Player Discussion Alexandar Georgiev

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

I understand that he is stuck in an odd spot: following an all-time great and in front of a kid who has us all droooling, but what really is Georgiev? What is is ultimate upside? Is he a product of Allaire? What is his future here and/orin this league? Is he nothing more than fodder for Seattle?

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[GAGLine]

Hank's contract will be expiring and Shesty won't be eligible for expansion, so we will be able to protect Georgiev. I'm sure we'll sign someone that we can expose.

The real question will be playing time. Maybe Shesty plays in the AHL and gets some time in the NHL due to injuries or just to give him a look, but I don't think we can do that for 2 years. Maybe we end up trading Georgiev, but we've got to be sure that Shesty is the real deal before we do, and we'll need to see him in NHL games to do that.

Unless Hank retires early or agrees to a trade, I'm not sure how we will make it work. We could carry 3 goalies, I suppose, but that is far from ideal.

 

[NYR Viper]

I am thinking next year goes something like this, ideally:

In NHL:
Hank - 52 games
Georgiev - 15 games
Shestyorkin - 15 games

In AHL:
Georgiev - 35 games
Shestyorkin - 35 games

Something around there would be good for both.

I actually really like Georgiev's game. He's calm and seems unflappable. Everyone praises his work ethic and he battles in net. I know we all drool over Shestyorkin but the simple matter is he hasn't proven anything, as of yet, on this side of the pond away from a very good KHL team.

 

[Crease]

Too early to call, but I currently see Georgiev having a Talbot-like career. I'd hang on to him for as long as he's content getting 25-30ish starts.

 

[Miamipuck]

He's what? 22, no idea where the trajectory is on his career but you have to figure he gets better. He's seeing lots of shots behind a shit show of a defense.

I am not penciling in Shesty for anything. I do not believe the stats he has and want to see him here before I make any judgments or prediction.

Keep AG around and hopefully he continues to get better. He has an immense amount of talent.

 

[True Blue]

I understand that he is stuck in an odd spot: following an all-time great and in front of a kid who has us all droooling, but what really is Georgiev? What is is ultimate upside? Is he a product of Allaire? What is his future here and/orin this league? Is he nothing more than fodder for Seattle?

Great topic and question. Clearly I have no answer, but I think that if there's anything that history has taught us is that this is worth exploring.

I like that Quinn has see fit to split the games. Honestly, no one wants to hear it, but I would be open to Shesty starting in Hartford and having Henke and Georgiev continue to split the games. In our wildest dreams, after Henke retires, we get a Weekes/young Henke scenario.

I do think that Allaire needs to be given credit. I watched some of Georgiev's saves yesterday and sounds of "Be there and be square" rang.

 

[Kovalev27]

I’m not so sure shesterkin is better or worse than Georgiev im going to need to see what makes him so much better because honestly they’re very similar players and Georgiev has a head start on him while also being younger.

 

[Edge]

I am thinking next year goes something like this, ideally:

In NHL:
Hank - 52 games
Georgiev - 15 games
Shestyorkin - 15 games

In AHL:
Georgiev - 35 games
Shestyorkin - 35 games

Something around there would be good for both.

I actually really like Georgiev's game. He's calm and seems unflappable. Everyone praises his work ethic and he battles in net. I know we all drool over Shestyorkin but the simple matter is he hasn't proven anything, as of yet, on this side of the pond away from a very good KHL team.

That feels awkward for Georgiev, coming off a season in which he'll probably finish with around 30 games, and have around 40 career NHL games already under his belt.

"Hey man, your workload this season is going to be 15, but we'll give you time in the AHL to shine."

My guess is that the Rangers wait to see what they have in Shesterkin, and will probably start the rookie in Hartford.

 

[Edge]

I’m not so sure shesterkin is better or worse than Georgiev im going to need to see what makes him so much better because honestly they’re very similar players and Georgiev has a head start on him while also being younger.

Ultimately, that's what the Rangers will have to make sure they find out.

Pre-NHL you could make the argument that Shesterkin was a bit more impressive against better competition. But a lot of that can quickly go out the window when we compare them in a similar setting.

