GDT: #80: FLYERS at Stars, Tuesday, April 2, 2019, 8:30 p.m. ET

[Larry44]

I told you guys, he's a d****elord.

I can't read Asterixian, Cap, how do you feel about Benn? LOL!

 

[BiggE]

The Giroux Captaincy in a nutshell.

Yeah pretty much but I really don’t think Giroux is the main culprit.

 

[Outlaw Samurai]

Yeah pretty much but I really don’t think Giroux is the main culprit.

No way that's on G. The guy is a God for perservering with the crap coaches, system and drek at D he's saddled with.

He thrives and leads despite all this. Basically swimming with an anchor attached to him.

 

[BiggE]

No way that's on G. The guy is a God for perservering with the crap coaches, system and drek at D he's saddled with.

He thrives and leads despite all this. Basically swimming with an anchor attached to him.

It's a bad combo of some awful factors.
1. Bad coaching, they haven't had a decent coach since Laviolette.
2. Average to mediocre goaltending for much of the last 7 seasons
3. a bad mix of talented, but very inexperienced Dmen mixed with veterans who just aren't very good
4. a lack of size, grit and toughness throughout the lineup.
5. a lack of depth at forward when it comes to skill, speed and smarts

IMO, the mistake was trying to stay competitive while trying to rebuild at the same time. Wayne Simmonds should have been traded 2 years ago, the same for Voracek. Andrew MacDonald should have never been acquired, let alone re-signed. I'd rather of missed the playoffs 3 or 4 years in a row and have a much better team with an even deeper prospect pool than to have been a bubble team for over half a decade.

Hextall drafted and managed the cap well, but in all other facets of the job, he failed miserably.

 

[Striiker]

The Giroux Captaincy in a nutshell.

You're not actually blaming him even 1%, are you?

 

[landsbergfan]

It's a bad combo of some awful factors.

IMO, the mistake was trying to stay competitive while trying to rebuild at the same time. Wayne Simmonds should have been traded 2 years ago, the same for Voracek. Andrew MacDonald should have never been acquired, let alone re-signed. I'd rather of missed the playoffs 3 or 4 years in a row and have a much better team with an even deeper prospect pool than to have been a bubble team for over half a decade.

Hextall drafted and managed the cap well, but in all other facets of the job, he failed miserably.

The only good thing about this is that (if it hasn't killed their chance to win the cup) it will be something to brag about if they do. This was just a recipe to waste 4-5 years of our lives by pretending to be competitive and a handful of guys like Giroux kept the team from being the Detroit Red Wings

 

[Curufinwe]

Don't have enough skill or depth at forward, so the answer must be trade Voracek.

Missing the playoffs 4 years in a row doesn't guarantee the team will be better; all it guarantees is that you missed the playoffs 4 times in a row.

 

[Domino666]

Trading Jake isn’t the answer especially because who replaces his points?

 

[landsbergfan]

Trading Jake isn’t the answer especially because who replaces his points?

They hopefully don't replace his points out of respect

 

[deadhead]

You do what the Rangers have been doing, they're going to have 7 1st rd picks in 3 years, plus added a handful of prospects.
Hextall did that to some extent, 8 1st rd picks in 5 year, but added no prospects other than Hartman (24) and Weal.

 

[TheKingPin]

I’d trade Voracek if it meant we are getting Panarin, Stone, and whatever Jakes return was. I wouldn’t really want to trade him now.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

Varone is totally gonna finish this year VDV style while players like NAK won't even sniff nhl ice.

 

[Outlaw Samurai]

It's a bad combo of some awful factors.
1. Bad coaching, they haven't had a decent coach since Laviolette.
2. Average to mediocre goaltending for much of the last 7 seasons
3. a bad mix of talented, but very inexperienced Dmen mixed with veterans who just aren't very good
4. a lack of size, grit and toughness throughout the lineup.
5. a lack of depth at forward when it comes to skill, speed and smarts

IMO, the mistake was trying to stay competitive while trying to rebuild at the same time. Wayne Simmonds should have been traded 2 years ago, the same for Voracek. Andrew MacDonald should have never been acquired, let alone re-signed. I'd rather of missed the playoffs 3 or 4 years in a row and have a much better team with an even deeper prospect pool than to have been a bubble team for over half a decade.

Hextall drafted and managed the cap well, but in all other facets of the job, he failed miserably.

Agree BiggE, except for trading Voro. I don't think keeping him was a mistake (unless it was for a top line goal scorer).

 

[Larry44]

Yeah pretty much but I really don’t think Giroux is the main culprit.

Maybe not, but if you're a 'leader' and with no followers, are you a leader?

 

[BiggE]

Maybe not, but if you're a 'leader' and with no followers, are you a leader?

One single "leader" can only do so much. Look at the Cup teams. Sure Clarke was a fantastic captain, but he also had veterans like Ashbee, Van Impe, Joe Watson and Dornhoefer who played just as hard and often through tremendous pain. Same with the Keenan teams. It wasn't just Dave Poulin, but guys like Howe and Brad Marsh also gave every drop of everything they had each and every f***ing game.

