GDT: #27 | Islanders vs Penguins | Thu Dec 6 @7PM est | SN1, SNE, SNP, ATTSN-PT, MSG+

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EightyOne

My posts are jokes. And hockey is just a game.
Nov 23, 2016
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**update:


NYI POSSIBLE LINES

BEAUVILLIER-BARZAL-BAILEY
LEE-NELSON-EBERLE
KUHNHACKL-FILPPULA-KOMAROV
MARTIN-CIZIKAS-CLUTTERBUCK

LEDDY-BOYCHUK
HICKEY-PULOCK
PELECH-MAYFIELD

GREISS
LEHNER




Penguins will be trying a new forecheck strategy tonight:





5Leht54.gif



Let's
Go
Pens!




 
Last edited:

Andy99

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Jun 26, 2017
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This is a very important game...CAR and NYR ahead of us are falling and NYI remain our main competition for a top three spot in the Metro (not looking like a WC team is coming out of here)...

They beat us twice already...if we’re going to make a move in the division, we need to show we can do it now...NYI are a mediocre team but the Pens could be worse...we need to show a pulse
 

Pancakes

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If we win this game, we're tied with the Isles in points, both with the same games played. Winning this one in regulation would be desirable, to say the least.

I think if we can just get our foot back in the door and grab a playoff spot that this team can play just well enough to hold onto that spot the rest of the way. I have little faith we'll win a cup with this defense but I'd still like to make the playoffs because you never know - Sid and Geno might carry us to another one.
 

DegenX

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Aug 14, 2011
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Good stuff @EightyOne! Thanks for helping out :) I'm always tempted to do a Batman Returns theme when we play the ducks. DeVito in that duck boat/whatever cracks me up every time.
 
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EightyOne

My posts are jokes. And hockey is just a game.
Nov 23, 2016
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Good stuff @EightyOne! Thanks for helping out :) I'm always tempted to do a Batman Returns theme when we play the ducks. DeVito in that duck boat/whatever cracks me up every time.
Lol. With the [UnnamedPlayer] drama, it'll be real fun!!

I just did the Gorton's Fish guy because of the bad Isles uniforms from a number of years ago, and had to pick a goofy penguin to be "fair."


Hmm. Figured they'd go with Jarry and use DeSmith tomorrow night. Apparently I am wrong thinking Ottawa is the more difficult game. Then again, they may just play DeSmith in both.. It's impossible to get a GDT graphic correct with the Pens lol

Edit: hmm I'm dumb. It's Sat at OTT. Oh well. Coulda sworn it was a back to back situation.
 
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Gurglesons

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Lol. With the [UnnamedPlayer] drama, it'll be real fun!!

I just did the Gorton's Fish guy because of the bad Isles uniforms from a number of years ago, and had to pick a goofy penguin to be "fair."


Hmm. Figured they'd go with Jarry and use DeSmith tomorrow night. Apparently I am wrong thinking Ottawa is the more difficult game. Then again, they may just play DeSmith in both.. It's impossible to get a GDT graphic correct with the Pens lol

Edit: hmm I'm dumb. It's Sat at OTT. Oh well. Coulda sworn it was a back to back situation.

Islanders are better than Ottawa just in terms of structure.

We should still win this game easily if we care to.
 

Andy99

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Jun 26, 2017
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Trotz is a hell of a coach to have that team playing as good as they are.

That's one ugly lineup they got.

They play a lot like WSH which is not a surprise, and WSH is having great success again this year so far....are those teams doing anything we can use?
 
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cheesedanish87

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Jun 27, 2012
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If we win this game, we're tied with the Isles in points, both with the same games played. Winning this one in regulation would be desirable, to say the least.

I think if we can just get our foot back in the door and grab a playoff spot that this team can play just well enough to hold onto that spot the rest of the way. I have little faith we'll win a cup with this defense but I'd still like to make the playoffs because you never know - Sid and Geno might carry us to another one.

