the remaining veterans in play is only prudent. Otherwise you become a Blackhawks team with Kane and Towes and 9 other forwards making 1.5 mil or less and a poor D. Is that where this organization really wants to go again?

 

[Smartguy]

Thanks for filling me in--I couldn't remember and CBA to look up the order of events in the summer. Worst case scenario we move Killorn (who should not be a problem moving) and buyout Palat (or maybe he or another player waives if the org. tells everyone that's what's going to happen).

I’m not as familiar with TB, how is the cap looking this summer with Vasy, Point, Kuch, Stamkos all having big tickets on the books for the next year? Cirelli will get a substantial raise. I think first and foremost they would love to move Johnson but I don’t think there will be a tonne of takers. If Cirelli ends up on a bridge around 4-5 do they still need to cut cap? I also didn’t realize that Sergachev is also up this offseason, yikes

 

[HoseEmDown]

I did not imply that it was going to be done only it would be the smart thing to do. Please feel free to give me a scenario where Point can be re signed after this bridge. He will garner 9 to 10 mil. Selling off Killer, Palat, Johnny in order to sign Sergi long term and a bridge to Cirelli and Cernak that will expire at the same time Point is due another 3 mil. You must extend your window as long as possible. Am I insane perhaps I like point as much as any player on the team not named Kuch or Vasi but to sacrifice him in order to keep the remaining veterans in play is only prudent. Otherwise you become a Blackhawks team with Kane and Towes and 9 other forwards making 1.5 mil or less and a poor D. Is that where this organization really wants to go again?

Scenario 1 is that he is already making 6.75 so if he gets 9-10 that's only 2.25-3.25 raise. The cap alone should go up by that in each year.

Scenario 2 is that Palat comes off the books when Point needs a raise. Killorn, Johnson and Gourde all have modified NTC that summer or prior. The expansion draft will have taken place in that time.

So there's really no chance that Point is going anywhere as we will have the money to keep him. Unless he wants like 13+ we can afford it. Stamkos will be 33 that year and would have just two years left on his deal, Point is already the future and will be especially at that time when Stamkos is nearing an end.

 

[TheImpatientPanther]

...but why would Cirelli sign that? If he got a 3-year extension like Point, then he's almost certainly guaranteed more than that AAV on the contract that follows if he continues the way he has. If you want him to leave a nearly-every-year threat in the playoffs, I think you have to offer him considerably more money on average than we could (hence the 7 million talk on the previous page).

Didn't say he would sign it but a team with deep pockets would offer up the majority of it in SB like MON did with Aho, who got a $11.3 million dollar SB this year and rocking a 700-750k NHL salary all 5 years. $9.87 million next year, $6.95 million and the final two years at $5.25 million

The first 3 years pay Cirelli a $6.25 million signing bonus and minimum NHL salary the whole 5 years.
5 years takes him to 27 years old, straight to free agency.

Maybe with the cap going up, the compensation will too so I forgot to take that into account as well but definitely misjudged my numbers a bit

 

[Byrddog]

Scenario 1 is that he is already making 6.75 so if he gets 9-10 that's only 2.25-3.25 raise. The cap alone should go up by that in each year.

Scenario 2 is that Palat comes off the books when Point needs a raise. Killorn, Johnson and Gourde all have modified NTC that summer or prior. The expansion draft will have taken place in that time.

So there's really no chance that Point is going anywhere as we will have the money to keep him. Unless he wants like 13+ we can afford it. Stamkos will be 33 that year and would have just two years left on his deal, Point is already the future and will be especially at that time when Stamkos is nearing an end.

Just with all scenarios this does not include other players that are going to need contracts that year Cernak, Cerilli again Stephens and Verhaghe most likely all in that year alone. now assuming that the cap increases the pitiful 2 mil over the next three that just 6 moving Palat and Killer frees up 10 so you have 16 mil for Cernak who replaces McDonagh in the top4 your 2C Cirelli along with the two guys your going to replace Killer and Palat with your still going to be 5 mil short at a minimum. And this assumes Cernak and Cirelli get 7 mil each after these bridges There is a cap reckoning coming. Like it or not I would just prefer to invest in the remainder of the team to continue to be competitive for a cup rather than hold on to a guy that in two years will be short sighted.