 

[Off Sides]

I'm going to guess, next season is the one where Lundqvist gets less starts than he will like to get.

This is always such a touchy subject, they've asked him if he was on board with a rebuild at least once, maybe twice. Part of a rebuild is the vets playing less and looking to be replaced.

Yes that is kind of cold, yet what else is eventually going to happen one way or another?

 

[will1066]

I've liked Georgiev's lateral movement too, in addition to the positives that others have said above.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

He's shown flashes that make you think he could potentially be a starter. But goalies are so hard to project, it's hard to say what he is longer term

 

[Kovalev27]

The thing I don’t like about Georgiev and Shesterkin is they still lack in size. When people say yeah but they’re the same size as lundqvist well yes they are but lundqvist is a generational talent a hall of gamer super star. It’s a ridiculous comparison. Fact of the matter is they are both undersized compared to top starting goaltenders in this league.

I personally don’t see one (shesterkin/Georgiev) being so much better than the other at least right now.

 

[nyr2k2]

The thing I don’t like about Georgiev and Shesterkin is they still lack in size. When people say yeah but they’re the same size as lundqvist well yes they are but lundqvist is a generational talent a hall of gamer super star. It’s a ridiculous comparison. Fact of the matter is they are both undersized compared to top starting goaltenders in this league.

I personally don’t see one (shesterkin/Georgiev) being so much better than the other at least right now.

This is certainly true with both of them being 6'1" (although I wouldn't be surprised to see Shesterkin become 6'2" when he gets here). However, there are lots of good goalies in that size range.

5'11": Halak, Khudobin, Saros
6'0": Hutton
6'1": Quick, Lundqvist, Howard, Allen
6'2": Greiss, Gibson, Fleury, Varlamov, Holtby, Bobrovsky

I can't in good conscience include Casey DeSmith on this list with the other, established guys, but he has been a good backup/timeshare goalie for Pittsburgh two years in a row, and he's 6'0". And there are more guys on the list, this was just from looking at SV% leaders with a minimum of 25 games.

Anyway, the two are definitely a little smaller than average, but it's not like the QB position in the NFL where literally everyone has to be 6'0", with extremely few exceptions. In the NHL as a goalie I think you can do really well for yourself, even if you're not a small forward like Ben Bishop.

 

[sark76]

It's time to let go hank...for both of our futures.

 

[Kovalev27]

This is certainly true with both of them being 6'1" (although I wouldn't be surprised to see Shesterkin become 6'2" when he gets here). However, there are lots of good goalies in that size range.

5'11": Halak, Khudobin, Saros
6'0": Hutton
6'1": Quick, Lundqvist, Howard, Allen
6'2": Greiss, Gibson, Fleury, Varlamov, Holtby, Bobrovsky

I can't in good conscience include Casey DeSmith on this list with the other, established guys, but he has been a good backup/timeshare goalie for Pittsburgh two years in a row, and he's 6'0". And there are more guys on the list, this was just from looking at SV% leaders with a minimum of 25 games.

Anyway, the two are definitely a little smaller than average, but it's not like the QB position in the NFL where literally everyone has to be 6'0", with extremely few exceptions. In the NHL as a goalie I think you can do really well for yourself, even if you're not a small forward like Ben Bishop.

Once you go below 6’2 there’s a drop off. Obviously hank and quick are hall of famers most likely. They’re the exception to the rule for good reason but if you look at that list if your 6’1 or shorter and your name isn’t Henrik Lundqvist or Jonathan Quick you’re not a top end #1 goalie in this league. That’s all I’m saying is the odds are against both our kids and I’ve been saying this for years on this board and not much has changed. Smaller guys aren’t coming in and becoming stars at that position

 

[nyr2k2]

Once you go below 6’2 there’s a drop off. Obviously hank and quick are hall of famers most likely. They’re the exception to the rule for good reason but if you look at that list if your 6’1 or shorter and your name isn’t Henrik Lundqvist or Jonathan Quick you’re not a top end #1 goalie in this league. That’s all I’m saying is the odds are against both our kids and I’ve been saying this for years on this board and not much has changed. Smaller guys aren’t coming in and becoming stars at that position

