21/22 Roster Speculation Thread Part IX - The trade deadline cometh Monday , March 21

[Chainshot]

It would be weird.

Larsson was the last player I remember being rumored to be going to the NL and that didn't happen. We'll see.

 

[elchud]

No room for Arttu.

Maybe his rights for a 6th from a cap strapped team like FLA

 

[elchud]

Need to not get involved with long contracts for post RFA players. No on Copp no on Dumba no on long term for Kuemper.

Thompson will be a 7 million player and that happens the season after next. Dahlin will be an 11 million player and that is two seasons away. RFA deals for Krebs Mitts Quinn Cozens Samuelsson Joker Power Peterka. Theres money to burn this year and next but that will change once Dahlin signs.

We are in an amazing position where we don't need to pay players 4/5/6/7 million a year on the other side of 30. We have a massive albatross with Skinner. Cant afford to make any more expensive mistakes.

Any short term benefit from a 30 year old free agent signing means nothing the next two seasons when we aren't Stanley Cup contenders. So when we are, we will be cursing KA for screwing us with the cap.

Be smart. 11 years of dumb. Lets be not dumb.

 

[Der Jaeger]

Need to not get involved with long contracts for post RFA players. No on Copp no on Dumba no on long term for Kuemper.

Thompson will be a 7 million player and that happens the season after next. Dahlin will be an 11 million player and that is two seasons away. RFA deals for Krebs Mitts Quinn Cozens Samuelsson Joker Power. Theres money to burn this year and next but that will change once Dahlin signs.

We are in an amazing position where we don't need to pay players 4/5/6/7 million a year on the other side of 30. We have a massive albatross with Skinner. Cant afford to make any more expensive mistakes.

Any short term benefit from a 30 year old free agent signing means nothing the next two seasons when we aren't Stanley Cup contenders. So when we are, we will be cursing KA for screwing us with the cap.

Be smart. 11 years of dumb. Lets be not dumb.

I will say that Skinner's contract, while still way to big for his production, looks way better than it did, say 6 months ago. It was a massive albatross. Now it's just too much for a 30 goal scorer.

 

[elchud]

I will say that Skinner's contract, while still way to big for his production, looks way better than it did, say 6 months ago. It was a massive albatross. Now it's just too much for a 30 goal scorer.

If he can be in the 30 to 35 range the next two seasons, it may he in our best interest to *not* buy him out, 25 to 30 goals the last three years of the deal on the third line is better than the buyout hits.

A Skinner who can't score 25 goals in a top-9 role is a Skinner who won't be getting ice time in which case you have to buy him out.

 

[TehDoak]

Need to not get involved with long contracts for post RFA players. No on Copp no on Dumba no on long term for Kuemper.

Thompson will be a 7 million player and that happens the season after next. Dahlin will be an 11 million player and that is two seasons away. RFA deals for Krebs Mitts Quinn Cozens Samuelsson Joker Power. Theres money to burn this year and next but that will change once Dahlin signs.

We are in an amazing position where we don't need to pay players 4/5/6/7 million a year on the other side of 30. We have a massive albatross with Skinner. Cant afford to make any more expensive mistakes.

Any short term benefit from a 30 year old free agent signing means nothing the next two seasons when we aren't Stanley Cup contenders. So when we are, we will be cursing KA for screwing us with the cap.

Be smart. 11 years of dumb. Lets be not dumb.

When signing a UFA, you are betting the upside of the front end will offset the downside of the back end.

I think the hope is with inflation ticking up, a new TV deal, etc the cap is going to move quite a bit once the players pay back the league their share of the COVID hit.

I will say that Skinner's contract, while still way to big for his production, looks way better than it did, say 6 months ago. It was a massive albatross. Now it's just too much for a 30 goal scorer.

Given his career, I think its going to fluctuate year to year. Hopefully the team has learned how to keep him engaged, because once he shuts down, he's a paperweight of a player.

 

[Weltschmerz]

That is, you want to give the first round for a goalie whose stats are not better than Anderson and Tokarski and who is signed for another four years with a salary of 6 million+, no thanks. I have already suggested options for different goalies, so about 10 players.

Guess I found your post but some of those 10 have never started 40+ games in a season, you can gamble they can do it but not sure that is the solution.

And the more prominent ones not sure they want to sign here with all the other options out there. Not saying they should trade a first for Gibson but if that is the only option left to get a proven starter I would think about it, rather have him play the 50 games Anderson and Tokarski played than to have to that many goalies again.

 

[elchud]

When signing a UFA, you are betting the upside of the front end will offset the downside of the back end.

I think the hope is with inflation ticking up, a new TV deal, etc the cap is going to move quite a bit once the players pay back the league their share of the COVID hit.

I dont think any major move we make this offseason will make us a Stanley Cup contenders the next two seasons. To me Fiala is young enough to take a big swing on. Dumba isn't. Lets say 24/25 is the start of our peak. I dont care if the cap does go up, Dumba at 9 million for diminishing returns is a complete no-go.

Just look at what the Wild are going through with Parise and Suter. Why would we want to replicate that with Skinner and Dumba.

And all these kids are gonna get paid. If you want to sign them to 4 to 6 year deals the bidding starts at 4 million for maybe all 8 of them (Mitts/Peterka/Power/Krebs/Cozens/Samuellson/Quinn/Joker). I've projected our cap out the next 8 seasons. Its not gonna be easy to keep them all. In fact definitely one, if not two, of that group of 8 won't be on the team in 4 years.

