Player Discussion: Aatu Raty (2021 52nd OA)

[BarzyClub]

There was a reason why Mikael Granlund left from Kärpät at early stage, Aho, Puljujärvi struggled too.

It wouldn’t surprise me if Lou brought Raty over early to develop him in the AHL as he did with Holmstrom.

 

[behemolari]

It wouldn’t surprise me if Lou brought Raty over early to develop him in the AHL as he did with Holmstrom.

Kärpät is so competitive it would be wise move

 

[SCMURRAY]

It wouldn’t surprise me if Lou brought Raty over early to develop him in the AHL as he did with Holmstrom.

Hopefully not

 

[Isles Junkie]

It wouldn’t surprise me if Lou brought Raty over early to develop him in the AHL as he did with Holmstrom.

I thought he's under contract for 1 more year? Unless they release him, how can Lou get him over any quicker than 2022-23?

 

[The Winter Soldier]

 

[The Winter Soldier]

And

Per NHL.com

"It was a tough season for me on [Karpat], but I played for one of the best organizations in Finland," Raty said. "I think it's one of the most defensive leagues in the whole world, so we just had better centers than I, so I couldn't get any minutes. I don't know if (Edmonton Oilers center Connor) McDavid is going to score when he's playing eight minutes (per game)." Stubb said expectations prior to the 2021 Draft might have been overwhelming for Raty.



"The talent was always there," Stubb said. "He just had a tough season; there were a lot of expectations on him. He made the Karpat league team, and Karpat is one of the top clubs in Finland and has been for so many years. They had a tough season, though, and when you're a young player on a struggling team, it's not easy to play up to your own standard. I still think Raty will be a [heck] of a hockey player, he just had a rough season."

 

[BarzyClub]

I thought he's under contract for 1 more year? Unless they release him, how can Lou get him over any quicker than 2022-23?

Good point. I wasn’t aware of his contract status just pointing out that there is a precedent with Lou and Holmstrom.

 

[Isles Junkie]

If you gave McDavid 8 minutes per game he probably still scores at least 50 points.

 

[seafoam]

If you gave McDavid 8 minutes per game he probably still scores at least 50 points.

I think he was exaggerating his example to make his point

 

[Stoat]

Kärpät is so competitive it would be wise move

I have to disagree. He will get a good chance this season with PP time and playing high minutes.

It's the guys below Räty and Tuomaala that might want to find more ice time somewhere else.

 

[Isles Junkie]

I think he was exaggerating his example to make his point

yeah I get it. I was curious though. I got so far as finding out how many points McDavid averages, then how much ice time he averages, then I gave up on the algebra as I really don't know the formula. either way, I like my guess of 50 points.

 

[Osakahaus]

There was a reason why Mikael Granlund left from Kärpät at early stage, Aho, Puljujärvi struggled too.

Is Karpat a good team in finland anyways? I'm not so sure what to expect in Liiga teams

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

If you gave McDavid 8 minutes per game he probably still scores at least 50 points.

Shucks, then this kid is not going to be another McDavid.

 

[Islesfan22]

Shucks, then this kid is not going to be another McDavid.

If Rata can give us what Frans gave us I’d think we would all be happy with that. Anything better is a bonus.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Really like Stubb's thoughts above. And Aatu is profoundly astute to point out even McDavid would have a hard time putting up points in 8 mins of TOI in a defensive league. Not as an excuse, but as a reason for Raty's production last year.

 

[Wanderson]

It wouldn’t surprise me if Lou brought Raty over early to develop him in the AHL as he did with Holmstrom.

Holmström came over because he wasn’t good enough to crack HV71’s roster. This is different.

 

[seafoam]

Shucks, then this kid is not going to be another McDavid.

With all due respect, I don't log in ~5 times a week because you are funny. Do you have opinion on Raty as a prospect and what he projects to be for this organization?

If you already spoke on that, feel free to let me know and I will search it. I'm quite intrigued by this guy, "hitting" on these early-mid round picks is what keeps organization's windows open for longer and I think we all agree this team's window seems like it's been the next 12-18 months since Lamoriello has arrived.

 

[SI90]

Good point. I wasn’t aware of his contract status just pointing out that there is a precedent with Lou and Holmstrom.

I could be wrong but I think he has an out clause for the AHL/NHL

For example he wouldn’t be allowed to go to Juniors but he could play pro in North America.

 

[sleb]

<OT>

There was a reason why Mikael Granlund left from Kärpät at early stage, Aho, Puljujärvi struggled too.

Lets hear about the reason then. Examples you've given somehow tells me you got none.

Granlund case was planned way before the "scandalious" parting with Kärpät happened. Kärpät handled it badly, but the reason why the whole family left to Helsinki was nothing Kärpät had to do with directly.

