Post-Game Talk: 4 Goals because We Can't Cover a Man - Detroit 5-Leafs 4

[legendinblue]

Tank Nation where you at?

 

[TheLeastOfTheBunch]

You think Nonis bought out Grabovski without imput from Carlyle?

Carlyle bought out Grabovski, Nonis just did the paperwork.

Look how well that turned out for Nonis. Grabo has 28 points in 34 games and leads Washington in +/- If Randy had negative input, why would Nonis go back to him for more of the same advise..

 

[hockeywiz542]

Siegel: Reimer stung by quick hook as Leafs fall in shootout

http://www.tsn.ca/toronto/blogs/jonas_siegel/?id=439591

TORONTO – James Reimer chose his words carefully, but made no secret of his unhappiness.

“I don't know if there's a goaltender in the league that's happy when they get pulled,†said Reimer following an eventual 5-4 shootout loss to the Red Wings on Saturday night.

The 25-year-old got the hook after just 20 minutes at the ACC – in yet another sloppy first period for the Leafs – yielding three goals to the Red Wings on 12 shots. It was the fourth time in 18 starts that Reimer has been pulled and clearly it stung.

“Obviously I didn't want to get pulled,†he said. “That's the last thing I wanted. I wanted to hang in there. But that's Randy's decision. And I respect what he decides. I may not like it, but that's irrelevant. He's the one who makes those decisions.â€

First, the team in front of him was admittedly far off-point early, standing around, in the words of Carlyle, as Detroit strangled hold of the action. And then there was the effort of the Manitoba native just two nights earlier, his 34 saves effectively carrying the Leafs to an eventual two points against Phoenix.

Throw in the fact that Reimer has been pulled four times already versus zero for his counterpart in Bernier (despite entering the night with slightly better numbers) and it's easy to understand where some frustration might lie with the lack of rope from the head coach.

“I don't know if I want to really get into that,†said Reimer, who was making three consecutive starts for the first time all season.

“I think that's what any goaltender wants,†said Reimer. “You want that chance to get in there and fight and battle for your teammates and try and get a win. Obviously Randy had other thoughts and he's the coach and he's the one who makes those decisions. I don't. I just try and stop ucks.â€

 

[Nithoniniel]

Bernier got us that one point, quite simply. Defensive coverage has been awful for a while now, and that's not just on the defensemen. The players just never cover for each other.

 

[LeafOfBread]

Lol every PGT seems to feature Grabovski talk these days.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

Reimer, Kadri, Gardiner

These are not Carlyle players, just like MacArthur and Grabovski.

That's pretty obvious. If we're not looking to rebuild, we'll probably seem being moved. Some support for Phaneuf on D, and maybe a young forward pieces that could play Carlyle's game. I think Holland is being groomed to take the #1C spot, while Bolland, Bozak, McClement represent the other centres.

 

[thewave]

That's pretty obvious. If we're not looking to rebuild, we'll probably seem being moved. Some support for Phaneuf on D, and maybe a young forward pieces that could play Carlyle's game. I think Holland is being groomed to take the #1C spot, while Bolland, Bozak, McClement represent the other centres.

is Holland a 1c no
is Kadri a 1c no

do they have potential as 2cs yes

can we run a team with 2cs yes

contender running with 3 mid pack 2cs, maaybe if Lupul jvr kessel remain healthy. so you are asking this to do it in the future.

jvr holland kessel
lupul kadri raymond
kule bolland clarkson

i dont know if i see it really as hard as i reach for the positives. maybe down the line with a couple of those prospects but thats years off,

being stuck with Clarkson and Bozak really just is enough stolen cap and umph to prevent us from dominating over 3 lines.

if you could, trade Bozak and Clarkson and add a Jbo type on D like i was saying last year and perhaps another more solid D.

Deal out Raymond at tdl
Deal out Reimer
Deal out Kules(little chance he stays)
trade Franson
Move Fraser ahl
Move ranger ahl

 

[The Legend]

That's pretty obvious. If we're not looking to rebuild, we'll probably seem being moved. Some support for Phaneuf on D, and maybe a young forward pieces that could play Carlyle's game. I think Holland is being groomed to take the #1C spot, while Bolland, Bozak, McClement represent the other centres.

Continuing to build this team around our coach is a massive mistake. We've already seen that it doesn't seem to work - and if we are going to bring in players that play a non-Carlyle system, then there's no point of having Carlyle around.

 

[Derek Synak]

Reimer was shaky and most of the team lacked interest again.

Holland continues to impress
Clarkson was noticeable
Lupul looked like his old self


Gotta get something figured out, Kadri filling in for Bozak does not work, Holland might be a better option there for now.

