Post-Game Talk: #51 | Flyers at Jets | January 28, 2023

[renberg]

The main difference is that forwards and D play as one unit. That's it.

Hardly the revolution I was promised.

Not to totally disagree with you but having the forwards working with the defense hasn’t been going on around here for a while. Whoever is responsible for this deserves some credit.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Not to totally disagree with you but having the forwards working with the defense hasn’t been going on around here for a while. Whoever is responsible for this deserves some credit.

It was an AV system thing. Eakins also does it. I don't think playing basically competent hockey is that impressive, unfortunately. I do think it's a testament to how wretched both those coaches are, though.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

funny how when the team loss' 2 games in a row the fluff squad is quiet as church mice..

but when the team wins 2 its "buy buy buy" mode... hahaaa

They are tied for the NHL lead with 10 wins over the last month of play.

This isn’t about two games, & it isn’t about “buy buy buy.” It’s about enjoying good, enjoyable hockey virtually every night instead of being miserable.

 

[Beef Invictus]

They are tied for the NHL lead with 10 wins over the last month of play.

This isn’t about two games, & it isn’t about “buy buy buy.” It’s about enjoying good, enjoyable hockey virtually every night instead of being miserable.

Do you enjoy the team going nowhere every year? Would you like that to change so you can actually get enjoyable hockey all year instead of buying into month long shooting heaters?

 

[Flyerfan4life]

Do you enjoy the team going nowhere every year? Would you like that to change so you can actually get enjoyable hockey all year instead of buying into month long shooting heaters?

i think some of these people qenuinely enjoy the groundhog day effect of going nowere year after year after year with no end in sight..

its the weirdest thing yet every year its "cant you just enjoy the wins!"

 

[tucson83]

Do you enjoy the team going nowhere every year? Would you like that to change so you can actually get enjoyable hockey all year instead of buying into month long shooting heaters?

so you would rather enjoy losing every year and getting patrick and jvr clones and think it's going to make you a contender?

you dont put logic into anything, accept it will work for us because it worked for the sixers even though they havent won jack either and neither did the teams that have actually done it.

 

[Beef Invictus]

so you would rather enjoy losing every year and getting patrick and jvr clones and think it's going to make you a contender?

you dont put logic into anything, accept it will work for us because it worked for the sixers even though they havent won jack either and neither did the teams that have actually done it.

Why would I want them to get JVR and Patrick clones? Why do you think those are the only players in the draft? If you're going to slam my logic, maybe don't do it after saying something like that.

 

[Striiker]

People worry about AI but then I read these posts and realize we’re hundreds of years from it becoming a problem.

 

[Flyer lurker]

so you would rather enjoy losing every year and getting patrick and jvr clones and think it's going to make you a contender?

you dont put logic into anything, accept it will work for us because it worked for the sixers even though they havent won jack either and neither did the teams that have actually done it.

I have seen clones in the last 30 years of the front office of the flyers.

 

[tucson83]

Why would I want them to get JVR and Patrick clones? Why do you think those are the only players in the draft? If you're going to slam my logic, maybe don't do it after saying something like that.

because that's what you are going to end up getting if you dont luck into a top 5 pick, dont you get it that's calledd a lottery which it means luck and no guarantees?

 

[Cody Webster]

because that's what you are going to end up getting if you dont luck into a top 5 pick, dont you get it that's calledd a lottery which it means luck and no guarantees?

So it's Bedard and then everyone else completely sucks and is worthless?

 

[Beef Invictus]

because that's what you are going to end up getting if you dont luck into a top 5 pick, dont you get it that's calledd a lottery which it means luck and no guarantees?

Yes I understand the lottery and how the draft. That's why you aim to pick quantity to counter that aspect. Pay attention.

Would you still be furious if they win more than one Cup?

 

[tucson83]

So it's Bedard and then everyone else completely sucks and is worthless?

yeah, he will leave, you really think he wont even if this team is bad for over a decade?

 

[VladDrag]

They are tied for the NHL lead with 10 wins over the last month of play.

This isn’t about two games, & it isn’t about “buy buy buy.” It’s about enjoying good, enjoyable hockey virtually every night instead of being miserable.