The Pens have issues, but so do all these other team the pens are competing with in the metro.

NYI Carolina NYR.

Even though the Flyers are near the bottom in the metro right now i think they will end up being the Pens biggest competition for that that 3rd spot in the metro.
 
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cheesedanish87

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They play a lot like WSH which is not a surprise, and WSH is having great success again this year so far....are those teams doing anything we can use?

He seems to be one of the only coaches who preach shot quality over shot quantity.

The Pens beat the Caps in the playoffs 2 years ago even though the Caps dominated play and out shot the pens by a wide margin.

Trotz realized in that series that even though the Caps controlled play they were getting a bunch of low percentage shots while the Pens were getting a bunch of high percentage shots(odd man rushes)

So they adjusted last year to get more high percentage shots which you saw in the playoffs last year against the Pens and against the other teams they played.
 

madinsomniac

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Jul 3, 2012
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Its weird that tge Metro houses the last three SC winners yet is probably the most flawed division in the NHL this year... how quickly things can turn, huh?
 

Pancakes

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So they adjusted last year to get more high percentage shots which you saw in the playoffs last year against the Pens and against the other teams they played.

What jumped out to me in last year's series vs the Caps is the played a very opportunistic style against us. They basically trapped, waited for us to turn it over, and beat us on a lot of rush plays. It was a smart way to play us and I always wondered why so few teams we played had really tried to clog it up to the extent they did. Like if you look at our opponents in the back to back Cups, here's how I'd shake it down:

15-16:
Nyr - tried to skate with us, and couldn't
Wsh - tried to skate with us, and couldn't
Tb - played trap and counter hockey, and almost beat us
SJ - tried to skate with us, and couldn't

16-17:

Cbj - tried to run us out of the building with hits, got embarrassed
Wsh - tried to carry play against us with an aggressive forecheck. It worked with our depleted d for 6 games, but then we turned the tables on them in game 7 with a surprisingly aggressive forecheck and they couldn't handle the sudden strategy change. We caught them completely offguard for one game, and that was all we needed after stealing 3 others.
Ott - tried to trap us, and it almost worked. One goal away from that awful team being in the Cup finals. Great coaching by Boucher.
Nsh - tried to out skate us. It did work early on, but Nashville didn't have the horses up front to do this all series. Eventually Sid and Geno woke up, and Nashville didn't have the forwards up front to beat us in a speed/skill game.

17-18:

Phi- Honestly I think they tried to play the right way and played defensive, but their goaltending was horrible, and you can't have bad goaltending against us. Just can't.

Wsh - Played trap and counter hockey. Waited for us to turn it over with high risk plays, and we played right into it. Streak of Sully playoff wins ended.


So what's the common theme here? Teams that played trap and counter hockey instead of trying to skate with us nearly beat us several times, and then one of them (Wsh last year) finally did manage it. Teams that tried to skate with us, our out skill us, our play physical against us, did not fare so well.

Since then the rest of the league has gotten faster and we're no longer the top speedy team. We're still fast though. Jessie had an interesting article today about how the Pens need to use an aggressive and fast forecheck in order to make up for our crappy defensive structure and weak goaltending. It makes sense. My thought was that we should actually be shelling up more than we have because of our weaker defense and goaltending. I think a coach like Trotz would probably try to have us play a more disciplined game to account for our weaker defense/goaltending.

But playing really aggressive to make up for a weak defensive structure is definitely a possibility and I think is viable. It's definitely how Sullivan is trying to have the Pens play. Thing is, as Jessie points out in his article, we're not always committing to that style of play. Score effects is always a thing in hockey but we've been especially bad about protecting leads and staying committed to Sullivan's style for a full 60 minutes. I would agree with Jessie that ideally the Pens should stay aggressive all game but since that's not always going to be easy to do I'd contend they really need to figure out also how to structure themselves in the neutral zone so that in the event aggression isn't possible on a breakout they don't get completely carved up like they have been.

Woo. Dats a lotta words.
 