 

[Trapper]

That's pretty obvious. If we're not looking to rebuild, we'll probably seem being moved. Some support for Phaneuf on D, and maybe a young forward pieces that could play Carlyle's game. I think Holland is being groomed to take the #1C spot, while Bolland, Bozak, McClement represent the other centres.

The battle is between Holland and Kadri much like Bernier and Reimer.
Like it or not, when Bozak comes back he will play between JVR and Kessel. Done deal.
Bolland (when healthy) will center a 3rd line with Clarkson and whoever.
McClement is going nowhere.
That leaves the 2nd line center with Lupul.
Nonis is looking for a top 6 forward. No one said it was a center. It could be a winger for then 2nd scoring line:
Lupul/Holland or Kadri/Winger.
Kadri could then be moved for a young top 4 D.
A package for a Trouba/Bogosian or something along that line.

 

[ULF_55]

LOL at 3 and 5, idk which one to shut down first

gotta start with 5 though, bozak didnt kick grabo off the team, kadri did by outplaying him, this team has no room for 5.5 more million

number 3, tim thomas is in another league in terms of scramblers, a prime aged timmy t is much better then reimer... they arent even close really... Reimer is certainly not a vezina goalie either... come on man most of this stuff is nuts here

Tim Thomas was 31 years old his first full season, Reimer and Bernier are 25.

Another scrambler was http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=2187

He was 28 before he started playing well (statistically).

 

[thewave]

The battle is between Holland and Kadri much like Bernier and Reimer.
Like it or not, when Bozak comes back he will play between JVR and Kessel. Done deal.
Bolland (when healthy) will center a 3rd line with Clarkson and whoever.
McClement is going nowhere.
That leaves the 2nd line center with Lupul.
Nonis is looking for a top 6 forward. No one said it was a center. It could be a winger for then 2nd scoring line:
Lupul/Holland or Kadri/Winger.
Kadri could then be moved for a young top 4 D.
A package for a Trouba/Bogosian or something along that line.

fantastic promise you one thing, you will never see a cup in your life while Bozak is the 1c of Toronto. Never no way ever.

 

[DaveT83*]

Randy playing favouritism is becoming a big problem.

Has Kessel been benched at all this season>?
Have Dion's minutes been cut back?

Instead its rookies 4th liners and James Reimer that get the blame.


Blue and White disease at its finest.

 

[theTTC]

sounds like Reims is done here

I really like this guy as a person and a competetive team guy and a very good goalie - so I hope he does get traded. He deserves a long honest chance to be #1 in a market, and with intelligent management, that is not a graveyard for young talent beginning to blossom.

 

[DaveT83*]

I really like this guy as a person and a competetive team guy and a very good goalie - so I hope he does get traded. He deserves a long honest chance to be #1 in a market, and with intelligent management, that is not a graveyard for young talent beginning to blossom.

Yeah how sad is it that we hope for our players to be traded so they can have a bright future.


Anyone that defends this team or how it has been run take heed.

 

[Trapper]

fantastic promise you one thing, you will never see a cup in your life while Bozak is the 1c of Toronto. Never no way ever.

Oh I agree.
And it won't be with Kadri or Holland as 1 C either
But you have to start somewhere and a competitive hard working atmosphere is a good start.
Also if you build from the net out a solid D man is the next obvious addition.

 

[thewave]

I really like this guy as a person and a competetive team guy and a very good goalie - so I hope he does get traded. He deserves a long honest chance to be #1 in a market, and with intelligent management, that is not a graveyard for young talent beginning to blossom.

well i dont disagree

 

[theTTC]

No way in hell should Bernier get that loss. The Leafs out scored the Wings 3-1 with him in the net... **** Reimer.

We witness again the cancer that debilitates this "fan" base.

We have two very decent goalies, each with different strengths. So... must... hate... one...

Leafs Nation at its finest, just like slimeball lawyers - they eat their own.

 

[thewave]

Yeah how sad is it that we hope for our players to be traded so they can have a bright future.


Anyone that defends this team or how it has been run take heed.

the organization has been scatter brained for a decade or for as long as corporations and pension plans have been in control. we are run and gun we are dump and chase we are...what, dump and chase with run and gun players. lol you cant make this stuff up

 

[thewave]

We witness again the cancer that debilitates this "fan" base.

We have two very decent goalies, each with different strengths. So... must... hate... one...

Leafs Nation at its finest, just like slimeball lawyers - they eat their own.

they created their own luongo schneider situation, dont blame fans for managements decisions.

