Post-Game Talk: 49ers at PATRIOTS - YUCK - Next up @Buffalo

[LouJersey]

Just a flat out ridiculous statement. You cant ignore the last play of the game.

Also its beyond me why people can't give both guys credit and acknowledge they both helped each other tremendously

Was a great read on a terrible play call, no denying that.

 

[KrejciMVP]

Just a flat out ridiculous statement. You cant ignore the last play of the game.

Also its beyond me why people can't give both guys credit and acknowledge they both helped each other tremendously

Ya but you keep trying to sell us that Jimmy G is a great QB. He was benched for poor play not too long ago, lol. His coach is afraid to put the game in his hands unless it’s a simple pass

 

[DangleCity]

Ya but you keep trying to sell us that Jimmy G is a great QB. He was benched for poor play not too long ago, lol. His coach is afraid to put the game in his hands unless it’s a simple pass

Not so much as selling Jimmy as I was defending Bill. Everyone is trying to say he cant win without Brady and this year is proof. When in fact he drafted, developed, and groomed Brady's successor and was forced to trade him because of Brady.


You.cant fairly evaluate Bill.when.he had his legs cut.out from under.him

 

[Seidenbergy]

Not so much as selling Jimmy as I was defending Bill. Everyone is trying to say he cant win without Brady and this year is proof. When in fact he drafted, developed, and groomed Brady's successor and was forced to trade him because of Brady.


You.cant fairly evaluate Bill.when.he had his legs cut.out from under.him

He turned Jimmy g into 6 current patriots, including guys like Harris and stidham, who has been sold as the future multiple times. There is zero evidence that they would have won more with Jimmy g than they would with today's roster.

 

[DangleCity]

He turned Jimmy g into 6 current patriots, including guys like Harris and stidham, who has been sold as the future multiple times. There is zero evidence that they would have won more with Jimmy g than they would with today's roster.

Wow, this how dug in your are? Cant even admit that Jimmy is a better QB than anyone on their roster.

 

[KrejciMVP]

Not so much as selling Jimmy as I was defending Bill. Everyone is trying to say he cant win without Brady and this year is proof. When in fact he drafted, developed, and groomed Brady's successor and was forced to trade him because of Brady.


You.cant fairly evaluate Bill.when.he had his legs cut.out from under.him

Brady’s successor needs to be a QB that can throw. Period. No more gimmicks

 

[bbfan419]

Part of me wants to blow this up and trade the vets for as many picks as possible and hopefully get Lawrence and a deep threat like Chase along with whatever else, if BB does not screw the draft up. Then I read reports the Pats may be in on Amari Cooper and/or Adam Thielan. I could go for the latter if we had a QB that could do more than just run with the ball. If they go the trade route then Cam either gets traded or is backup and they need to also bring in a better QB, who that is not sure. It may be just easier to trade vets and get as many 1st and 2nd rd picks as possible.

 

[Seidenbergy]

Wow, this how dug in your are? Cant even admit that Jimmy is a better QB than anyone on their roster.

Dug in? This is literally my first post on the matter.

And no. I'm saying it's not a direct comparison between just two qbs. The pats got stidham + their best rb + 4 other players for Jimmy. They need to be part of the equation.

 

[DangleCity]

Dug in? This is literally my first post on the matter.

And no. I'm saying it's not a direct comparison between just two qbs. The pats got stidham + their best rb + 4 other players for Jimmy. They need to be part of the equation.

Sorry, there are a few of you I have been going back and forth with about Brady and Bill.


For me they are irrelevant because BB was forced to trade him. He wanted Jimmy. He wasnt making that trade in good faith.

 

[CDJ]

Jimmy is a bottom half starter

 

[DangleCity]

Brady’s successor needs to be a QB that can throw. Period. No more gimmicks

I guess the bottomline is I think Jimmy at worst is an average QB. And you think he sucks

 

[Seidenbergy]

Sorry, there are a few of you I have been going back and forth with about Brady and Bill.


For me they are irrelevant because BB was forced to trade him. He wanted Jimmy. He wasnt making that trade in good faith.

Explain how BB was forced, with links.
What would've happened to him if he refused? I'm genuinely curious what you think would've happened in that case.

 

[DangleCity]

Jimmy is a bottom half starter

That's a wide range. I think he would have been atleast average and BB would have been able to coach him up if necessary. They would have won plenty of games with Jimmy

 

[DangleCity]

Explain how BB was forced, with links.
What would've happened to him if he refused? I'm genuinely curious what you think would've happened in that case.

