Speculation: Anaheim Ducks Roster Discussion Part IV

[pbgoalie]

A lot of teams are going to learn who the disciplined, hard workers are or are not.

When teams re-open I’m sure there will be some out of shape horror stories around the league!

 

[Paul4587]

A lot of teams are going to learn who the disciplined, hard workers are or are not.

When teams re-open I’m sure there will be some out of shape horror stories around the league!

I wonder if anyone pulls a Tkachuk and comes to camp so fat they get sent home. What an accomplishment

 

[lwvs84]

A lot of teams are going to learn who the disciplined, hard workers are or are not.

When teams re-open I’m sure there will be some out of shape horror stories around the league!

I wonder if this might affect the draft too. I'm guessing most of the top guys are taking it serious enough that they won't do anything to ruin their future, but they are just teenagers... there might be some guys that are just taking it easy and just eating.

 

[Anaheim4ever]

Well most of the athletes should have exercise equipment in their homes.....even i have a exercise bike that i've been using to lose a lot of weight since the lockdown went into effect in california.

but it is funny that some pro athletes are getting fat while non athletes like me are getting into shape.

 

[Paul4587]

Well most of the athletes should have exercise equipment in their homes.....even i have a exercise bike that i've been using to lose a lot of weight since the lockdown went into effect in california.

but it is funny that some pro athletes are getting fat while non athletes like me are getting into shape.

A lot don’t. Why would they need to when they’ve got world class facilities they can train in every day at the rinks they’re at? Most of the interviews I’ve seen players have claimed they don’t have much in the way of equipment.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

In 2017-18 Rakell would've been a 70 point player if not for missing time, as would Getzlaf (if not 80 points or PPG+). I like our current and future defense, but the forward group needs a lot of work. In 2017-18, Getzlaf and Rakell played like first liners, and we had Kase, Ritchie, Perry, Henrique, Silfverberg, Kesler, and Cogliano as middle 6 depth. We don't even have any clear cut first line players at this point, and I would say Heinen, Getzlaf, Silfverberg, Henrique, and Rakell are our only top 9 forwards. You really cannot compare the two. Our forward group is a ways away from being able to compete.

Vegas's inaugural team didn't possess a first line, but all four lines were 2nd liners. That's similarly what we have, but a weaker 3rd line. Yet, our defense and goaltending should be boss.

Anyhow, thanks for MOVING THE GOAL POST.

We don’t even have 50 point scorers anymore, we need at least a couple young players who are a good bet for 30+ goals/70+ points per year.

blah, blah, blah. I answered you succinctly and you move the goal post. LoL

 

[MMC]

Vegas's inaugural team didn't possess a first line, but all four lines were 2nd liners. That's similarly what we have, but a weaker 3rd line. Yet, our defense and goaltending should be boss.

Anyhow, thanks for MOVING THE GOAL POST.



blah, blah, blah. I answered you succinctly and you move the goal post. LoL

Marchessault was a 75 point player for them, Reilly Smith had 60 points in 67 games, and William Karlsson was a 43 goal/almost PPG center. We don't have anyone on our roster that be relied upon for that type of production. Also how am I the one moving the goalposts when my original argument was about our forwards not being good enough, and all you're countering with is how good our defense and goaltending will be?

 

[Los Patos de Anaheim]

Marchessault was a 75 point player for them, Reilly Smith had 60 points in 67 games, and William Karlsson was a 43 goal/almost PPG center. We don't have anyone on our roster that be relied upon for that type of production. Also how am I the one moving the goalposts when my original argument was about our forwards not being good enough, and all you're countering with is how good our defense and goaltending will be?

It would be awesome if one of the young guys had a Karlsaon like explosion. f*** I’d take 15 goals from Steel/Terry and be happy

 

[Los Patos de Anaheim]

If the ducks get improved seasons from Steel, Jones, Terry, and Gibson, they will compete for a playoff spot. The Ducks were 6-8 points out of being in the wild card race for a playoff spot. Assuming they play the exact same, with between 10 and 20 more points for each of the young guys, and a better season from Gibson; why couldn’t they compete?

 

[MMC]

Thought this was interesting

 

[duxfan1101]

MDZ is giving out real good answers in this Q&A. Someone asked who the most underrated defensemen in the NHL was, and he answered Tanev. Then, unprompted and in the same response, said Subban was the most overrated.

 

[MMC]

Wonder if this is at all directed towards our young players/Eakins/Murray

 

[Paul4587]

Travis Yost assembled all decade teams for every NHL team based off the whole decade not player peaks or anything else.

