Post-Game Talk: All Good Things Must Come To An End

KlefDown

I adore Soli
May 2, 2014
9,923
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Stupid post of the year here. No! any fan with a brain doesn't hope they lose to san jose . And you want it so bad you pray for it lol. Get some help lol
good one kevy9999, there are plenty of fans wishing we lose to san jose. small price to pay for a short term loss for a long term win

maybe you need help with your delusion for this team even after being 2-9-1
 

Stoneman89

Registered User
Feb 8, 2008
27,503
21,998
good one kevy9999, there are plenty of fans wishing we lose to san jose. small price to pay for a short term loss for a long term win

maybe you need help with your delusion for this team even after being 2-9-1
But there is no Connor Bedard at the end of this years rainbow, and in all likelihood, that first round pick we accumulate will likely be used to get rid of a bad contract or be part of a another deal somewhere, so I'll take the wins when they come.
 

CycloneSweep

Registered User
Sep 27, 2017
48,622
40,371
Not now, certainly. Surely you’re not dropping McDavid like a stone because of a bad stint? Most people here think he’s the best player in the world. If he is the best player in the world, 10-11 games shouldn’t change that. He’ll come back.
Im not saying drop him like a stone.
I am saying that a team with 2 top 10 players in the world playing like average NHLers, on top of how bad our goaltending is, is how you get a team this bad.
 

CrazyJoeDavola

Registered User
Jun 17, 2011
3,552
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image0.jpg
 

kevy9999

Registered User
Mar 10, 2023
425
294
I don’t understand how a team with two of the, say, 10 top players in the league and one that has done well in playoffs the last two seasons can be so bad. If they lose this next game, look out.
Top 10? They have been the top 2 for years
 

KlefDown

I adore Soli
May 2, 2014
9,923
8,437
But there is no Connor Bedard at the end of this years rainbow, and in all likelihood, that first round pick we accumulate will likely be used to get rid of a bad contract or be part of a another deal somewhere, so I'll take the wins when they come.
I'm not talking about losing for draft picks, I'm talking about losing so our whole front office and bobbo can be kicked to the streets
 

Stoneman89

Registered User
Feb 8, 2008
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Im not saying drop him like a stone.
I am saying that a team with 2 top 10 players in the world playing like average NHLers, on top of how bad our goaltending is, is how you get a team this bad.
I really believe McDavid is hurt and he is playing through it. Not sure what Draisaitl's problem is though.

I'm not talking about losing for draft picks, I'm talking about losing so our whole front office and bobbo can be kicked to the streets
If we beat San Jose and then lose the next batch, don't worry, there will be changes.
 
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5 Mins 4 Ftg

Life is better with no expectations.
Sponsor
Apr 3, 2016
49,364
82,803
Edmonton
The only thing I didn't hate about this game was the Drai, Hollo, Foegs line. So, I'm pretty sure Woody will blow that thing up.

Woody can’t help himself. He will have the effective Bako duo sitting along with Holloway by the middle of the game despite them all showing more life than Janmark who got promoted to the top line and Brown. Hopefully McLoed stays on McDavids wing as McLoed is useless as a 3C.
 
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guymez

The Seldom Seen Kid
Mar 3, 2004
33,367
13,208
Pro athletes usually don’t throw their coaches under the bus. Even if they should be. I don’t think no one speaking up about Schwartz means much at all.
I am just having a hard time beleiveing that a garbage goalie coach manages to survive mutliple management teams. This same terrible coach also managed to help Talbot have his best 2 years as a starting goalie.
I think the more likely scenario is that the goalies here just havent been very good.
 

KlefDown

I adore Soli
May 2, 2014
9,923
8,437
I am just having a hard time beleiveing that a garbage goalie coach manages to survive mutliple management teams. This same terrible coach also managed to help Talbot have his best 2 years as a starting goalie.
I think the more likely scenario is that the goalies here just havent been very good.
Go read the fire Dustin Schwartz thread. All the evidence you need is in there. Not sure what you’re having a hard time believing
 

guymez

The Seldom Seen Kid
Mar 3, 2004
33,367
13,208
Go read the fire Dustin Schwartz thread. All the evidence you need is in there. Not sure what you’re having a hard time believing
The only thing in that thread is a collective emotional meltdown
Ill pass thanks.