Andy99

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Jun 26, 2017
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What jumped out to me in last year's series vs the Caps is the played a very opportunistic style against us. They basically trapped, waited for us to turn it over, and beat us on a lot of rush plays. It was a smart way to play us and I always wondered why so few teams we played had really tried to clog it up to the extent they did. Like if you look at our opponents in the back to back Cups, here's how I'd shake it down:

15-16:
Nyr - tried to skate with us, and couldn't
Wsh - tried to skate with us, and couldn't
Tb - played trap and counter hockey, and almost beat us
SJ - tried to skate with us, and couldn't

16-17:

Cbj - tried to run us out of the building with hits, got embarrassed
Wsh - tried to carry play against us with an aggressive forecheck. It worked with our depleted d for 6 games, but then we turned the tables on them in game 7 with a surprisingly aggressive forecheck and they couldn't handle the sudden strategy change. We caught them completely offguard for one game, and that was all we needed after stealing 3 others.
Ott - tried to trap us, and it almost worked. One goal away from that awful team being in the Cup finals. Great coaching by Boucher.
Nsh - tried to out skate us. It did work early on, but Nashville didn't have the horses up front to do this all series. Eventually Sid and Geno woke up, and Nashville didn't have the forwards up front to beat us in a speed/skill game.

17-18:

Phi- Honestly I think they tried to play the right way and played defensive, but their goaltending was horrible, and you can't have bad goaltending against us. Just can't.

Wsh - Played trap and counter hockey. Waited for us to turn it over with high risk plays, and we played right into it. Streak of Sully playoff wins ended.


So what's the common theme here? Teams that played trap and counter hockey instead of trying to skate with us nearly beat us several times, and then one of them (Wsh last year) finally did manage it. Teams that tried to skate with us, our out skill us, our play physical against us, did not fare so well.

Since then the rest of the league has gotten faster and we're no longer the top speedy team. We're still fast though. Jessie had an interesting article today about how the Pens need to use an aggressive and fast forecheck in order to make up for our crappy defensive structure and weak goaltending. It makes sense. My thought was that we should actually be shelling up more than we have because of our weaker defense and goaltending. I think a coach like Trotz would probably try to have us play a more disciplined game to account for our weaker defense/goaltending.

But playing really aggressive to make up for a weak defensive structure is definitely a possibility and I think is viable. It's definitely how Sullivan is trying to have the Pens play. Thing is, as Jessie points out in his article, we're not always committing to that style of play. Score effects is always a thing in hockey but we've been especially bad about protecting leads and staying committed to Sullivan's style for a full 60 minutes. I would agree with Jessie that ideally the Pens should stay aggressive all game but since that's not always going to be easy to do I'd contend they really need to figure out also how to structure themselves in the neutral zone so that in the event aggression isn't possible on a breakout they don't get completely carved up like they have been.

Woo. Dats a lotta words.

Good post...my theory is that we need to be more aggressive defensively to make up for the weak defense and goaltender...I don’t think with Hags gone and Rust not the same that we have the horses to aggressively forecheck...but rather than play that soft zone that Sully likes in the d zone, I think they should try pressure defense and taking the body....as you can see the last game, once were able to get some TOs from the opposing team we can successfully put them in the net...but I think the aggression must come more from D because I don’t think we can generate TOs anymore with our speed...
 
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cheesedanish87

Registered User
Jun 27, 2012
10,797
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Pittsburgh
What jumped out to me in last year's series vs the Caps is the played a very opportunistic style against us. They basically trapped, waited for us to turn it over, and beat us on a lot of rush plays. It was a smart way to play us and I always wondered why so few teams we played had really tried to clog it up to the extent they did. Like if you look at our opponents in the back to back Cups, here's how I'd shake it down:

15-16:
Nyr - tried to skate with us, and couldn't
Wsh - tried to skate with us, and couldn't
Tb - played trap and counter hockey, and almost beat us
SJ - tried to skate with us, and couldn't

16-17:

Cbj - tried to run us out of the building with hits, got embarrassed
Wsh - tried to carry play against us with an aggressive forecheck. It worked with our depleted d for 6 games, but then we turned the tables on them in game 7 with a surprisingly aggressive forecheck and they couldn't handle the sudden strategy change. We caught them completely offguard for one game, and that was all we needed after stealing 3 others.
Ott - tried to trap us, and it almost worked. One goal away from that awful team being in the Cup finals. Great coaching by Boucher.
Nsh - tried to out skate us. It did work early on, but Nashville didn't have the horses up front to do this all series. Eventually Sid and Geno woke up, and Nashville didn't have the forwards up front to beat us in a speed/skill game.

17-18:

Phi- Honestly I think they tried to play the right way and played defensive, but their goaltending was horrible, and you can't have bad goaltending against us. Just can't.

Wsh - Played trap and counter hockey. Waited for us to turn it over with high risk plays, and we played right into it. Streak of Sully playoff wins ended.


So what's the common theme here? Teams that played trap and counter hockey instead of trying to skate with us nearly beat us several times, and then one of them (Wsh last year) finally did manage it. Teams that tried to skate with us, our out skill us, our play physical against us, did not fare so well.

Since then the rest of the league has gotten faster and we're no longer the top speedy team. We're still fast though. Jessie had an interesting article today about how the Pens need to use an aggressive and fast forecheck in order to make up for our crappy defensive structure and weak goaltending. It makes sense. My thought was that we should actually be shelling up more than we have because of our weaker defense and goaltending. I think a coach like Trotz would probably try to have us play a more disciplined game to account for our weaker defense/goaltending.

But playing really aggressive to make up for a weak defensive structure is definitely a possibility and I think is viable. It's definitely how Sullivan is trying to have the Pens play. Thing is, as Jessie points out in his article, we're not always committing to that style of play. Score effects is always a thing in hockey but we've been especially bad about protecting leads and staying committed to Sullivan's style for a full 60 minutes. I would agree with Jessie that ideally the Pens should stay aggressive all game but since that's not always going to be easy to do I'd contend they really need to figure out also how to structure themselves in the neutral zone so that in the event aggression isn't possible on a breakout they don't get completely carved up like they have been.

Woo. Dats a lotta words.

Your suggestion about playing a counter game is interesting, but i wonder how the players would feel about that, mainly the star players Sid Geno Letang.

Maybe i'm wrong, but i feel like they would prefer the style their playing now. we have heard is the past how much players hate playing for Boucher because they don't like playing that way.

It was probably easier for Trotz to get the Caps to buy into that style because they kept on losing to the same team in the playoffs every year.
 
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Pancakes

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Your suggestion about playing a counter game is interesting, but i wonder how the players would feel about that, mainly the star players Sid Geno Letang.

Maybe i'm wrong, but i feel like they would prefer the style their playing now. we have heard is the past how much players hate playing for Boucher because they don't like playing that way.

It was probably easier for Trotz to get the Caps to buy into that style because they kept on losing to the same team in the playoffs every year.

For sure, that's a consideration.

And there's nothing saying we can't play aggressive still. We just need to all-in on it. We can't play halfway like we have. And ideally if we are going to play an aggressive style, JR provides the horses to Sullivan so that we can. The style works so much better when you have mobile defensemen constantly pinching down the boards like we used to have with Daley, Cole, Schultz.
 

Al Smith

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Apr 28, 2012
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Its weird that tge Metro houses the last three SC winners yet is probably the most flawed division in the NHL this year... how quickly things can turn, huh?
I guess we’ll see how flawed thhe Meteo is in the Spring after the trade deadline. Every team has flaws and it will just depend on who gets hot at the right time.
 

LOGiK

Registered User
Nov 14, 2007
18,319
9,042
In terms of important single games this season, this game is it. How long has it been since this bad news penguins team won 2 in a row? During that west coast trip winning streak from the second or third week of the season?

They need this one to happen.
 
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