Here’s what the numbers he used came up with for the Ducks:

F1- F3 (in order) Getzlaf Perry Rakell
D1-D2 Lindholm Vatanen
G1-G2 Gibson Hiller

Skaters
Goalies

He’s very much an analytics guy but surely if you see Sami Vatanen ranked over Fowler and Beauchemin for their time with the Ducks over the past decade you need to rethink the basis of how your results are calculated. The same metrics also think that the likes of Stone, Pavelski, Scheifele, Couturier, Toews etc were better than Getzlaf.

Interesting read but can’t agree with much of it. At least he got our goalies right.

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

Wonder if this is at all directed towards our young players/Eakins/Murray

View attachment 343268

Don't think so, he's talking about the league-wide trend and just doesn't seem to understand the business end of things mixed in with some misguided romanticism of the era he came up in(a whole ten years ago).

 

[The Mighty Duck Man]

Travis Yost assembled all decade teams for every NHL team based off the whole decade not player peaks or anything else.

Here’s what the numbers he used came up with for the Ducks:

F1- F3 (in order) Getzlaf Perry Rakell
D1-D2 Lindholm Vatanen
G1-G2 Gibson Hiller

Skaters
Goalies

He’s very much an analytics guy but surely if you see Sami Vatanen ranked over Fowler and Beauchemin for their time with the Ducks over the past decade you need to rethink the basis of how your results are calculated. The same metrics also think that the likes of Stone, Pavelski, Scheifele, Couturier, Toews etc were better than Getzlaf.

Interesting read but can’t agree with much of it. At least he got our goalies right.

Vatanen is perplexing based on games played alone. Teemu, the guy who retired in 2014, played roughly as many Ducks games this decade as he did. Gibson, the guy still playing AHL games in 2015 and is a goalie, actually played in more games than he did. Beauch and Manson both played a decent amount more and Fowler is more than double.

 

[Anaheim4ever]

Thought this was interesting

View attachment 343259

Interesting because their best seasons and rookie seasons have similar stats on the scoreboard
Fowler in 2010-11: 10 goals, 30 assists, 40 points in 76 games
Del Zotto in 2009-10: 9 goals, 28 assists, 37 points in 80 games.

Fowler in 2016-17: 11 goals, 28 assists, 39 points in 80 games.
Del Zotto in 2011-12: 10 goals, 31 assists, 41 points in 77 games.

 

[Paul4587]

MDZ is basically a poor mans Fowler. Similar offensive peaks but Cam has always been better in his own end. Only thing MDZ had over Cam when he was at his best was a better shot and he was a bit more assertive offensively.

 

[Los Patos de Anaheim]

I wonder if anyone pulls a Tkachuk and comes to camp so fat they get sent home. What an accomplishment

Dustin Penner?

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Marchessault was a 75 point player for them, Reilly Smith had 60 points in 67 games, and William Karlsson was a 43 goal/almost PPG center. We don't have anyone on our roster that be relied upon for that type of production. Also how am I the one moving the goalposts when my original argument was about our forwards not being good enough, and all you're countering with is how good our defense and goaltending will be?

Either you're being dense or you're an outright liar.

We don’t even have 50 point scorers anymore, we need at least a couple young players who are a good bet for 30+ goals/70+ points per year.

That's your initial criteria. I disproved it. FULL STOP.

In 2017-18 Rakell would've been a 70 point player if not for missing time, as would Getzlaf (if not 80 points or PPG+). I like our current and future defense, but the forward group needs a lot of work. In 2017-18, Getzlaf and Rakell played like first liners, and we had Kase, Ritchie, Perry, Henrique, Silfverberg, Kesler, and Cogliano as middle 6 depth. We don't even have any clear cut first line players at this point, and I would say Heinen, Getzlaf, Silfverberg, Henrique, and Rakell are our only top 9 forwards. You really cannot compare the two. Our forward group is a ways away from being able to compete.

Whoa, whoa, whoa... "Rakell would've been a 70 point player..." and "we don't have any clear cut first line players..." as well as "You really cannot compare the two."

Clearly you've moved the post... thrice.

And now, "Also how am I the one moving the goalposts when my original argument was about our forwards not being good enough, and all you're countering with is how good our defense and goaltending will be?"

Narcissist much in this discussion?

My initial response to you:

"I just talked about how our defense looks far more solid now, but you're off and running about the scoring and the need for 70+ point producers. We didn't have any 70 point producers in 2017-18 when we last made the playoffs, finishing with 101 points and 2nd in the Pacific."

We made the playoffs without any 70 point producers in 2017-18.