More recently, we saw the same with Hitchcock's 03-04 bunch. Primeau set the tone, but guys like Roenick and Sami Kapanen were also giving every ounce of themselves and playing through some nasty injuries. And finally, the 07-08 through 09-10 seasons weren't good ones just because of the effort of Mike Richards. Rather guys like Hatcher and Jason Smith set the tone for that 07-08 team and players like Briere, Timonen, and of course Pronger and Lappy were leaving it all on the ice both literally and figuratively.

It can't just be Giroux. It needs to be a team wide commitment among the veterans to all play the game as hard as possible and set the tone for the entire team. On way too many nights this season, Giroux and Couturier were the only veterans doing so. It's not enough.

 

[FlyerNutter]

It's a bad combo of some awful factors.
1. Bad coaching, they haven't had a decent coach since Laviolette.
2. Average to mediocre goaltending for much of the last 7 seasons
3. a bad mix of talented, but very inexperienced Dmen mixed with veterans who just aren't very good
4. a lack of size, grit and toughness throughout the lineup.
5. a lack of depth at forward when it comes to skill, speed and smarts

IMO, the mistake was trying to stay competitive while trying to rebuild at the same time. Wayne Simmonds should have been traded 2 years ago, the same for Voracek. Andrew MacDonald should have never been acquired, let alone re-signed. I'd rather of missed the playoffs 3 or 4 years in a row and have a much better team with an even deeper prospect pool than to have been a bubble team for over half a decade.

Hextall drafted and managed the cap well, but in all other facets of the job, he failed miserably.

Solid post.

It’s been on my mind more and more, and I’m not sure there is a great answer, but they went into this thing trying to stay competitive while obviously rebuilding.

I’d have liked to see more true star power, as cliche as it sounds added to this mix throughout these purgatory years. The kids are good, but nobody even comes close to a Giroux level of skill right now.

They might develop into it, but there were benefits to tanking. Let’s see how this approach goes.

I dunno.

 

[landsbergfan]

You do what the Rangers have been doing, they're going to have 7 1st rd picks in 3 years, plus added a handful of prospects.
Hextall did that to some extent, 8 1st rd picks in 5 year, but added no prospects other than Hartman (24) and Weal.

They got no prospects of significant value, and Hextall did a better job picking his own prospects rather than take on guys other teams decided were expendable. What they did differently was actually bottom out so to speak, and to their credit set fanbase expectations that aligned with that, and picked higher in the draft. They still are in the same boat as us in terms of acquiring obvious franchise talent.

 

[Strawberry Fields]

Hagg needs the C because this team had only ever won the Stanley Cup with a captain named Bob. That is clearly the recipe for success.

 

[Striiker]

Solid post.

It’s been on my mind more and more, and I’m not sure there is a great answer, but they went into this thing trying to stay competitive while obviously rebuilding.

I’d have liked to see more true star power, as cliche as it sounds added to this mix throughout these purgatory years. The kids are good, but nobody even comes close to a Giroux level of skill right now.

They might develop into it, but there were benefits to tanking. Let’s see how this approach goes.

I dunno.

Frost

 

[FlyerNutter]

Frost

Yeah I thought about him. Would be awesome if he can turn into something really special.

 

[Striiker]

Yeah I thought about him. Would be awesome if he can turn into something really special.

Obviously we can’t know for sure, but he has the potential/talent to be a PPG player.

And don’t forget we still have Couturier and a raw version of Patrick. Even if we can’t fill Gs shoes when he eventually declines, we can hopefully replace his production by committee.

 

[BiggE]

Obviously we can’t know for sure, but he has the potential/talent to be a PPG player.

And don’t forget we still have Couturier and a raw version of Patrick. Even if we can’t fill Gs shoes when he eventually declines, we can hopefully replace his production by committee.

I think you can get by with production by committee but that comes with a caveat. The team who succeeded the most that way was the Devils. But they had a hall of fame stud goaltender and 2 hall of fame defensemen (Stevens (that P.O.S.) and Niedermayer) to back that committee up.

If you are going to win by this method, you need at least 2 of Provorov, Sanheim and Myers to be unquestionable top end, top pair guys and you need Hart to be that stud goaltender.

It could certainly happen, but if Frost can develop into a Giroux level offensive machine, so much the better.

 

[PhlthyRich]

Hagg needs the C because this team had only ever won the Stanley Cup with a captain named Bob. That is clearly the recipe for success.

I'm prob very late to the party, haven't been on last two days, but I'm assuming you saw Hagg call out the team?

 

[BiggE]

I'm prob very late to the party, haven't been on last two days, but I'm assuming you saw Hagg call out the team?

Yup, I didn't know whether to laugh, cry or throw up. While I don't knock Hagg's effort, having arguably the worst player on the team calling everyone else out is just surreal.

 

[Philly Fanatik]

No way that's on G. The guy is a God for perservering with the crap coaches, system and drek at D he's saddled with.

He thrives and leads despite all this. Basically swimming with an anchor attached to him.

And that anchor ain’t the Stanley Cup...