Player Discussion Andrei Markov

[Adriatic]

Markov on the third pair ? And then not on the team at all? What's up with this obsession to send him to retirement?

Let me remind you that he had 44 points last season good for the 21st place in scoring among all the D's in the league.

In the last 3 seasons he posted 43P, 50P, and 44P while missing 2 games in the span.

The guy plays a cerebral type of hockey , he's not spending a lot of energy on the ice .He's always well positioned and is very effective with his stick.

Reading comments around here , you would think the guy is done ...

He's a training rat and always keeps himself in a great shape, I think he's going to be effective a lot longer than people think.

I'm not gonna be surprised if he signs another contract with us for less money after his contract expires...

Look at the guy he's all ripped like he's 20 years old))

https://www.instagram.com/p/BGpI9dnGIEg/?taken-by=marki79red

All those stats are meaningless because he's horrible in the playoffs when it matters. I don't care how many points he racks up in october and november against mediocre non-playoff teams because when the playoffs roll around he struggles just to be average against good teams. His puck moving ability, his cerebral game all goes out the door when he's being hounded by good forecheckers.

 

[CGG]

I know I'm in the minority here but I'm all for a Markov-Weber pairing. Yes, Weber will get too many minutes to have Markov beside him the whole game. But Weber 27 minutes (including PK time) and Markov 22 minutes (including PP time) is about right.

Weber's lack of foot speed is completely overstated on here now. As is the reported demise in Markov's play - the guy is still extremely good. Let go of the 3 major brain cramps he had last season. That happens to everyone. Chances are Price would have stopped 2 of them and we wouldn't even be talking about it. But because Condon, you all seem to be thinking that's the new normal for Markov.

Put Markov and Weber together and you have one of the smartest pairings out there. Both guys are very good positionally and defend extremely well. You don't need a Subban to lug the puck out of the zone, these two guys will figure it out.

Markov was 7th in the league in even strength assists last year. 10th overall in assists. The guy can move the puck. Expect his numbers to go up as Weber pounds 14 or so PP goals this season. He'll be feeding Weber on the left and Chucky on the right on the PP this season. Anyone claiming he's not a "puck moving defenseman" is completely wrong. There's more than one way to move the puck, and the best way is to pass it - a Markov pass goes a lot faster than Subban can skate.

Markov - Sergachev ... if only sergy was ready would be sick PP

Well, Weber is ready, and is # 1 in the league for PP goals by a defenseman. Markov - Weber will be sick PP.

 

[McGuires Corndog]

I know I'm in the minority here but I'm all for a Markov-Weber pairing. Yes, Weber will get too many minutes to have Markov beside him the whole game. But Weber 27 minutes (including PK time) and Markov 22 minutes (including PP time) is about right.

Weber's lack of foot speed is completely overstated on here now. As is the reported demise in Markov's play - the guy is still extremely good. Let go of the 3 major brain cramps he had last season. That happens to everyone. Chances are Price would have stopped 2 of them and we wouldn't even be talking about it. But because Condon, you all seem to be thinking that's the new normal for Markov.

Put Markov and Weber together and you have one of the smartest pairings out there. Both guys are very good positionally and defend extremely well. You don't need a Subban to lug the puck out of the zone, these two guys will figure it out.

Markov was 7th in the league in even strength assists last year. 10th overall in assists. The guy can move the puck. Expect his numbers to go up as Weber pounds 14 or so PP goals this season. He'll be feeding Weber on the left and Chucky on the right on the PP this season. Anyone claiming he's not a "puck moving defenseman" is completely wrong. There's more than one way to move the puck, and the best way is to pass it - a Markov pass goes a lot faster than Subban can skate.



Well, Weber is ready, and is # 1 in the league for PP goals by a defenseman. Markov - Weber will be sick PP.

Such a great post, nothing I can disagree with here.

Markov is highly underrated around here. Yes his playoff history is not the greatest, but his play in the regular season has been that of a legitimate #1 defenseman for a over a decade now and he STILL plays that way, contrary to what some may believe.

He's a perfect #2 behind a Subban or Weber.

 

[Gyfu]

Such a great post, nothing I can disagree with here.

Markov is highly underrated around here. Yes his playoff history is not the greatest, but his play in the regular season has been that of a legitimate #1 defenseman for a over a decade now and he STILL plays that way, contrary to what some may believe.

He's a perfect #2 behind a Subban or Weber.