• Goal Scoring: 2.28 goals per game (18th most)
• Goals Against: 2.55 goals against per game (3rd fewest)
• 
  
• PP eff: 17.8% (9th worst)
• PK eff: 83.2% (5th best) and 10 SHGs (3rd best)

I thought it was already implied that our defense carried us because we didn't have a plethora of 70 point producers. But hey, you'll probably omit facts to continue your "moving the goal post" theme. You can't simply accept the fact someone brought up another way to win games that's actually occurred. So, go ahead. Keep moving the goal post and omit you've been disproven on several levels. I'll keep quoting your "moving the goal post" posts because facts.

 

[Hockey Duckie]

It would be awesome if one of the young guys had a Karlsaon like explosion. f*** I’d take 15 goals from Steel/Terry and be happy

Maybe a Milano could follow similarly to Karlsson? Guys who needed to be moved to other teams to wake them up? I know Wild Bill needed it and he turned it on. Milano needed it, but I dunno if he can turn it on. He did earn 5 pts in 9 games with us. Granted, he got his two goals in the first game with us and that goal scoring drought started afterwards.

Here's an article on Sonny before the draft: link

Scouts rave about Milano's speed and hands. One scout was quoted in The Hockey News draft preview issue as saying Milano has "Exceptional speed, and pretty dynamic offensively. He has the ability to make things happen by himself. Maybe looks selfish at times because of that, but other times he has worked well with his linemates."

The biggest concern scouts have about Milano is his defensive play and maturity. If those two areas can be developed by his next organization's coaching staff, Milano may become a true star.

and

Top-End Potential
At his top potential, Milano is a first-line point-producer who would be exceptionally dangerous on the power play. Give him a little more room to operate and his hand skills will be deadly to opposing defenses and goaltenders. At his best, Milano could score 40 goals and 85 points.

Unless his defensive game improves a little bit, Milano may have some limitations on the ice. If he smooths those issues out, the sky is the limit.

Maybe getting traded can force that maturity into a different level. The potential is there for Milano. It took two franchises to move on from Wild Bill to make his potential a reality. Hopefully, it will only take one franchise move for Milano to rise. Right now, we could use a scorer in our organization. This might be a very sneaky good move if Milano bakes! Maybe Milano just needed to bake a little longer to become that sweet cookie!

 

[Masch78]

I guess that is the idea behind Milano and Heinen. I like both players despite really liking what Kase and Ritchie brought. But Kase has so many questionmarks healthwise and Nick is now on the right team.

 

[Gliff]

Either you're being dense or you're an outright liar.



That's your initial criteria. I disproved it. FULL STOP.



Whoa, whoa, whoa... "Rakell would've been a 70 point player..." and "we don't have any clear cut first line players..." as well as "You really cannot compare the two."

Clearly you've moved the post... thrice.

And now, "Also how am I the one moving the goalposts when my original argument was about our forwards not being good enough, and all you're countering with is how good our defense and goaltending will be?"

Narcissist much in this discussion?

My initial response to you:

"I just talked about how our defense looks far more solid now, but you're off and running about the scoring and the need for 70+ point producers. We didn't have any 70 point producers in 2017-18 when we last made the playoffs, finishing with 101 points and 2nd in the Pacific."

We made the playoffs without any 70 point producers in 2017-18.

• Goal Scoring: 2.28 goals per game (18th most)
• Goals Against: 2.55 goals against per game (3rd fewest)
• 
  
• PP eff: 17.8% (9th worst)
• PK eff: 83.2% (5th best) and 10 SHGs (3rd best)

I thought it was already implied that our defense carried us because we didn't have a plethora of 70 point producers. But hey, you'll probably omit facts to continue your "moving the goal post" theme. You can't simply accept the fact someone brought up another way to win games that's actually occurred. So, go ahead. Keep moving the goal post and omit you've been disproven on several levels. I'll keep quoting your "moving the goal post" posts because facts.

Thank you for color coding so I don’t have to read your whole post to get the angry intent.

 

[Leonardo87]

MDZ is basically a poor mans Fowler. Similar offensive peaks but Cam has always been better in his own end. Only thing MDZ had over Cam when he was at his best was a better shot and he was a bit more assertive offensively.

MDZ was very good in his first couple of seasons with the Rangers, but then he started to inherit the name Del Zaster. Have no issues having Del Zotto as a 6/7 guy. He can certainly step in if there is an injury.

 

[MilesNewton]

Wonder if this is at all directed towards our young players/Eakins/Murray

View attachment 343268

Best comment I have ever heard MDZ make, not a big fan of his but he speaks the truth.

 

[bsu]

‎Spittin Chiclets on Apple Podcasts

Getzlaf was on spittin chiclets today.