 

[AndreRoy]

Didn't say he would sign it but a team with deep pockets would offer up the majority of it in SB like MON did with Aho, who got a $11.3 million dollar SB this year and rocking a 700-750k NHL salary all 5 years. $9.87 million next year, $6.95 million and the final two years at $5.25 million

The first 3 years pay Cirelli a $6.25 million signing bonus and minimum NHL salary the whole 5 years.
5 years takes him to 27 years old, straight to free agency.

Maybe with the cap going up, the compensation will too so I forgot to take that into account as well but definitely misjudged my numbers a bit

Vinik’s pockets are as deep as anyone’s and he has no problem reaching into them. This isn’t the old days when every Tampa owner in every sport was a cheapskate.

 

[Rschmitz]

Hey, hands off

 

[Zwui21]

Killer is not going anywhere nor is Johnny the other two perhaps

That's false. Either Killorn or Johnson will be moved this offseason otherwise we won't have enough cap space to re-sign Cirelli, Sergy and Cernak.
Palat won't be traded because he's been amazing this season and JBB isn't gonna trade Gourde at his all time low in term of market value.
If Johnson doesn't waive his NTC this offseason, Killorn will be on his way out.

That bridge contract they gave him will be a death nail to him in Tampa. There will be no way they can sign him after that contract and remain a cup threat. It would be in the teams long term interest to cash out on Point in the offseason

Lmao what are you taking about? Point will be up to get re-signed when Palat and Johnson will be gone and Gourde will have a M-NTC of 16 teams. Tampa won't have any problem re-signing him.

From what we have seen in Cirelli he can and will step up into Points place and do just as well. and Point will bring a good return.

1) You don't trade your 1C that is signed to a great bridge contract. When he'll be up for re-signing he'll fetch 11M and it's okay. Tampa will have freed all the cap space from the 5M gang (Johnson, Palat and Gourde) and it won't cause any problems. Salary cap will also go up quite a lot by then, with the new tv rights deal coming in 2021 and the Seattle expansion draft.
Paying good money to keep your elite players is okay, what you don't have to do is overpay your bottom six.
2) Point and Cirelli are two different kind of players. Point is way more gifted offensively, while still being great defensively. Cirelli is one of the best defensive forwards in this league already and is also good (but not close to being as good as Point) offensively.

Point won't go anywhere, he'll stay in Tampa for a long time. And so will Cirelli, Sergachev and Cernak.

People suggesting an offersheet haven't been paying attention. The players want to stay in Tampa because they know they'll get good money on their second deal, while being on a perennial contender + living in one of the best places with an NHL team.
Who the f*** in their right mind would leave Tampa for a shittier team, only for a tad bit higher paycheck? Players don't only value money you fools

 

[EichHart]

He's exactly the player the Sabres need.

 

[is the answer jesus]

Or don't understand that the whole premise of an offer sheet is to offer more than the player's current team is willing to pay. I think 90% of the posters here think the Lightning are just supposed to back off if an offer sheet is for a fair salary and nothing more.

Agreed. It makes it much easier on TB if you give an offersheet to Cirelli that's "fair salary". Are they going to let a great young player just entering his prime walk for a 2nd round pick? No way. They'll move heaven and earth before they let that happen.

 

[JackFr]

Everyone in this thread except the Lightning fans have absolutely no idea how good Anthony Cirelli is. He is EASILY worth 7 million and would be a very smart offer sheet target. Kid is the new Sean Couturier.

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

Didn't say he would sign it but a team with deep pockets would offer up the majority of it in SB like MON did with Aho, who got a $11.3 million dollar SB this year and rocking a 700-750k NHL salary all 5 years. $9.87 million next year, $6.95 million and the final two years at $5.25 million

The first 3 years pay Cirelli a $6.25 million signing bonus and minimum NHL salary the whole 5 years.
5 years takes him to 27 years old, straight to free agency.