To both you and the poster you quoted, i love 79 and want him to retire with the CH on his chest, i'd also like him to stick around for 2 to 3 more years (last year or 2 more like gonchar as a mentor, long time pp general and bottom pair guy)... i do think he can still play great hockey (and he was very solid for most of the year) but the guy is 38 y/o ffs... imo he fits perfectly with 26 who is a younger, mobile, solid all-around d... and while i never was that high on beau, i think he's got a skillset similar to petry and could complement weber really well in a way... and please no markov on the pk, we need to really be careful with his icetime/hard vs. easy minutes

 

[PaulD]

Poor Markov. Therrien coached him when the star D was 24 years old. Now coaches him again when he is 37.

The moronic coach played AM just as much (top pairing, pp, pk, ot) at 37 (after two major knee injuries/surgeries and achilles heal tear) as he did when he was a spry injury free 24 year old.

Nothing left by the end of season and play offs for the aging Dman? Duh. No kidding.

Andre is veteran that used properly is invaluable on the second pair. He should be on the bench during PK and 3 on 3 situations. That's simply a no brainer.

But Therriens an idiot so all bets are off.

 

[Dagistitsyn]

Former Montreal Canadiens defenceman P.K. Subban talks about the influence that Andrei Markov had on him.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/markov-huge-influence-career-subban/

 

[PernellsWhiteAmi]

All those stats are meaningless because he's horrible in the playoffs when it matters. I don't care how many points he racks up in october and november against mediocre non-playoff teams because when the playoffs roll around he struggles just to be average against good teams. His puck moving ability, his cerebral game all goes out the door when he's being hounded by good forecheckers.

That's not Markov's fault. In an ideal situation, he should be playing 2nd pairing/3rd pairing minutes. Therrien plays him 25+ minutes a night, sometimes in both back-to-back games, and then expects Markov to have enough gas in the tank come playoff time. That's not happening with a 36+ year old dman, especially one who has had 2 reconstructive knee surgeries in the past, what, 8 years?

 

[Adriatic]

That's not Markov's fault. In an ideal situation, he should be playing 2nd pairing/3rd pairing minutes. Therrien plays him 25+ minutes a night, sometimes in both back-to-back games, and then expects Markov to have enough gas in the tank come playoff time. That's not happening with a 36+ year old dman, especially one who has had 2 reconstructive knee surgeries in the past, what, 8 years?

Of course he should be playing 2nd or 3rd pairing, that would be ideal. We just have to find somebody that can replace his minutes. I'm hoping we we can pull off a trade to get #2.

 

[scrubadam]

Such a great post, nothing I can disagree with here.

Markov is highly underrated around here. Yes his playoff history is not the greatest, but his play in the regular season has been that of a legitimate #1 defenseman for a over a decade now and he STILL plays that way, contrary to what some may believe.

He's a perfect #2 behind a Subban or Weber.

How many millions did Markov make for Montreal Dmen? The General maybe a bit older but his brain still functions at an elite level.

Heck if it wasn't for Markov PK wouldn't be a 9 million dollar man. Markov benefited from PK, but I really think PK benefited a lot more from playing with Markov.

 

[the]

Omg!!! What in the hell am I reading? I have to be dreaming! Markov getting praised around here, unbelievable!!

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

The problem is we don't have anyone to replace him and are forced to play him too much so he doesn't seem to have anything in the tank by the time the playoffs roll around.

Last year if you take out the 12 games where he had 1 pt, the rest of the season he was on pace for 50 pts. If he hit 51 pts that would put him tied for 9th in the league in scoring for defensemen. We just can't afford to lose that kind of production unless Beaulieu/Barberio or whoever are ready to step up in a big way which seems unlikely.

Always appreciate your posts and opiniin but I am going to have to somewhat disagree here.

It is my opinion that the burnout theory is an incorrect one. He has always been terrible in the playoffs. I have always been a big fan of his due to his cerebral game but even at his peak he was not a strong skater and the pace of playoff hockey has always been too much for him.

He has always been able to exploit that extra second of time and space in the regular season but when that disappears during playoff hockey he really struggles as he simply can't play his game. His skating has deteriorated to the point where he is an enormous liability in the playoffs. I really don't care about his regular season production when he has never been able to do it in the post season and there is no reason to believe that trend is about to change.

If a player is useless in the playoffs then imo he is entirely useless as I only care about competing for championships. Not to say that he is would necessarily be entirely useless in the playoffs if he was used primarily as a PP specialist. This is a scenario that I can live with but if that is the case then he should be used the same way in the regular season to allow each pairing to build familiarity and chemistry.

It would have been great if Markov ever had a quality partner during his prime. A partner who could skate, and think on Markov's level.

 

[Teufelsdreck]

Age and injuries tend to erode an athlete's ability. Does anyone recall that Markov (along with Gorges and Pacioretty) was injured and unavailable for the 2011 playoffs in which the Habs lost to the Bruins in OT in the 7th game? I always thought the Habs should have won (as they often did against the Bruins in playoffs).