Aho or Puljujärvi struggled? That's just complete and utter bullshit. Aho scored the FEL Championship deciding goal in 7th game OT as a 17-year old. Then went PPG in the next season and over it in the playoffs. That's struggling? Or do you mean the time when the roster just was so stacked he couldn't get a spot and was loaned to Ässät? Kid took the chance, proved he is good enough for a roster spot and kept on developing and performing. That's somehow struggling? Puljujärvi struggled just because he wasn't mature enough, and that wasn't anything the team could do, as we all remember what happened in his first stint in the Oilers. But what happened next? Oh yeah, he came back home to "struggle"? f*** no, kid came to get his composure back, changed his game and is now back on developing track, not a bust what it seemed like.

If you need to talk about struggling players in Kärpät system, there's Arttu Ruotsalainen as an example. who just couldn't outperform his peers for a shot. Those peers happened to be Aho and Puljujärvi, with Kalapudas and such. It isn't easy.

Reason why one prospect struggles in Kärpät? Yes you guessed it: it is highly competitive. That's only a good thing, because if you show you can compete and come on top, you're proven you're ready for the next step. I'd take a player who didn't shy away from a challenge 10/10, rather than a player who left to find an easier path. Competition is nothing but a good thing in developing players, this isn't f***ing Nuori Suomi anymore. </OT>

And back to topic. Rätys next year will be much more telling about his projection, rather than the past. He is healthy now, and most likely will play full season up with Kärpät FEL team.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

With all due respect, I don't log in ~5 times a week because you are funny. Do you have opinion on Raty as a prospect and what he projects to be for this organization?

If you already spoke on that, feel free to let me know and I will search it. I'm quite intrigued by this guy, "hitting" on these early-mid round picks is what keeps organization's windows open for longer and I think we all agree this team's window seems like it's been the next 12-18 months since Lamoriello has arrived.

I've shared some thoughts on Raty, particularly in the draft thread.

I'm very, very happy with this pick. Had we kept our 1st (pick 28 or 29), I would have been very happy to get him there as well.

I have little doubts about his ability and desire to become an effective NHLer.

And we have the bonus that there are some skills there that he's flashed in the past, so it's all about him figuring it all out and finding a way to implement them into his game on a more regular basis.

 

[buud]

watching the interview, he seemed to be a bit... somber? yeah, i get that he was disappointed that he wasn't drafted in the 1st round, but i would think that he would just be happy. almost everyone celebrating, and he pouts (looks like it, anyway).

i thought his answers were right on. said all the right things, but most kids with half a brain, learn what to spout.

watched a few videos, and he looked great. skating was weak, but so were most of the players on the ice.

i get the feeling that he is going to need to be worked with, mentally. word was that he lost his confidence last year, so hopefully, he can start looking forward, and quit pouting about the draft (if he was. i don't know him, so i don't know what his nature is like).

i'm hard on him, sure, but i recognize that he is still just a kid. trusting that LL and BT work with this kid, and turn him into a 1st line monster.

 

[Whyme]

<OT>

Lets hear about the reason then. Examples you've given somehow tells me you got none.

Granlund case was planned way before the "scandalious" parting with Kärpät happened. Kärpät handled it badly, but the reason why the whole family left to Helsinki was nothing Kärpät had to do with directly.

Aho or Puljujärvi struggled? That's just complete and utter bullshit. Aho scored the FEL Championship deciding goal in 7th game OT as a 17-year old. Then went PPG in the next season and over it in the playoffs. That's struggling? Or do you mean the time when the roster just was so stacked he couldn't get a spot and was loaned to Ässät? Kid took the chance, proved he is good enough for a roster spot and kept on developing and performing. That's somehow struggling? Puljujärvi struggled just because he wasn't mature enough, and that wasn't anything the team could do, as we all remember what happened in his first stint in the Oilers. But what happened next? Oh yeah, he came back home to "struggle"? f*** no, kid came to get his composure back, changed his game and is now back on developing track, not a bust what it seemed like.

If you need to talk about struggling players in Kärpät system, there's Arttu Ruotsalainen as an example. who just couldn't outperform his peers for a shot. Those peers happened to be Aho and Puljujärvi, with Kalapudas and such. It isn't easy.

Reason why one prospect struggles in Kärpät? Yes you guessed it: it is highly competitive. That's only a good thing, because if you show you can compete and come on top, you're proven you're ready for the next step. I'd take a player who didn't shy away from a challenge 10/10, rather than a player who left to find an easier path. Competition is nothing but a good thing in developing players, this isn't f***ing Nuori Suomi anymore. </OT>

And back to topic. Rätys next year will be much more telling about his projection, rather than the past. He is healthy now, and most likely will play full season up with Kärpät FEL team.

