Post-Game Talk: #3| Montreal at FLYERS |Sat., Oct. 11, 2014|

[Funf]

Again, it is a slight consolation that I can point to this stretch of games every time somebody brings up the idea of trading Coburn.

 

[Garbage Goal]

I didn't say whether or not they are good expectations. I think they are realistic expectations. We're not a good team. We're not a bad team. That's reality. We're an above average team that can get hot when the offense is humming and the goalie gets in rhythm.

I think expecting more than that from this team is unreasonable and prioritizing optimism over logic.

Where I'm disagreeing here is that with Coburn and Timonen both out and no call-ups being made, we're not even a good or above average team. We're pretty terrible defensively, up for contention with the worst D in the league. Thus why we have well over 3 GA in three games and zero wins. The long stretches of being stuck in our own zone last night were horrific.

We also have a coach who's an idiot and makes games harder then they should be. Both those things turn us from what you're saying we are to, at the very least, a pretty bad team.

 

[Solefool]

I agree with pretty much everything you're saying except for the assessment of us being a bad team. If we were a bad team, the margin of victory for the other team would be more severe. We're a couple zone clears, pucks going off own skates, broken sticks away from winning all three games (2 of which coming against cup contenders in the conference).

 

[JVR21]

Did anyone notice that every time the puck was pinned in our zone Luke Schenn was out there? The dude is just a bad defenseman. The fact of the matter is I doubt he'd be on this team if it wasn't for his name.

 

[Solefool]

The failed zone clears were nauseating to watch.

- Our conditioning
- Our lack of team speed
- Our lack of team hockey IQ

I don't know which of the three, or better yet, if it's a sick, twisted combination of the three. But it has to get fixed.

 

[Funf]

I agree with pretty much everything you're saying except for the assessment of us being a bad team. If we were a bad team, the margin of victory for the other team would be more severe. We're a couple zone clears, pucks going off own skates, broken sticks away from winning all three games (2 of which coming against cup contenders in the conference).

Boston, yeah, we got a little unlucky there. We didn't really deserve a win, but the bounces certainly didn't go our way. NJ scored 6 goals against us. You can't let up 6 goals and expect to win, ever.

We're downright lucky MTL only scored 3 in the 3rd last night. It could have been much, much worse.

Look, I'm trying not to be all doom and gloom myself. There are some bright spots here, too. Couturier looked really good again last night, Simmonds is a badass, Giroux is still Giroux. But none of that offsets losing Timonen, and now Coburn. Our defense looked really bad without Timonen. Without Coburn, it's bottom 5 in the league, easily.

 

[Solefool]

I'm not arguing anything to the contrary of our defense being bottom 5. There's no doubt. I just think our offense is good enough and our goaltending is above average enough to elevate us to a decent team overall. At the very worst, I see this team as a 9th seed missing out on the playoffs by less than 5 points. When I think of bad teams, I think of bottom 3 in the conference. I dunno, maybe it's just semantics.

 

[Appleyard]

The failed zone clears were nauseating to watch.

- Our conditioning
- Our lack of team speed
- Our lack of team hockey IQ

I don't know which of the three, or better yet, if it's a sick, twisted combination of the three. But it has to get fixed.

The biggest problem is lack of composure and passing ability from the back end. (as well as speed on the back end.) They can't move the puck out through the zone... watch how the puck is ever got out of our own zone:

Streit or MDZ skate it out.

A forward (mainly Giroux, Couturier, Voracek, Read, Raffl and Simmonds.) intercept a pass or force a turnover and clear the zone themselves.

If we could have a record of successful zone exits most of them would be forwards... which is not great really.

I don't think the team is badly conditioned, and the forwards are faster than last year.

After Streit Mason is the best puckmover on our back end with Kimmo and Coburn out.

 

[Willis88]

We've played two likely Eastern Cup Contenders in Boston and Montreal and a probable playoff team in New Jersey. They were all 1 goal games (sans the empty netter). It's not as bad as people are making it out to be. We're an above average but not good team. They're playing at their expected level, IMO.

Are you even watching the games or just checking the scores?

 

[Solefool]

I had personal expectations that Del Zotto could be that guy. He's talented, but his hockey IQ leaves alot to be desired.

 

[Solefool]

Are you even watching the games or just checking the scores?

What makes you question this? Because I haven't slit my wrist yet? Because I'm not overreacting to a bunch of 1 goal losses to a trio of teams including two Cup Contenders? Get out of here with that weak s***.