 

[Adam Michaels]

Poor Markov. Therrien coached him when the star D was 24 years old. Now coaches him again when he is 37.

The moronic coach played AM just as much (top pairing, pp, pk, ot) at 37 (after two major knee injuries/surgeries and achilles heal tear) as he did when he was a spry injury free 24 year old.

Nothing left by the end of season and play offs for the aging Dman? Duh. No kidding.

Andre is veteran that used properly is invaluable on the second pair. He should be on the bench during PK and 3 on 3 situations. That's simply a no brainer.

But Therriens an idiot so all bets are off.

At the start of the season, when Habs were firing on all cylinders with a fully healthy line-up, Markov was used a lot less. He was playing 21-22 minutes a game while Subban was playing his usual 25-27 minutes. Then the injury bug hit (and hit the defense the hardest), and Therrien was forced to use Markov a lot more. That's what happens when you bring in a Dietz here, an Ellis there, a Hanley here, and Bartley there. With so many AHLers being called up, Therrien was forced to give Markov heavier minutes.

But at the start of the season, Therrien was openly answering questions about his intentions to lessen Markov's minutes and workload.

I know I'm in the minority here but I'm all for a Markov-Weber pairing. Yes, Weber will get too many minutes to have Markov beside him the whole game. But Weber 27 minutes (including PK time) and Markov 22 minutes (including PP time) is about right.

Weber's lack of foot speed is completely overstated on here now. As is the reported demise in Markov's play - the guy is still extremely good. Let go of the 3 major brain cramps he had last season. That happens to everyone. Chances are Price would have stopped 2 of them and we wouldn't even be talking about it. But because Condon, you all seem to be thinking that's the new normal for Markov.

Put Markov and Weber together and you have one of the smartest pairings out there. Both guys are very good positionally and defend extremely well. You don't need a Subban to lug the puck out of the zone, these two guys will figure it out.

Markov was 7th in the league in even strength assists last year. 10th overall in assists. The guy can move the puck. Expect his numbers to go up as Weber pounds 14 or so PP goals this season. He'll be feeding Weber on the left and Chucky on the right on the PP this season. Anyone claiming he's not a "puck moving defenseman" is completely wrong. There's more than one way to move the puck, and the best way is to pass it - a Markov pass goes a lot faster than Subban can skate.



Well, Weber is ready, and is # 1 in the league for PP goals by a defenseman. Markov - Weber will be sick PP.

Like you, a Markov-Weber pairing doesn't scare me. Although I would hope Beaulieu can step up and be #1LD while Markov plays with Petry as second pair. His 37 years of age does not worry me in the slightest. He is as smart as they get in his position.

I remember in 2010 when Habs made it to the ECF. They beat former champs Penguins and #1 seed Capitals. One of our most effective pairs, shutting down the Crosbys and Ovechkins was the pairing of Hamrlik and Spacek. They were both in their late 30s. But they shut down the best in the world regardless.

True enough, Spacek and Hamrlik weren't relied on for offense. But their offensive talents were not their forte. But that's because they were different types of D than Markov, who is more offensively gifted. All this to say that players in their late 30s are not done or finished.

 

[McGuires Corndog]

Like you, a Markov-Weber pairing doesn't scare me. Although I would hope Beaulieu can step up and be #1LD while Markov plays with Petry as second pair. His 37 years of age does not worry me in the slightest. He is as smart as they get in his position.

I remember in 2010 when Habs made it to the ECF. They beat former champs Penguins and #1 seed Capitals. One of our most effective pairs, shutting down the Crosbys and Ovechkins was the pairing of Hamrlik and Spacek. They were both in their late 30s. But they shut down the best in the world regardless.

True enough, Spacek and Hamrlik weren't relied on for offense. But their offensive talents were not their forte. But that's because they were different types of D than Markov, who is more offensively gifted. All this to say that players in their late 30s are not done or finished.

They are not done in their late 30s because they are already finished at 31

 

[montreal]

Always appreciate your posts and opiniin but I am going to have to somewhat disagree here.

It is my opinion that the burnout theory is an incorrect one. He has always been terrible in the playoffs. I have always been a big fan of his due to his cerebral game but even at his peak he was not a strong skater and the pace of playoff hockey has always been too much for him.

He has always been able to exploit that extra second of time and space in the regular season but when that disappears during playoff hockey he really struggles as he simply can't play his game. His skating has deteriorated to the point where he is an enormous liability in the playoffs. I really don't care about his regular season production when he has never been able to do it in the post season and there is no reason to believe that trend is about to change.