I write just quickly as following out own youngsters have been my passion and while I may be wrong in many things I firmly believe this truth (which is kind of in the middle) is pretty much the correct truth

Granlund: Fans wanted Granlund to the roster long before Kärpät reacted and it was too late by that time. HIFK obviously offered more resposibility and salary and at the time Kärpät was a bit of a mess. What bothered me was there were some nobodys in the roster but no chance for Granlund. It's possible Granlund wanted to move to Helsinki, but I'm sure Kärpät could've found a way to keep him. In the end losing Granlund cost his brother Granlund, too.

Aho: Got a place in the roster when his offensive production was very limited and at the time I felt a big reason was that his dad was the sports boss in the team. Anyway, he ended up scoring a champion-winning goal (7th final OT) and was a beast next year so this was perfectly done from the team.

Puljujarvi: IMO he would've deserved to be kept in the team two years before the draft as he wasn't the worst forward in the team, but all in all good job from the team/organisation anyway with Pulju.

Saarijärvi and Kuokkanen: We lost them too easily, but I won't get deeper.
NHL, but he didn't perform strongly at all.

Arttu Ruotsalainen: I understand Kärpät can't keep everyone but I'm not 100% sure there was nothing they could do about keeping Ruotsalainen. I agree it's hard with the young talents you mentioned, but sometimes one could be creative. Like sign a contract and rent the player to a smaller FEL team for some time. Worked with Aho and could've worked with Ruotsalainen too. Or maybe spend a bit more to make the veterans slightly better than they are and thus give one more roster place to a youngster. But like I said I also understand some talents are lost on the way.

Topi Niemelä: Still in the team, a very promising future NHL defender. Good job with him so no complaints.


I won't get back to this topic as I don't want to get deeper and I've got a busy day ahead. Well this is a bit OT anyway. As my final note I'd like to say in general Kärpät is an extremely good team when it comes to junior work. But there's been some bad failures and they failed badly with handling Räty. But I believe this season will be different and Kärpät AND Räty will do better. Everything's still possible, the extreme talent hasn't gone anywhere.

 

[Stoat]

But there's been some bad failures and they failed badly with handling Räty. But I believe this season will be different and Kärpät AND Räty will do better.

Other stuff you mentioned didn't have much to do with Räty. Can you be clear what bad failures Kärpät did with Aatu Räty and how they failed badly with handling him?

 

[Whyme]

Other stuff you mentioned didn't have much to do with Räty. Can you be clear what bad failures Kärpät did with Aatu Räty and how they failed badly with handling him?

Yeah sorry for the OT. I'll write quickly as it's a busy day. I'll let anyone decide whatever they feel is the best way to treat a young super prospect, but IMO Kärpät did everything wrong at the start of the season after Räty having a pretty promising preseason. I don't have the time to dig further, but this is the situation at the end of November 2020 after his first six games (things continued rough until much later, but this is the quickest way to provide some info):

- 5 different combinations around him in 6 played games: 9 different linamates in the 6 games (theoretical maximum 12)
- average TOI 10 minutes per game
- the team had played 13 games, of which Räty was in the popcorn section in 7 games
-no PP usage

Then they sent him to the juniors and Räty's confidence was already shattered. Some media guys were critical towards Kärpät at the time, this is one example from one of the main magazines:

https://www.is.fi/sm-liiga/art-2000007654947.html

Some quick quotes:
- Räty has given a mature impression of himself. However, it's enourmously much to demand a barely 18-year-old young player to understand why he is treated in a totally different way from other Finnish super prospects. It may be destructive to the cofidence to watch how for example 16-year-old Brad Lambert plays at the crucial moments of the games in the JYP (FEL) team and is accelerating his career in a speed lane even though his game is also far from ready.

- Now it unfortunately seems Räty has lost his confidence in the most important season of his short career and his game in the U20 hasn't been scoring points at the expected rate either. Why would Räty then need to be given more chances? It's clear the Finnish player production shows young players have taken huge steps in their development if they are, despite the early difficulties, pushed even with some force to important (responsible) roles. At the critical age a small spike in self confidence can be crucial for the player to see that he can use his strengths at the FEL level. Then the steps forward can be very clear.

Sorry for typos and language mistakes, I really have to go now and can't check what I wrote. I hope it opens the situation a bit more.

 

[saintunspecified]

I have little doubts about his ability and desire to become an effective NHLer.

What seems odd to me is that in a draft where there are so many unknowns that a high-floor player with upside (what you describe, correct?) would be left till the 2nd round. But hey, I know less and less every passing day.