I understand your point, it's more difficult. And mine is that being undersized at the position doesn't preclude you from being at least a very good goalie, if not a great one. And the difference between 6'1" and 6'2" can literally be how the team chooses to list you. If you lined up a bunch of 6'0" hockey players and a bunch of 6'1" hockey players, I bet half of the guys in the 6'1" line would be the same size or shorter than the guys in the 6'0" line. So maybe Georgiev and Shesterkin are actually shorter? Maybe their size is correct but, say, Holtby and Bobrovsky are 6'1"? Who really knows.

I guess my secondary but more important point is that it seems silly to worry about size when we don't actually know their size or have any idea if it's an issue for them. Any struggles I've seen from Georgiev, I wouldn't chalk up to his size.

 

[romba]

He looks great out there starting with making the saves he should. Is he making some spectacular ones? Sure. But the limited amount of softies are fantastic.

 

[haveandare]

I think Georgiev is better than he gets credit for. If Shestyorkin weren't in the system and playing like he's been playing, I suspect we'd all be a lot more excited about Georgiev. He's had ups and down like any goalie to start their career but he's also younger than the vast majority of "young" NHL goalies and he's had some really stellar stretches already.

As far as the plan for next year, IMO you bring everyone to camp and let them decide with their play. The best goalie, almost 100% Hank, is starter, second best is backup, the one who can probably still benefit from AHL time goes down regardless of who it is.

Ideal outcome is Igor is head and shoulders better than Georgiev, Georgiev is obviously too good for the AHL and we can move Georgiev for an asset.

 

[True Blue]

Ideal outcome is Igor is head and shoulders better than Georgiev, Georgiev is obviously too good for the AHL and we can move Georgiev for an asset.

Makes for a very dicey situation, sending Georgiev back with the way he is playing right now. And his body of work is not nearly enough to fetch a good asset.

 

[romba]

Makes for a very dicey situation, sending Georgiev back with the way he is playing right now. And his body of work is not nearly enough to fetch a good asset.

Yea it's a solid point. The asset would be a very late round draft pick or C level prospect at best. No one is giving up anything of value for AG at this point unfortunately. Even IS, who's way more hyped, wouldn't return much at this point. Teams want to see 100+ games at the NHL level before committing anything substantial. Goalies are just too big a crapshoot- often the biggest names end up busting, and good ones appear out of nowhere.

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Idk how you feel, but the kid looks so poised and confident. Needs more games to see if he could actually start. Judging from his attitude, he absolutely could.

He's got sick reflexes, isn't the most flexible though. Shesty is a slinky for example. I feel Georgie is mentally very strong.

To me, he looks like a beautiful goalie asset that we can trade. The back-up factory is still going. Let's cash in properly this time.

 

[Bob Richards]

George as a young, cheap, start eating goalie who can be pretty solid >>>>>> whatever made up future considerations draft pick a team will give us for him in a trade.

 

[romba]

Idk how you feel, but the kid looks so poised and confident. Needs more games to see if he could actually start. Judging from his attitude, he absolutely could.

He's got sick reflexes, isn't the most flexible though. Shesty is a slinky for example. I feel Georgie is mentally very strong.

To me, he looks like a beautiful goalie asset that we can trade. The back-up factory is still going. Let's cash in properly this time.

Examples of less flexibility? You mean style? Or using the splits more often like Hank tends to? I think that's more style related but I could be wrong.

Also, no backup goalie is yielding anything worth trading, no matter how young. Cambot had a decent return but he took the reigns that season for a while when Hank went down and the team didn't miss a beat, and that's what sold teams on him.

 

[eco's bones]

I think Georgiev is the real deal. I also think that Shestyorkin will be too. I'm not convinced that Igor's going to be better than Alexandar though. I'm also thinking that Henrik's not going to get another contract from us when this one is up. Still if Georgiev and Shestyorkin are both legit No. 1's I think we would eventually move one or the other. They are just about the same age.