I get it the fans want blood. I would rather take a step back (away form the boiling emotions) and take a 20,000 foot view.
The goalie coach is well down the list. As I said...the vast majority of the goalies here for the past 5+ years have been underwhelming at best and thats because they just arent that good.
 

The Panther

Registered User
Mar 25, 2014
19,285
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Tokyo, Japan
There are obviously roster and contract-issues with the Oilers (duh!) going back to the Chiarelli-legacy effect, but in my opinion---and, of course, this is only speculation as a distant observer (really distant, in my case)---the core problems with the Oilers are not coaching, or goaltending (horrible as it's been this season), or even defence-core (relatively poor as it is).

In my opinion, there are 2 fundamental problems with the Oilers, and it's largely been the same 2 fundamental problems since autumn 2017:

1) Leadership / Personality issues with the core players

2) Lack of bottom-six forward support


To point (1), I think it's now clear that the collective of Nurse, Drai, Nuge, and McDavid do not have the winning mentality of Messier, Gretzky, Lowe, Kurri, etc. We're in a very different era when young players are mollycoddled more and are protected more from the media and public by the team, which has its good points, but which also means we may arbitrarily end up with a "leadership" group with all the leadership capacity and charisma of the members of a high-school chess club. Nurse has an incredible inability to learn from his own mistakes and improve his game---he literally has learned nothing since the Anaheim gave 5 choke in 2017. Nuge is melted-butter soft and doesn't show up in the first half of seasons. McDavid has shown great mental fortitude at times, but he often gets visibly frustrated and has the personality of a wet noodle on camera, which makes me guess he has a similarly vacant personality in the room. And Draisaitl cannot control himself when he gets frustrated, specializing in stupid penalties at key times. Look at the last game -- the score was 4-2 with eighteen minutes left. It's still a winnable game if everyone stays focused. Instead, Drai and McDavid (like Crosby's meltdown in 2012, but he learned from it) start taking penalties and misconducts, just throwing in the towel early.

And what can be said about point (2) that isn't obvious? The reason the Oilers exceeded expectations in 2016-17 was that they had an actual bottom-six that supported the top guys. As noted, there currently is 1 secondary assist and 1 empty-net-goal assist from the bottom six on the season. This isn't rocket science. It doesn't matter if you have 150-point guys up front, or if you have 85-point guys up front. Neither situation is winning anything unless you have support across the four lines in the line-up.


Unless the Oilers quickly address these 2 fundamental issues, I can't see them going anywhere. They can fire Woodcroft (whom I basically like, btw) and hire the 57th coach in Nuge's tenure (what's the definition of insanity again?), and they can trade for a mid-level goaltender, or they can acquire a bottom-4 defenceman, etc. It's all nice, but none of those things is going to address either of the two fundamental problems.
 

Soundwave

Registered User
Mar 1, 2007
72,159
27,861
The only thing in that thread is a collective emotional meltdown
Ill pass thanks.

I get it the fans want blood. I would rather take a step back (away form the boiling emotions) and take a 20,000 foot view.
The goalie coach is well down the list. As I said...the vast majority of the goalies here for the past 5+ years have been underwhelming at best and thats because they just arent that good.

Isn't that how this organization gets into these binds ... by keeping incompetent people around for longer than they should?

Schwartz has said himself he was instrumental in getting the Oilers to choose Campbell over Kuemper.

He should be held accountable for that. Fire his ass, hire Mike Smith's goalie coach and maybe Smith himself to be an interim fit and see how that goes. It can't get much worse.
 

Ritchie Valens

Registered User
Sep 24, 2007
28,949
40,542
I really believe McDavid is hurt and he is playing through it. Not sure what Draisaitl's problem is though.


If we beat San Jose and then lose the next batch, don't worry, there will be changes.
Maybe they're like twins...one gets hurt and the other feels the same pain.