Maybe with the cap going up, the compensation will too so I forgot to take that into account as well but definitely misjudged my numbers a bit

Do you think Tampa doesn't have deep pockets? We can pay any frontloaded contract structure a team can come up with.

At some point you have to figure out whether the total amount of money paid on that OS plus the free agent contract he signs at 27 would be greater than signing a 2-3 year extension with us plus an 8-year extension afterwards--and that's just gross pay. For the foreseeable future he can at least rest relatively easy that he'll make it to the first round (har har) if he stays in Tampa. If we expand the scope of OS possibilities beyond Florida, then we have to take into account tax differences and weather, too!

He's exactly the player the Sabres need.

I doubt the potential cost is getting lower any time soon.

 

[RedWingzz]

If Cirelli were put up for trade he’d fetch a hell of a lot more than that. Not to mention we’d have zero interest in Glendening, who wouldn’t even make our roster.

I agree with you that Tampa wouldn't even consider this trade and that the value is way off. I think you are sleeping on Glendening a bit though. He's a solid depth guy that works hard, can PK and wins faceoffs. He'd make your roster, he's better than Paquette and Mitch Stephens.

 

[AndreRoy]

I agree with you that Tampa wouldn't even consider this trade and that the value is way off. I think you are sleeping on Glendening a bit though. He's a solid depth guy that works hard, can PK and wins faceoffs. He'd make your roster, he's better than Paquette and Mitch Stephens.

He’s definitely not better than Paquette. Stephens is debatable but he’s a rookie with the potential to improve, several more years of control, and costs about $1M less. Glendening doesn’t kick either of them off the roster.

 

[Whileee]

Just with all scenarios this does not include other players that are going to need contracts that year Cernak, Cerilli again Stephens and Verhaghe most likely all in that year alone. now assuming that the cap increases the pitiful 2 mil over the next three that just 6 moving Palat and Killer frees up 10 so you have 16 mil for Cernak who replaces McDonagh in the top4 your 2C Cirelli along with the two guys your going to replace Killer and Palat with your still going to be 5 mil short at a minimum. And this assumes Cernak and Cirelli get 7 mil each after these bridges There is a cap reckoning coming. Like it or not I would just prefer to invest in the remainder of the team to continue to be competitive for a cup rather than hold on to a guy that in two years will be short sighted.

How do you move Palat? He has a full no-trade clause until 2021/22. Do you think he'll waive it? Seems unlikely. They could trade Killorn and get some cap relief there. But if Cirelli signed a $6M offer sheet, the Bolts would have a hard time matching and still re-sign Sergachev.

 

[2020 Cup Champions]

How do you move Palat? He has a full no-trade clause until 2021/22. Do you think he'll waive it? Seems unlikely. They could trade Killorn and get some cap relief there. But if Cirelli signed a $6M offer sheet, the Bolts would have a hard time matching and still re-sign Sergachev.

You tell him he can either accept a buyout or consider waiving for a trade. Otherwise, yes, moving him is a problem. Regarding the $6M OS, who is offering it and for how many years?

 

[TheImpatientPanther]

Vinik’s pockets are as deep as anyone’s and he has no problem reaching into them. This isn’t the old days when every Tampa owner in every sport was a cheapskate.

Do you think Tampa doesn't have deep pockets? We can pay any frontloaded contract structure a team can come up with.

At some point you have to figure out whether the total amount of money paid on that OS plus the free agent contract he signs at 27 would be greater than signing a 2-3 year extension with us plus an 8-year extension afterwards--and that's just gross pay. For the foreseeable future he can at least rest relatively easy that he'll make it to the first round (har har) if he stays in Tampa. If we expand the scope of OS possibilities beyond Florida, then we have to take into account tax differences and weather, too!

Wasn't saying your owner isn't rich enough but he is in the bottom tier of net worth for owners, just for the record.
He can make the same amount if he comes to FLA, wouldn't have to leave the tax bracket or weather either, some GM's may try it if he keeps up this pace.
He's as good as gone, you two are sweating it already
Great player though, don't see how TB doesn't move other older plays to keep both Point, Serg and Cirelli etc around long-term.