The serious question is why? Okay they are a bit better than last season. And yes, I've enjoyed watching the younger players develop.

But, Do you actually believe it's been enough to move the needle? They're getting wiped away by playoff teams. I just went through their record, they are 10-17-4 against teams either in playoff positions, or teams just outside (I included Buffalo, Islanders and Calgary - if you take those out they are 8-15-4). They went from bottom 5 team to a bottom 10 team. I fail to see how that's any real win.

And, There's no true difference maker in the prospect line. They are unlikely to get one at the end of this season picking between 8-10. You're only hope is that your 30 year old center, who has only 29 games in two season comes back and plays at the level he did 3-4 years ago, Frost somehow develops into a PPG+ player (which isn't particularly likely), or...? How else is this team going to be competitive? I don't have an answer.

 

[Shrike]

What more do you guys want?

Lots of hustle and energy playing the right way.
5 guys aged 24 or younger with points
24 year old goalie with SO.

Rebuilding WHILE building a great team culture for the future.

Last 16 games, playing at a 113 point pace.

What a job we are doing.

Building a culture of racism and bigotry

 

[deadhead]

There's a difference between progress and reaching long-term goals.

They've developed some young starters this season, Frost, Tippett, Cates, York, Allison (if he stays healthy), TK has raised his game, Farabee has struggled but that's to be expected coming off neck surgery, but he still scores at a top 6 rate.

JVR and Hayes have solidified their value as trade bait, same with Provorov paired with York.

The team is playing with structure, they're more cohesive, they're mentally resiliant. A much better environment to develop young players.

That's a start, hopefully 3-4 more young players will break into the starting lineup next season, they'll pick up some assets in trades and they'll gradually become younger, faster and more competitive.

No GM will come in and tank this team, this is not a total disaster area. And they don't have 4-5 expiring veteran contracts you can easily flip for assets.

What any competent GM would do is keep accumulating assets and moving out some of the veteran contracts over the next two seasons. He'd focus on adding a young playmaking center and top four RHD, and keep building young depth. He would patch with one and two year deals that wouldn't saddle the team with long-term commitments to older players.

 

[Danko]

I dont even know why your having this discussion here when if you post it on youtube comment sections then folks will believe it.

 

[Beef Invictus]

There's a difference between progress and reaching long-term goals.

They've developed some young starters this season, Frost, Tippett, Cates, York, Allison (if he stays healthy), TK has raised his game, Farabee has struggled but that's to be expected coming off neck surgery, but he still scores at a top 6 rate.

JVR and Hayes have solidified their value as trade bait, same with Provorov paired with York.

The team is playing with structure, they're more cohesive, they're mentally resiliant. A much better environment to develop young players.

That's a start, hopefully 3-4 more young players will break into the starting lineup next season, they'll pick up some assets in trades and they'll gradually become younger, faster and more competitive.

No GM will come in and tank this team, this is not a total disaster area. And they don't have 4-5 expiring veteran contracts you can easily flip for assets.

What any competent GM would do is keep accumulating assets and moving out some of the veteran contracts over the next two seasons. He'd focus on adding a young playmaking center and top four RHD, and keep building young depth. He would patch with one and two year deals that wouldn't saddle the team with long-term commitments to older players.

They are doing nothing but progressing to another wasted decade.

Fletcher will not add 3-4 young players next year unless injury forces it. To believe otherwise is to have not paid any attention to how this team works.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

The serious question is why? Okay they are a bit better than last season. And yes, I've enjoyed watching the younger players develop.

But, Do you actually believe it's been enough to move the needle? They're getting wiped away by playoff teams. I just went through their record, they are 10-17-4 against teams either in playoff positions, or teams just outside (I included Buffalo, Islanders and Calgary - if you take those out they are 8-15-4). They went from bottom 5 team to a bottom 10 team. I fail to see how that's any real win.

And, There's no true difference maker in the prospect line. They are unlikely to get one at the end of this season picking between 8-10. You're only hope is that your 30 year old center, who has only 29 games in two season comes back and plays at the level he did 3-4 years ago, Frost somehow develops into a PPG+ player (which isn't particularly likely), or...? How else is this team going to be competitive? I don't have an answer.

