Andrew Ladd

Puckatron 3000

Glitchy Prototype
Feb 4, 2014
6,357
4,168
Offensive Zone
If we make the playoffs this year does that improve the chances of Ladd signing an extension in Winnipeg?

This is something that is way overlooked in the tank thread (which has mercifully died as of late). It is true being a perennial mediocre below-the-playoff-line team is a horrible spot to be in. But if we can make a decent showing of ourselves, even in just the first round of the post season, that does wonders for the team morale, and the desirability of playing (and resigning) for the Jets.
 

mcpw

WPG
Jan 13, 2015
10,024
2,072
If Ladd wants to win the cup, a first step would be to stop being broken all the time.
 

Aavco Cup

"I can make you cry in this room"
Sep 5, 2013
37,630
10,440
If Ladd wants to win the cup, a first step would be to stop being broken all the time.

He's only missed 5 games in his 4 years in Winnipeg and played 81 his last year in Atlanta. And the game he missed last season was after the Jets had clinched. Where is this coming from?
 

scelaton

Registered User
Jul 5, 2012
3,659
5,612
He's only missed 5 games in his 4 years in Winnipeg and played 81 his last year in Atlanta. And the game he missed last season was after the Jets had clinched. Where is this coming from?

How many practices did he miss since beginning of the year?

Aavco is right on this one. Ladd had a sports hernia, a tear of the inner tissue lining of the abdominal wall, which is only fixed by surgery. He missed practices to allow him to play the actual games through the pain. Calling someone with Ladd's record of grit and longevity "broken all the time" is just plain wrong.
 
Last edited:

YWGinYYZ

Registered User
Jul 3, 2011
28,480
7,117
Toronto
^ yet he's broken again.

Hasn't missed a regular season game this season. ;)

Seriously: before his hernia, the guy was an iron-man - he went for years without being sidelined. Last year, he played through a hernia, and mainly missed practices.

And "again" would infer that he's broken all the time - this is likely still recovery related from same injury. PS: we're OT for this thread - should probably take it to the Ladd / Buff thread, or to Ladd's player thread instead.
 
Last edited:

Aavco Cup

"I can make you cry in this room"
Sep 5, 2013
37,630
10,440
^ yet he's broken again.

Which means what exactly? And how could he possibly change it? It's not like he intentionally injured himself.It sounds like if it was regular season he wouldn't have missed any time at all. The precaution seems to be the head coach and training staff not the player.
 

Jets

All hat, no cattle.
Sponsor
Oct 23, 2010
3,723
3,322
Winnipeg
Hasn't missed a regular season game this season. ;)

Seriously: before his hernia, the guy was an iron-man - he went for years without being sidelined. Last year, he played through a hernia, and mainly missed practices.

And "again" would infer that he's broken all the time - this is likely still recovery related from same injury.

but to be fair, he was awful playing through it. He was marginally better than having Thorburn out there.
 

mcpw

WPG
Jan 13, 2015
10,024
2,072
Which means what exactly? And how could he possibly change it? It's not like he intentionally injured himself.It sounds like if it was regular season he wouldn't have missed any time at all. The precaution seems to be the head coach and training staff not the player.
I'm not bashing him. Just noting the fact that the last time he was at 100% was probably last November or something, and that it's really hard to win a cup that way.
 

Halloween Jack

A real cool cat.
Sep 16, 2013
557
6
On top of Manhattan Chase
I'm not bashing him. Just noting the fact that the last time he was at 100% was probably last November or something, and that it's really hard to win a cup that way.

I've gotta agree. Just because he played doesn't mean he wasn't "broken." A healthy Ladd last year would have made a huge difference, but same with Little, Buff, Trouba, Perreault...
 

YWGinYYZ

Registered User
Jul 3, 2011
28,480
7,117
Toronto
I've gotta agree. Just because he played doesn't mean he wasn't "broken." A healthy Ladd last year would have made a huge difference, but same with Little, Buff, Trouba, Perreault...

Is a "broken" Ladd worth more than a "healthy" Cormier? I'd still take a hobbled Ladd. Not sure if there were any other options at that point. In any event - the discussion started with how many games Ladd has missed, not how effective he is / was when battling through an injury. That's all I was commenting on, personally.
 

Halloween Jack

A real cool cat.
Sep 16, 2013
557
6
On top of Manhattan Chase
Is a "broken" Ladd worth more than a "healthy" Cormier? I'd still take a hobbled Ladd. Not sure if there were any other options at that point. In any event - the discussion started with how many games Ladd has missed, not how effective he is / was when battling through an injury. That's all I was commenting on, personally.