I look it up, but werwnt there rumors at the time that BB and the Giants were talking? Seems like they very well could have lost BB over this decision

 

[DangleCity]

https://sny.tv/articles/separating-fact-from-fiction-in-the-bill-belichickto-giants-rumors

https://nypost.com/2019/12/29/fascinating-bill-belichick-to-giants-scenario-would-make-sense/

Could Bill Belichick actually make a return to the New York Giants?

Did Bill Belichick inquire about Giants job in 2017?

NFL rumors: Bill Belichick gave Giants 'glowing recommendation' on Joe Judge

 

[LSCII]

Jimmy is a bottom half starter

Nah, he was the FUTURE!

 

[Seidenbergy]

https://sny.tv/articles/separating-fact-from-fiction-in-the-bill-belichickto-giants-rumors

https://nypost.com/2019/12/29/fascinating-bill-belichick-to-giants-scenario-would-make-sense/

Could Bill Belichick actually make a return to the New York Giants?

Did Bill Belichick inquire about Giants job in 2017?

NFL rumors: Bill Belichick gave Giants 'glowing recommendation' on Joe Judge

I fail to see the relevance of rumors 18 months post-trade. If anything they disprove your argument. He's still here.

 

[DangleCity]

I fail to see the relevance of rumors 18 months post-trade. If anything they disprove your argument. He's still here.

Fail to see how this disproves my agrument. You asked for direct evidence.

 

[Seidenbergy]

Fail to see how this disproves my agrument. You asked for direct evidence.

Direct evidence of him being forced to trade Jimmy g....not a Tanguay rumor about belichick supposedly looking at the giants and skins AFTER the trade was done.

Look. Simple logic. I'm asking what would KRAFT have done if BB refused to trade Jimmy? Fire him? No way. BB had all the leverage. He couldn't be forced to do anything he didn't want to do.

 

[LSCII]

Not so much as selling Jimmy as I was defending Bill. Everyone is trying to say he cant win without Brady and this year is proof. When in fact he drafted, developed, and groomed Brady's successor and was forced to trade him because of Brady.


You.cant fairly evaluate Bill.when.he had his legs cut.out from under.him

Nobody said it was because of this year. In fact, I specifically included his entire career as a head coach. And that point is valid, regardless of how you want to frame it.

 

[LSCII]

Direct evidence of him being forced to trade Jimmy g....not a Tanguay rumor about belichick supposedly looking at the giants and skins AFTER the trade was done.

Look. Simple logic. I'm asking what would KRAFT have done if BB refused to trade Jimmy? Fire him? No way. BB had all the leverage. He couldn't be forced to do anything he didn't want to do.

Exactly. And even so, this argument only holds water if Garoppolo was a good player. He isn't. He's far less than what people projected him to be, in fact. So BB was forced to trade Jimmy G and THAT screwed up the future? Nah. Not buying it. Too far of a leap to make, IMO.

 

[LSCII]

I look it up, but werwnt there rumors at the time that BB and the Giants were talking? Seems like they very well could have lost BB over this decision

Rumors don't matter. He was under contract and could only leave to go to the Giants if the Pats let him. If he tried to go the promotion route and take over as Giants team President, the Pats would have blocked it like they did with Caserio by saying Bill is the de facto president since he runs the entire football operation. He wasn't going anywhere.

 

[DangleCity]

Direct evidence of him being forced to trade Jimmy g....not a Tanguay rumor about belichick supposedly looking at the giants and skins AFTER the trade was done.

Look. Simple logic. I'm asking what would KRAFT have done if BB refused to trade Jimmy? Fire him? No way. BB had all the leverage. He couldn't be forced to do anything he didn't want to do.

You can vet more sources if you want, but the facts are the facts. He was forced to trade Jimmy because Tom wanted to stay and went to the owner. Ultimately Kraft has the final say in all matters. The fact that the owner sided with a player over the coach is a huge organizational issue and completely undercuts BB who is supposed to have personnel control.

 

[DangleCity]

Rumors don't matter. He was under contract and could only leave to go to the Giants if the Pats let him. If he tried to go the promotion route and take over as Giants team President, the Pats would have blocked it like they did with Caserio by saying Bill is the de facto president since he runs the entire football operation. He wasn't going anywhere.

Nobody knows BB contract is so you're completely speculating. He could be year to year for all we know.

My guess is could absolutely have out clauses probably pertaining to this exact type of situation

 

[LSCII]

Nobody knows BB contract is so you're completely speculating. He could be year to year for all we know.

The Krafts certainly know it. Those Giant rumors were all bullshit.