If a player is useless in the playoffs then imo he is entirely useless as I only care about competing for championships. Not to say that he is would necessarily be entirely useless in the playoffs if he was used primarily as a PP specialist. This is a scenario that I can live with but if that is the case then he should be used the same way in the regular season to allow each pairing to build familiarity and chemistry.

It would have been great if Markov ever had a quality partner during his prime. A partner who could skate, and think on Markov's level.

To me the Markov has always been terrible in the playoffs is incorrect. In '13-'14 he had 10 pts in 17 games, which over 82 is 48 or what would be his normal production. The problem is he's had some poor years in the playoffs like last year when he had just 2 pts in 12 games. But numbers wise he has put up numbers similar to what he did in the regular season, in his first two seasons of playoff hockey he had 9 pts in 23 games which works out to 32 pts over a full season. In '08-'09 4 pts in 8 games while not as good as his great regular season it's still not terrible.

Clearly he's slowing down and that is a big problem. But an even bigger problem is our lack of offensive production from the blueline and the fact that we don't seem to have anyone to replace his production at this point in time.

 

[FerrisRox]

At the start of the season, when Habs were firing on all cylinders with a fully healthy line-up, Markov was used a lot less. He was playing 21-22 minutes a game while Subban was playing his usual 25-27 minutes.

Not sure where you are getting your information from, but your ice time for Markov is totally false.

In five of the first ten games of the season, Markov played 24 minutes or more (with four games of 24:40 or more) and only twice played less than twenty-two minutes.

The ice time he had at the start of the year reminded pretty consistent for several months. In late February and into March he started to see that ice time creep even higher.

 

[Adam Michaels]

Not sure where you are getting your information from, but your ice time for Markov is totally false.

In five of the first ten games of the season, Markov played 24 minutes or more (with four games of 24:40 or more) and only twice played less than twenty-two minutes.

The ice time he had at the start of the year reminded pretty consistent for several months. In late February and into March he started to see that ice time creep even higher.

I was going by memory, which isn't perfect as you pointed out. Nevertheless, his ice time had lessened compared to the year before. Reporters would ask Therrien about it and he'd reply that they would try to manage Markov's minutes so he doesn't run out of gas come playoff time as was the case in the 2015 playoffs.

 

[PaulD]

All those stats are meaningless because he's horrible in the playoffs when it matters. I don't care how many points he racks up in october and november against mediocre non-playoff teams because when the playoffs roll around he struggles just to be average against good teams. His puck moving ability, his cerebral game all goes out the door when he's being hounded by good forecheckers.

We are talking about Markov not Plekanic.

Age and injuries tend to erode an athlete's ability. Does anyone recall that Markov (along with Gorges and Pacioretty) was injured and unavailable for the 2011 playoffs in which the Habs lost to the Bruins in OT in the 7th game? I always thought the Habs should have won (as they often did against the Bruins in playoffs).

If Gionta could hit an open net we would have.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

We are talking about Markov not Plekanic.

They have both been terrible in the post season. Plekanec's problem is he doesn't elevate his game and doesn't play with any fire or guts in the playoffs. Most players give that little extra effort in the post season and leave it all on the ice whereas Plekanec plays like it is still the regular season.

 

[Teufelsdreck]

This could be Markov's last season. He'll do the best he can but he can't recapture his youth.

 

[montreal]

This could be Markov's last season. He'll do the best he can but he can't recapture his youth.

Unless he really falls apart I would expect him to be back the following season. I could see them going with a Markov Sergachev pairing.

 

[BLONG7]

Unless he really falls apart I would expect him to be back the following season. I could see them going with a Markov Sergachev pairing.

Would love to see AM come back, one season at a time...also hearing he said Subban was NO distraction in the room...........it really continues to seem as though this is all on MB and the clown coach...

Markov will appreciate Weber also, not sure they will be paired together...

 

[Adam Michaels]

Would love to see AM come back, one season at a time...also hearing he said Subban was NO distraction in the room...........it really continues to seem as though this is all on MB and the clown coach...

Markov will appreciate Weber also, not sure they will be paired together...

Don't read too much into what players say on the record. Not saying Markov isn't saying the truth, but he definitely won't go on record saying PK was a problem.

 

[scrubadam]

Unless he really falls apart I would expect him to be back the following season. I could see them going with a Markov Sergachev pairing.

Wouldn't mind either if he pulled a Ryan Clowe and moved into coaching for the Org.

But I don't know if Markov is the type who would want to become a coach. Strikes me more of a player who would go retire in some small Russian village and eat Borsche all day...

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Don't read too much into what players say on the record. Not saying Markov isn't saying the truth, but he definitely won't go on record saying PK was a problem.

Exactly......common sense.