Of course a hurt Ladd is better than a healthy Cormier. A hurt Ladd for five months really sucked last year is what I was agreeing with. With all of the other question marks this year our top guns had better not be playing hurt for half the season or we may be in big trouble.
 

scelaton

Registered User
Jul 5, 2012
3,659
5,612
I'm not bashing him. Just noting the fact that the last time he was at 100% was probably last November or something, and that it's really hard to win a cup that way.
Sure you are and I am not sure why.
Ladd played 81 games last year and was 13th overall in points for left wingers. One more point and he would have been in the top 10 for points. I guess if he weren't "broken all the time" he could have been top 5....?
He has obviously not missed any regular season games this year and allowing his injured tissue to heal a little more post-op is nothing more than a sensible coaching decision.
You could argue that Buff, Enstrom, Perreault, Kane and Bogo before they were traded, even Trouba are injury prone. But Ladd.....no, not with only one significant injury in the last 5+ years.
 

Thai jet*

Registered User
Oct 23, 2014
2,489
0
Thailand
Ladd

The Captain is not himself.

Is the weight of the team's performance weighing heavily on him?

Is he hurt?

Is the growing family sapping his energy?

Is "the room" supporting him?

Is there a division between himself and coaching?

I am not calling him out, but I haven't seen the usual "beast-sized heart" from him for about the last 15 games. Neither am I blaming him for team performance.

Honestly, I'm just wondering if he's ok. You couldn't help but see how dispirited he was on the tv interview the other night.






Ladd seems like a pretty moody guy at times. Breakup LLW and it really comes out. I have seen him as more of a member of a very cliquish core on this team than as a leader or the leader. It makes me wonder if having been the intruder of that threesome Fro felt he didn't fit in here. If that was the case I would get rid of Ladd yesterday. This team has had way too many off ice issues go unresolved for too long to not look for a new captain.
 

Derfel*

Guest
Ladd seems like a pretty moody guy at times. Breakup LLW and it really comes out. I have seen him as more of a member of a very cliquish core on this team than as a leader or the leader. It makes me wonder if having been the intruder of that threesome Fro felt he didn't fit in here. If that was the case I would get rid of Ladd yesterday. This team has had way too many off ice issues go unresolved for too long to not look for a new captain.

Any source or proof of these allegations?
 

razorsedge

Registered User
Oct 19, 2006
5,240
4,832
Ladd's time in Winnipeg is coming to an eventual end. Just wish it could be sooner so the Jets can begin a new leadership era with Blake Wheeler as captain.
 

powder88

Registered User
Nov 21, 2013
449
159
I think it boils down to a few keys points that can be bucketed into past, present and future categories:

-Ladd was a fantastic leader for the relocated franchise in Winnipeg. He came here that offseason and committed to a long term deal with the team. Since then, he has been one of the team's top performers, both in fancy and counting stats. We could scarcely have asked for more from him, given the player he was.

-Today, he is having a poor year and I suspect he would tell you the same. Both his fancy and counting stats are off of their traditional levels. Whether that is injury, age, luck, or a combination of all three is impossible to know, but the fact remains that that is the player we are seeing today. The degree to which the Jets are able to determine the relative contributions of those factors will be critically important in assessing the next section...

-The most important things for Jets fans and management is the player that Ladd will be tomorrow; both literally (as in "against the Red Wings") and figuratively (as in "over the next six and a half seasons"). Presumably, the person and leader that Ladd is has not changed and will not change over the foreseeable future. I'm not sure how to value that, but it is not zero.

Since time only moves in one direction, I feel I'm safe in saying that he will continue to get older (although some here may disagree ;)); and with that age will come a degradation in his play. The questions, of course, are "what is the baseline from which he declines?" and "what will be his rate of decline?".

Only the Jets and Ladd can know his health situation, so I will not address it here.

All of this is to say that the only thing the Jets can consider going forward are those elements in this third section. The player Ladd was and, to a lesser extent, is, are barely relevant for the decision about what to do with him going forward. It is only the player he will be that matters.

If he natural starting point lies somewhere between he player he was last year (Ryan Kessler at $7.8 million salary in the first year of his new deal) and the player he is this year (I'm struggling for a comparable here...maybe $5 million) let's say Year 1 of a new deal splits the difference at $6.4.

Everthing I have heard (ok...everything Lawless has said) suggests they are looking at a 6 (gulp) year deal. If that's the case and you start at 6.4, the $$$ would have to go 6.4, 6.2, 6.0, 5.8, 5.4, 4.8 for an AAV of $5.77, for me to start feeling comfortable and even then, I think we are on the high end. If his actual starting level of play is what we are seeing this year, virtually no aging curve will make that contract look good.
 

ps241

The Ballad of Ville Bobby
Sponsor
Mar 10, 2010
34,907
31,390
I think it boils down to a few keys points that can be bucketed into past, present and future categories:

-Ladd was a fantastic leader for the relocated franchise in Winnipeg. He came here that offseason and committed to a long term deal with the team. Since then, he has been one of the team's top performers, both in fancy and counting stats. We could scarcely have asked for more from him, given the player he was.