 

[theTTC]

Ya the guy that calls out the team for poor play, then wins the next game by his own great performance is done here. FFS this place.

Lets trade the guys who care, cause people around here never talk about the teams lack of caring.

^^ one of the few voices of sanity here.

Include the only guys who bleed blue and white, Clarkson and Phaneuf in a trade package with Riemer, to satisfy the Roman citizens.

 

[Trapper]

the organization has been scatter brained for a decade or for as long as corporations and pension plans have been in control. we are run and gun we are dump and chase we are...what, dump and chase with run and gun players. lol you cant make this stuff up

Everyone wants the same thing:
A winning team.
We just disagree on who should stay and who should go.
We disagree on players we like vs. players someone else doesn't like.
Everyone should be trade able if it improves the Leafs.
No one should be traded just because.
But remember winning doesn't always mean best player, it's best fit.
Should NY be better with Tavares/Vanek? or we're they better with Tavares/Moulson?
We want all stars at every position when solid 2 way players are needed.
See Edmonton.

 

[ULF_55]

Smithson calling out Kadri - accidentally.

http://www.tsn.ca/toronto/blogs/jonas_siegel/?id=439591

4. Kadri's struggles on the Draw

Of the 88 centres who qualify for the league faceoff crown, only four have been worse this season than Nazem Kadri, who sits 84th overall. Kadri, who finished 4-14 on the draw against the Red Wings, has won only 42.3 per cent of the 494 faceoffs he's taken this season. The 23-year-old is down slightly from the 44 per cent mark he posted last season.

Jerred Smithson, a career 55 per cent marksman, said the biggest lesson he'd offer to a young centre in need of advice is “compete level”.

“It's just wanting to win the battle more than that other guy,” he told the Leaf Report. “That's the biggest thing for me anyway. You know there's always different techniques, but just the will and the compete going into the circle and wanting it just that much more.”

Smithson acknowledges that different tricks and techniques also make a difference, but notes that “if you're going to start with one thing it's just the battle. For me it's so much harder when I know a guy's coming in there and he's going to battle his butt off to win that draw. For me, that would be the starting point.”

Carlyle suggest Kadri is not a top 6 forward

5. Kadri on the Top Line

Kadri had a pair of goals against Dallas on Dec. 5 when he replaced an injured Tyler Bozak on the Leafs top unit. But since that point, the 23-year-old has been quiet offensively alongside Phil Kessel and James van Riemsdyk, totaling just three points over the next nine games.

“You're asking a young player in Kadri to fill some shoes of a veteran player,” said Randy Carlyle of the shift from Bozak to Kadri. “He's a young player still cutting his teeth to become a higher level first line, second line centre, whatever word you want to describe an offensive player. We're asking a lot of a young player right now where last year we were able to use Nazzie more as a third line option and protect him from having to play up against the top two lines of other hockey clubs.”

Squaring off mostly against third and fourth lines, Kadri had 14 goals and 35 points through the first 34 games last season. Through the same number of games this season, matched mostly against first and second units, he has 10 goals and 22 points.

 

[leafstilldeath*]

The only way this team is going to taste some success if we run:

JVR-Holland-Kessel (offensive minded players)
Lupul-Kadri-Raymond (offensive minded players)
Kulemin-Bozak-Bolland (Beast shutdown line)
Orr/McLaren/Bodie/Damigo - JMc - Clarkson (semi-shutdown line with no goons depending on we play against)


Gunnar-Dion
Gards-Franson
Liles-Reilly

1st PP unit:

JVR-Bolland/Holland-Kessel

Reilly/Gard - Dion

2nd PP unit:

Lupul-Kadri-Raymond (worked pretty well while that scrub Clarkson was out for 10 games)

Gards/Reilly - Franson

 

[bunjay]

What, considering the Wings got four gift-wrapped goals from ****** D play but really didn't muster much else? The Wings only deserved two points because the Leafs put a bow on it for them. They were lucky to get more than one. Two teams slumping hard that should both be doing better than they are (especially with the "when healthy" rosters they have).

I really don't get the ****-on-Gardiner fest tonight, either. Dat Bipolar Nation in full effect.

I don't think we were watching the same game. The Leafs showed up for one period, the Wings showed up for two. They had a ton of scoring chances. When they went down by one toward the end of the third period they had three huge chances within a span of 3 minutes including a shorthanded breakaway for Datsyuk and of course tied it. And then continued to press while the Leafs stood around helplessly like they so often do.

They outchanced the Leafs, outshot the Leafs, outskated the Leafs. 38-23 were the shots, and shot attempts were even worse. I don't think you really understand what you're watching.