It's all I got.
 
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Ritchie Valens

Registered User
Sep 24, 2007
28,949
40,542
The only thing in that thread is a collective emotional meltdown
Ill pass thanks.

I get it the fans want blood. I would rather take a step back (away form the boiling emotions) and take a 20,000 foot view.
The goalie coach is well down the list. As I said...the vast majority of the goalies here for the past 5+ years have been underwhelming at best and thats because they just arent that good.
I wish I could remember what goalie it was, but I remember it being posted once upon a time...I want to say Talbot but it may have been Brossoit. Hell, it might have been Smith. One of them was interviewed about having a good year and they said the goalie coach he worked with helped him to fix some fundamental flaws in his positioning, namely standing up more and not going down so early and his glove hand.

The trademark flaws of a Dustin Schwartz graduate.
 

Tarus

Registered User
Jun 22, 2006
9,435
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Edmonton
I wish I could remember what goalie it was, but I remember it being posted once upon a time...I want to say Talbot but it may have been Brossoit. Hell, it might have been Smith. One of them was interviewed about having a good year and they said the goalie coach he worked with helped him to fix some fundamental flaws in his positioning, namely standing up more and not going down so early and his glove hand.

The trademark flaws of a Dustin Schwartz graduate.
It was Smith who worked with a new goaltending coach in the offseason after having a bad year, focusing more on positioning and less on falling on his stomach and relying so much on his reflexes to make saves since he was getting older and couldn't keep playing that way. The problem with the whole narrative that "Smith got a new coach" is that Smith also credited Schwartz with helping him solidify his new techniques he learned over the summer when he got injured early on in the season that year.

No one knows what Schwartz is doing behind the scenes, they just want someone to point at and say "it's that guy's fault, get him!". Exact same thing happened with Chabot a decade ago. Despite supposedly overwhelming evidence that he ruined Dubnyk, Chabot was brought to Minnesota to work with Dubnyk when the goaltender got his career back on track after getting away from Eakins.
 

guymez

The Seldom Seen Kid
Mar 3, 2004
33,367
13,208
It was Smith who worked with a new goaltending coach in the offseason after having a bad year, focusing more on positioning and less on falling on his stomach and relying so much on his reflexes to make saves since he was getting older and couldn't keep playing that way. The problem with the whole narrative that "Smith got a new coach" is that Smith also credited Schwartz with helping him solidify his new techniques he learned over the summer when he got injured early on in the season that year.

No one knows what Schwartz is doing behind the scenes, they just want someone to point at and say "it's that guy's fault, get him!". Exact same thing happened with Chabot a decade ago. Despite supposedly overwhelming evidence that he ruined Dubnyk, Chabot was brought to Minnesota to work with Dubnyk when the goaltender got his career back on track after getting away from Eakins.
I wish I could remember what goalie it was, but I remember it being posted once upon a time...I want to say Talbot but it may have been Brossoit. Hell, it might have been Smith. One of them was interviewed about having a good year and they said the goalie coach he worked with helped him to fix some fundamental flaws in his positioning, namely standing up more and not going down so early and his glove hand.

The trademark flaws of a Dustin Schwartz graduate.
Aside from agreeing with the excellent point about Chabot I think that the bolded portion of @Tarus' post pretty much sums it up for me.

 
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BlackDogg

There is nothing to do in Mockingbird Heights
Oct 3, 2015
41,585
42,229
This season is great because I look forward to nights where the Oilers aren't playing more. And there's more of those days. Thank you.
 

yababy

Registered User
Jun 26, 2015
3,441
828
I wish Skinner and Campbell both bombed in the preseason. It might’ve forced Holland to make that trade for Ullmark.
Campbell went from an NHL goalie with LA, Toronto where his save pct was over .900, to a well under .900 save pct and he looks like a minor league goalie.

Devan Dubnyk looked like a minor league goalie in Edmonton to Vezina calibre in Minnesota.

Clearly the Oilers organization has been poorly managed for decades now.

The last 1D they had was Pronger - 17 years ago! Are you fricking kidding me?
 

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