 

[Cootsfanclub]

Are you even watching the games or just checking the scores?

Are you? Flyers have been in every game and have had chances to win every game. It's not like they're some historically bad team that is all but guaranteed a bottom pick.

 

[Beef Invictus]

The start of last year's season was so, so much worse than this.

 

[FLYERSFAN18]

The start of last year's season was so, so much worse than this.

While I agree, there was almost now way that our offense would rebound from how bad it was playing. Our defense is the problem this year, without good enough players to believe they will turn it around

 

[Garbage Goal]

This is the NHL. Goals themselves are always one broken stick, one lucky bounce, one goalie gaffe, one whatever away from being scored. Games themselves are rarely decided by more then a one or two goal margin. The NHL isn't an overly high scoring league. Teams score two to three goals on average a game, so saying "we were only a goal or two away" or "we were only this much away" really doesn't mean much in my mind. Comes off as excuse making more then anything.

Boston we played okay, but still not good enough to win. That was with Coburn in the lineup and Berube starting the season without ****ing with the lines. Now Coburn is gone and Berube is going all Berube on us. We gave up six goals against NJ and got spanked. Last night our offense was opportunistic and carried us to a 3-0 lead early then blew it all in one period and we had pretty horrific stretches of being pinned in our own zone throughout. We choked away a big lead and frankly if Emery didn't play better then expected it doesn't even go to OT, we lose.

I think that's what he means when he asks if you watched the games. Saying "we're a couple mistakes" or "we're a couple goals away" from winning sounds like pure excuse making to me. That's how goals happen most of the time, mistakes. So saying "we were this zone clear or whatever away from winning" is really just another way of saying "well, if we didn't make mistakes we would have won". Well, no ****. The point is they did make those mistakes and on paper this D is arguably worst in the league as it is. Having the expectation that they're a fringe playoff team at the very worst despite having arguably the worst D in the league seems like very lofty expectations.

Edit: With that said though, have to see how things shake out. See how long a leash Berube gets and see what, if anything, is done to our D. For now though, we're pretty bad I think.

 

[Beef Invictus]

While I agree, there was almost now way that our offense would rebound from how bad it was playing. Our defense is the problem this year, without good enough players to believe they will turn it around

I think we will see improvement there. Eventually they will have to give the superior younger players a shot over the established ****** players.

 

[Crescent Street]

I honestly don't give two ***** about all you fans who love to dump on Harts and say he was detrimental to this team.

There is no heart and soul on this team right now. Losing Hartnell was a gigantic blow to this team's character.

 

[Schmidty324]

Guy Boucher.

1-3-1.

Defense first.

I'd be for it.

 

[Cootsfanclub]

I honestly don't give two ***** about all you fans who love to dump on Harts and say he was detrimental to this team.

There is no heart and soul on this team right now. Losing Hartnell was a gigantic blow to this team's character.

Simmonds seems to have taken that role and ran with it.

 

[hckyplayer8]

Yeah let's become the early 2000 NJ Devils. Maybe we can bore the other team off the ice.

 

[Striiker]

I honestly don't give two ***** about all you fans who love to dump on Harts and say he was detrimental to this team.

There is no heart and soul on this team right now. Losing Hartnell was a gigantic blow to this team's character.

You're clueless.

 

[Curufinwe]

That shot off the post on the PP in OT really would have been nice to get. You need a little bit of luck when you're struggling.

 

[CanadianFlyer88]

The start of last year's season was so, so much worse than this.

They were in the first three games last year, too, but they couldn't score.

This year they can score, but they're still losing winnable games.

There were positives from the first three games in each season, but I'm more concerned this year than last year.

 

[Garbage Goal]

They were in the first three games last year, too, but they couldn't score.

This year they can score, but they're still losing winnable games.

There were positives from the first three games in each season, but I'm more concerned this year than last year.

That's how I'm feeling too. Last year it was easy to be confidant we only needed a coaching change which we all knew should have happened in the off-season. It was also easy to think Giroux would bounce back, which he did. This year I'm not confidant when Berube will be let go and even if he is the issues are more just the personnel rather then under performance and solely coaching/off-season injury to Giroux.

 

[ILoveStephanieBrown]

I honestly don't give two ***** about all you fans who love to dump on Harts and say he was detrimental to this team.

There is no heart and soul on this team right now. Losing Hartnell was a gigantic blow to this team's character.

His name is Wayne Simmonds bro, and he's a much better player than Hartnell at this point.