They are an improving team with many improving young players.

They are much better at the AS Break (team and players) than they were the first month or so of the season, and they are much better now than they were the last two seasons.

They recently swept Washington in a home-and-home, pounded Buffalo, pounded the Jets, and played excellent games against the Kings and Wild, taking both to OT.

They are "competitive" now.

It is a win for enjoyable hockey. It is a win for progress and promise heading into next season.

Instead of starting next season in an even deeper hole from trying to lose, they will be starting on an upward trajectory with many good things and positive development already in place.

And bitch about the prospects all you want, despite no superstars it's still an above average group that very will soon to be adding to one of the very top-scoring 25-and-under teams in the NHL.

You, and many Flyers fans, are stuck on the belief that the *only* way out is through losing as many games as possible and drafting a Jesus savior. Any other approach is unacceptable and guarantees mediocrity. IMO it's a very overly-simplistic perspective fraught with problems itself and full of historical failures (and successful other approaches) that get ignored.

I am happy to turn on NBCSPhilly and watch good hard-working competitive hockey and a fun young improving team.

 

[dragonoffrost]

He would patch with one and two year deals that wouldn't saddle the team with long-term commitments to older players.

Yet Fletcher patched this past off season with 4 years to Deslauriers....

 

[Beef Invictus]

They are an improving team with many improving young players.

They are much better at the AS Break (team and players) than they were the first month or so of the season, and they are much better now than they were the last two seasons.

They recently swept Washington in a home-and-home, pounded Buffalo, pounded the Jets, and played excellent games against the Kings and Wild, taking both to OT.

They are "competitive" now.

It is a win for enjoyable hockey. It is a win for progress and promise heading into next season.

Instead of starting next season in an even deeper hole from trying to lose, they will be starting on an upward trajectory with many good things and positive development already in place.

And bitch about the prospects all you want, despite no superstars it's still an above average group that very will soon to be adding to one of the very top-scoring 25-and-under teams in the NHL.

You, and many Flyers fans, are stuck on the belief that the *only* way out is through losing as many games as possible and drafting a Jesus savior. Any other approach is unacceptable and guarantees mediocrity. IMO it's a very overly-simplistic perspective fraught with problems itself and full of historical failures (and successful other approaches) that get ignored.

I am happy to turn on NBCSPhilly and watch good hard-working competitive hockey and a fun young improving team.

I look forward to your confusion when, after another decade of following this same failed path, the team has never gone anywhere.


You stated before the season that if the Flyers were in this position in the standings, you'd call for Fletcher's firing. You are doing the opposite now.

 

[deadhead]

Deslauriers was silly, but nothing of importance, $500K or so to bury him as the 13th forward.
For a rebuilding team, that's not a major issue.

TDA was an overpriced gamble, that so far they're losing, it didn't make sense for a rebuilding team but did make sense for a GM who got told they had to show "improvement" to keep his job - so he tries to balance rebuilding with staying competitive.

Not signing JG was the right move, signing a 29 year old forward to a 7 year deal when you're trying to dump JVR and Hayes, and are still stuck with Couts and Atkinson would have signalled they're still in "win now" mode.

They need to do what Guerin has done in Minnesota, move out veterans for assets, patch with short-term deals that don't prevent you from replacing patches with young players when they're ready. So I have no problem trading Provorov, then signing a veteran RHD to a two year deal (or taking on one with an overpriced contract with a couple years left in a trade in return for assets), buying time for Attard, Andrae and to find a young RHD.

Use the cap room to pry away a RFA who has underperformed but fits Torts' schemes (think someone like TIppett).
Scour the waiver wire for young players who have disappointed but don't have serious character flaws for both the NHL and AHL teams.

If you're not going to tank, you should focus on better younger and more talented over a period of years.

 

[SnS]

Big Nic is on a rebuilding team? Oh.

 

[Audible Velvet]

I would like to throw my hat in the ring for title of weakest semi-regular poster. I think I have a good shot. Put me in, coach.

 

[deadhead]

I would like to throw my hat in the ring for title of weakest semi-regular poster. I think I have a good shot. Put me in, coach.

But can you win an internet throw down?