-Today, he is having a poor year and I suspect he would tell you the same. Both his fancy and counting stats are off of their traditional levels. Whether that is injury, age, luck, or a combination of all three is impossible to know, but the fact remains that that is the player we are seeing today. The degree to which the Jets are able to determine the relative contributions of those factors will be critically important in assessing the next section...

-The most important things for Jets fans and management is the player that Ladd will be tomorrow; both literally (as in "against the Red Wings") and figuratively (as in "over the next six and a half seasons"). Presumably, the person and leader that Ladd is has not changed and will not change over the foreseeable future. I'm not sure how to value that, but it is not zero.

Since time only moves in one direction, I feel I'm safe in saying that he will continue to get older (although some here may disagree ;)); and with that age will come a degradation in his play. The questions, of course, are "what is the baseline from which he declines?" and "what will be his rate of decline?".

Only the Jets and Ladd can know his health situation, so I will not address it here.

All of this is to say that the only thing the Jets can consider going forward are those elements in this third section. The player Ladd was and, to a lesser extent, is, are barely relevant for the decision about what to do with him going forward. It is only the player he will be that matters.

If he natural starting point lies somewhere between he player he was last year (Ryan Kessler at $7.8 million salary in the first year of his new deal) and the player he is this year (I'm struggling for a comparable here...maybe $5 million) let's say Year 1 of a new deal splits the difference at $6.4.

Everthing I have heard (ok...everything Lawless has said) suggests they are looking at a 6 (gulp) year deal. If that's the case and you start at 6.4, the $$$ would have to go 6.4, 6.2, 6.0, 5.8, 5.4, 4.8 for an AAV of $5.77, for me to start feeling comfortable and even then, I think we are on the high end. If his actual starting level of play is what we are seeing this year, virtually no aging curve will make that contract look good.

Yea you nailed it.

I have really enjoyed Ladd's run especially the strike shortened year which was his peak.

I have zero idea what the future holds but I hate rich pay me for yesterday deals with 30 year olds. It could work out ok but if it doesn't we are jammed up and his game is a tad rugged to bet on the long play despite his incredible durability and ability to play through pain in his 20's.

I just look at Dustin Brown and Ryan Kesler and there aren't many examples of in your face guys where age is that kind to them. Andrew needs his speed to the puck to be most effective with his style which is relentless pressure especially in the attack and neutral zones.

It really bites to have blown off his prime years.
 

KingBogo

Admitted Homer
Nov 29, 2011
31,717
39,964
Winnipeg
I think it boils down to a few keys points that can be bucketed into past, present and future categories:

-Ladd was a fantastic leader for the relocated franchise in Winnipeg. He came here that offseason and committed to a long term deal with the team. Since then, he has been one of the team's top performers, both in fancy and counting stats. We could scarcely have asked for more from him, given the player he was.

-Today, he is having a poor year and I suspect he would tell you the same. Both his fancy and counting stats are off of their traditional levels. Whether that is injury, age, luck, or a combination of all three is impossible to know, but the fact remains that that is the player we are seeing today. The degree to which the Jets are able to determine the relative contributions of those factors will be critically important in assessing the next section...

-The most important things for Jets fans and management is the player that Ladd will be tomorrow; both literally (as in "against the Red Wings") and figuratively (as in "over the next six and a half seasons"). Presumably, the person and leader that Ladd is has not changed and will not change over the foreseeable future. I'm not sure how to value that, but it is not zero.

Since time only moves in one direction, I feel I'm safe in saying that he will continue to get older (although some here may disagree ;)); and with that age will come a degradation in his play. The questions, of course, are "what is the baseline from which he declines?" and "what will be his rate of decline?".

Only the Jets and Ladd can know his health situation, so I will not address it here.

All of this is to say that the only thing the Jets can consider going forward are those elements in this third section. The player Ladd was and, to a lesser extent, is, are barely relevant for the decision about what to do with him going forward. It is only the player he will be that matters.

If he natural starting point lies somewhere between he player he was last year (Ryan Kessler at $7.8 million salary in the first year of his new deal) and the player he is this year (I'm struggling for a comparable here...maybe $5 million) let's say Year 1 of a new deal splits the difference at $6.4.

Everthing I have heard (ok...everything Lawless has said) suggests they are looking at a 6 (gulp) year deal. If that's the case and you start at 6.4, the $$$ would have to go 6.4, 6.2, 6.0, 5.8, 5.4, 4.8 for an AAV of $5.77, for me to start feeling comfortable and even then, I think we are on the high end. If his actual starting level of play is what we are seeing this year, virtually no aging curve will make that contract look good.

Good post. And agreed even an AAV of 5.77 X 6 years is too much and too long. Time to move on and wish our captain all the best.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad