Andrew Barroway to buy 51% of the Coyotes (Done, Pending BOG Approval)

[Llama19]

Part Deux

The Globe and Mail article, Arizona Coyotes owners pan for gold in river of red ink!

Source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...for-gold-in-river-of-red-ink/article21489565/

 

[hisgirlfriday]

Not surprised Barroway didn't comment for a piece like this, but got me thinking... has Barroway given an interview to anybody?

 

[Fugu]

Not surprised Barroway didn't comment for a piece like this, but got me thinking... has Barroway given an interview to anybody?

About the Yotes situation? No.

Part Deux

The Globe and Mail article, Arizona Coyotes owners pan for gold in river of red ink!

Source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...for-gold-in-river-of-red-ink/article21489565/

I'm not sure he really added any new info in this second piece. It seems like he's speculating about the incentive to Barroway which includes a lot of ideas we've dredged here, and obviously that relocation is in the cards in a few years.

 

[TheLegend]

Part Deux

The Globe and Mail article, Arizona Coyotes owners pan for gold in river of red ink!

Source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...for-gold-in-river-of-red-ink/article21489565/

Yeah.... quite a yarn Shoalts spun there.

Interesting at the end where he asserts Gosbee and LeBlanc were quoted a $60 million relocation fee amount from Bettman. As if there was a possibliity of IceArizona buying and moving the franchise immediately.

I'm not sure he really added any new info in this second piece. It seems like he's speculating about the incentive to Barroway which includes a lot of ideas we've dredged here, and obviously that relocation is in the cards in a few years.

Maybe.... but Shoalts is also hedging his bet by hinting there are other franchises closer to relo than the Coyotes.

He tries to create the appearance that everything he's writing is factual... but in reality he's making a lot of the same presumptions everyone else is.

 

[XX]

Part Deux

The Globe and Mail article, Arizona Coyotes owners pan for gold in river of red ink!

Source: http://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...for-gold-in-river-of-red-ink/article21489565/

All of that for this

This does not mean the Coyotes are a slam-dunk to move, since Bettman would rather see them stay for strategic reasons to do with television markets and division alignments. And if they do move and Barroway elects to keep the team rather than flip it, it may not be the easy score it seems.

When Gosbee and LeBlanc bought the team in 2013, a relocation fee was discussed. Bettman wanted to make it part of the sale agreement at a minimum of $60-million (what the Winnipeg Jets owners paid) but with the condition the fee would be based on the team’s new market. There was no ceiling on the fee, which meant it could run into hundreds of millions of dollars if a particularly desirable market was the target.

This never made it into the final purchase agreement, but Barroway needs to remember it will come up again.

Team won't move unless the city makes it impossible to operate the team there, or if Bettman has a change of heart. Simple as that. Expansion is worth too much to the other owners.

 

[Fugu]

Maybe.... but Shoalts is also hedging his bet by hinting there are other franchises closer to relo than the Coyotes.

He tries to create the appearance that everything he's writing is factual... but in reality he's making a lot of the same presumptions everyone else is.

Yes, I agree. Every time there's a suggestion that relocation is an incentive, I'm reminded of the BK trial where the NHL attorneys made the case that relocation would incur additional fees, which we saw come to fruition in the Atlanta move.

It's not some flat fee of $60 MM, but the difference in values between the market being left behind and the new one. That money gets divvied up.

 

[Confucius]

Is there another business anywhere that has been around for a hundred years and suggests there are better markets available but they choose to ignore them? Strange, to say the least.

 

[kmad]

Is there another business anywhere that has been around for a hundred years and suggests there are better markets available but they choose to ignore them? Strange, to say the least.

I think the NHL probably has higher barriers to entry than other types of business.

 

[Fugu]

Is there another business anywhere that has been around for a hundred years and suggests there are better markets available but they choose to ignore them? Strange, to say the least.

This has often been said about the NFL's lack of presence in LA.

 

[HamiltonFan]

Is there another business anywhere that has been around for a hundred years and suggests there are better markets available but they choose to ignore them? Strange, to say the least.

They don't just ignore them, they actually spend money and resources to actively keep teams out of these better markets.

 

[CGG]

All of that for this



Team won't move unless the city makes it impossible to operate the team there, or if Bettman has a change of heart. Simple as that. Expansion is worth too much to the other owners.

Atlanta moved because their owners essentially refused to allow their team to play at Phillips Arena (which they controlled) any longer. It was the only arena in town. They were forced out by their own owners.

Barroway can / will do the same thing. Terminate the lease leading up the Year 5 and claim there's nowhere to play in Phoenix, so the team has to relocate. IMO the city will be only too happy to let them go by then, and save $15 million a year. After 8 years of burning city money they will finally get that the team isn't worth keeping.

The relocation fee mentioned in the article, I'm thinking that was just to force home the point with IA that they can't simply move the team themselves, or sell for relocation and keep all fo the proceeds. The NHL will get their cut on relo, make no mistake about it.

 

[aqib]

This has often been said about the NFL's lack of presence in LA.

The NFL isn't in LA because LA doesn't want to pay for a stadium. There are private investors willing to pay for a stadium (AEG and Eli Broad) but both want to own the team in the stadium. So a team like the Raiders who is a free agent after this year but they don't want to sell the team. They can get a free stadium in San Antonio.

 

[Fugu]

The NFL isn't in LA because LA doesn't want to pay for a stadium. There are private investors willing to pay for a stadium (AEG and Eli Broad) but both want to own the team in the stadium. So a team like the Raiders who is a free agent after this year but they don't want to sell the team. They can get a free stadium in San Antonio.

Eli Broad? He's ancient and has been giving away his fortune over the past decade. I doubt he wants to acquire an NFL team now.

All that notwithstanding, it's the second largest media market in the US--- and vastly larger than #3 on the list. You would normally expect a major league team from all the major leagues to have a substantial presence there.

 

[powerstuck]

All of that for this

This does not mean the Coyotes are a slam-dunk to move, since Bettman would rather see them stay for strategic reasons to do with television markets and division alignments. And if they do move and Barroway elects to keep the team rather than flip it, it may not be the easy score it seems.

When Gosbee and LeBlanc bought the team in 2013, a relocation fee was discussed. Bettman wanted to make it part of the sale agreement at a minimum of $60-million (what the Winnipeg Jets owners paid) but with the condition the fee would be based on the team’s new market. There was no ceiling on the fee, which meant it could run into hundreds of millions of dollars if a particularly desirable market was the target.

This never made it into the final purchase agreement, but Barroway needs to remember it will come up again.

Team won't move unless the city makes it impossible to operate the team there, or if Bettman has a change of heart. Simple as that. Expansion is worth too much to the other owners.

I need someone to explain this one to me. I guess I can figure out the divisions part, but television market ? Hell no. Sorry nope.

I don't see any TV broadcaster go and give NHL hundreds of millions extra because they can cover Phoenix tv market for about 2000 people per night. That's like still believing 1+1=3.

 

[aqib]

Yes, I agree. Every time there's a suggestion that relocation is an incentive, I'm reminded of the BK trial where the NHL attorneys made the case that relocation would incur additional fees, which we saw come to fruition in the Atlanta move.

It's not some flat fee of $60 MM, but the difference in values between the market being left behind and the new one. That money gets divvied up.

This is why the whole "save that market for expansion" doesn't hold water anymore. The league will extract the value either way.

 

[aqib]

Eli Broad? He's ancient and has been giving away his fortune over the past decade. I doubt he wants to acquire an NFL team now.

All that notwithstanding, it's the second largest media market in the US--- and vastly larger than #3 on the list. You would normally expect a major league team from all the major leagues to have a substantial presence there.

But he is still has the plan for City of Industry.

Be that as it may, we have seen over and over again that market size doesn't automatically translate to being a good market for a team. Remember LA has 6 other major league teams and 2 major college programs, on top the population with a lot of transplants. Additionally being a major market also makes the cost of building a stadium much higher.

 

[Llama19]

But he is still has the plan for City of Industry.

Be that as it may, we have seen over and over again that market size doesn't automatically translate to being a good market for a team. Remember LA has 6 other major league teams and 2 major college programs, on top the population with a lot of transplants. Additionally being a major market also makes the cost of building a stadium much higher.

Moody's Credit Focus report on Glendale's 'sports related debt' appears to agree with you...

 

[TheLegend]

But he is still has the plan for City of Industry.

Be that as it may, we have seen over and over again that market size doesn't automatically translate to being a good market for a team. Remember LA has 6 other major league teams and 2 major college programs, on top the population with a lot of transplants. Additionally being a major market also makes the cost of building a stadium much higher.

Mainly because of the ever increasing urge for the next facility to "one up" the previous ones built. And if you want to add it in...... land acquisition costs.

LA is also spread over a much larger land mass. New York has 9 major teams.... plus several colleges in their region.

 

[CasualFan]

I'm not sure he really added any new info in this second piece. It seems like he's speculating about the incentive to Barroway which includes a lot of ideas we've dredged here...

He probably should have posted it here in BOH. Seems like an internet message board is a much more appropriate place for his two part series. Seriously, if Shoalts wants to play Investigative Journalist or Business Reporter, he could at least take the 5 minute to FOIA some actual documents from Glendale.

 

[Slashers98]

Coyotes cheerleader Craig Morgan on the Shoalts' article: Barroway deal to take control of Coyotes still on track

There is a strong chance the deal could close within the next two weeks, but if it does not, NHL commissioner Gary Bettman might choose to wait until the Board of Governors meetings on Dec. 8-9 in Boca Raton, Fla.

Two weeks.

 

[aqib]

Mainly because of the ever increasing urge for the next facility to "one up" the previous ones built. And if you want to add it in...... land acquisition costs.

LA is also spread over a much larger land mass. New York has 9 major teams.... plus several colleges in their region.

Yes land acquisition costs as well as labor make it more expensive. Which furthers my point. Building a stadium in LA is much more expensive than it would be for a team than it would be if a team was to move to say San Antonio (which I will go on record right now and say that is where the Raiders will wind up).

New York has several colleges and they are no where on the map as far as sports goes. I have two degrees from NYU and literally no one cares about the sports teams there. My freshman year they had to offer the dorm with the most people to show up to a basketball game a pizza party in order to get people to go and that was a year when the team played in the national title game. In fact they lost the title game on a bad call while we were on spring break and no one knew until we got back from break. It got ONE article in the NY Times. When I was in grad school the school paper pulled a prank and made up a football team and every week ran stories about the games. People were like "when did we get a football team." People were so indifferent that it was plausible to have a football team and no one know about it.

LA meanwhile you have USC and UCLA football which are prominent national programs and UCLA basketball is an iconic program.

 

[TheLegend]

Coyotes cheerleader Craig Morgan on the Shoalts' article: Barroway deal to take control of Coyotes still on track



Two weeks.

"Cheerleader"??

Who's waving the pom poms here, Fred??


Since Morgan's article didn't have anything that we already didn't know about I didn't bother posting it.

 

[Fugu]

Coyotes cheerleader Craig Morgan on the Shoalts' article: Barroway deal to take control of Coyotes still on track



Two weeks.

I thought Shoalts said Barroway was already serving as the team BOG?

 

[TheLegend]

I thought Shoalts said Barroway was already serving as the team BOG?

He did.... from part one:

"But it will mean Gosbee, LeBlanc and their fellow Canadians will be on the outside. Yes, they will remain as minority owners, at least for now, and LeBlanc says he is staying on as team president. But it is clear Barroway intends to take charge. He has already replaced Gosbee as chairman and governor."

Now I wonder how Shoalt's...... in his infinite wisdom...... concludes that a person who hasn't even been officially approved as an owner can already sit on the board as a governor?

 

[Fugu]

He did.... from part one:


Now I wonder how Shoalt's...... in his infinite wisdom...... concludes that a person who hasn't even been officially approved as an owner can already sit on the board as a governor?

I think Shoalts was saying the final paperwork (could be bank details) haven't closed. The local Phoenix article is suggesting that Barroway has yet to be approved.