 

[Fjordy]

Guess I found your post but some of those 10 have never started 40+ games in a season, you can gamble they can do it but not sure that is the solution.

And the more prominent ones not sure they wan't to sign here with all the other options out there. Not saying they should trade a first for Gibson but if that is the only option left to get a proven starter I would think about it, rather have him play the 50 games Anderson and Tokarski played than to have to that many goalies again.

I'd prefer those ten options over Gibson, he fell off a cliff and it doesn't matter that he can play 40+ games if he can't do it well.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

I dont think any major move we make this offseason will make us a Stanley Cup contenders the next two seasons. To me Fiala is young enough to take a big swing on. Dumba isn't. Lets say 24/25 is the start of our peak. I dont care if the cap does go up, Dumba at 9 million for diminishing returns is a complete no-go.

Just look at what the Wild are going through with Parise and Suter. Why would we want to replicate that with Skinner and Dumba.

And all these kids are gonna get paid. If you want to sign them to 4 to 6 year deals the bidding starts at 4 million for maybe all 8 of them (Mitts/Peterka/Power/Krebs/Cozens/Samuellson/Quinn/Joker). I've projected our cap out the next 8 seasons. Its not gonna be easy to keep them all. In fact definitely one, if not two, of that group of 8 won't be on the team in 4 years.

I'm just glad he has trade protection so we don't have to worry about this

 

[sabres4ever]

It's going to be a mess this offseason with the goalie situation, wanting to spend more for good players, finding a good RHD for Power, etc.

As much as I like Andy, I just don't think he's the answer.

I think there's about a 5% change PK signs here. He wants another cup.

GMKA's got his work cut out for him this offseason.

 

[Dirty Dog]

You are vastly overrating Olofsson's value.

The long and short of it is:

With Eichel:

52 G, 20G, 22A

W/O eichel:

116 G, 28G, 39A

His shooting % went from 15.7% to just over 10% away from Eichel.

The idea that he is carrying some massive value isn't accurate. Over an 82 game season, the last two years, he'd be on a 20G, 47 point pace. That's not great considering he gets sheltered ice time and power play time

He will be 27 this summer.

So, what are our options? He has arb rights so he will probably go there. Take his arb reward and he's a UFA next year?

Sign him to a long term deal?

His production hasn't been good since he played top line with a en elite center drawing defenders away from him.

He's an average middle 6 forward who is about to get a UFA level contract from someone. There are more productive forwards available that we don't have to shelter.

If he wants to sign a short term 4M-4.5 per deal with us, I think that is fine. But my guess is he goes to Arb and walks away next year. It'd be a mistake to commit long term to him.

Even taking your view of olofsson as true, your proposal is still wildly unbalanced.

I don’t think it’s us overrating olofsson, but you overrating Borgen. This goes back to your thoughts on the expansion draft with Borgen.

 

[brian_griffin]

I will say that Skinner's contract, while still way to big for his production, looks way better than it did, say 6 months ago. It was a massive albatross. Now it's just too much for a 30 goal scorer.

It's a pelican instead of an albatross.

When signing a UFA, you are betting the upside of the front end will offset the downside of the back end.

I think the hope is with inflation ticking up, a new TV deal, etc the cap is going to move quite a bit once the players pay back the league their share of the COVID hit.



Given his career, I think its going to fluctuate year to year. Hopefully the team has learned how to keep him engaged, because once he shuts down, he's a paperweight of a player.

I think they have. Krueger is gone, Granato is in charge. I'll admit I've loved Skinner this year. For me, his in-your-face chirping and trash talking, all with a smile on his face, is worth an extra million over his counting stats. I don't think he'd do this, but he should send Ralph a box of numbered pucks for each goal he scored this season.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

It's a pelican instead of an albatross.

I think they have. Krueger is gone, Granato is in charge. I'll admit I've loved Skinner this year. For me, his in-your-face chirping and trash talking, all with a smile on his face, is worth an extra million over his counting stats. I don't think he'd do this, but he should send Ralph a box of numbered pucks for each goal he scored this season.

You say pucks, I say cow patties

 

[BuffaloGooner]

Making the Sabres a Bubble Team - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Create your own team. Trade, sign, recall, reassign, and buyout players as though you were your favourite teams general manager.

www.capfriendly.com

Flame away. If one team can pay Filip Forsberg his asking price of 8 years 8.5 million. It’s us. Wishful thinking, I know.

 

[threeVo]

This pass by R2 was absolutely insane.

 

[Bendium]

Just for my own exercise. Players under team control next year assuming Power, Bryson, and Olofsson are signed to deals.

Skinner - Thompson - Tuch
Peterka - Mittelstadt - Quinn
Aspland - Krebs - Olofsson
Girgs - Cozens - Okposo
13th (Bjork, Murray, R2)

Dahlin - Joker
Samualson - Fitzgerald
Power - Bryson
7th?

UPL - ???

As far as holes that are not technically filled you need one defenseman and a goalie. Otherwise you have a roster. In terms of priority I have.

1. Starting Goaltender - I prefer overpay on short term out of free agency first. Trade for a young starter with term and control second. Please no crappy old cap dump.

2. Top two pairing RD - Personally I prefer a trade to get someone the 23-26 range with term and team control. Yes you will have to pay some serious assets for this, but you have them to pay. I don't see Joker, Bryson, or Fitz as a true long term top pairing, so all three are on my list of assets available in such a trade.

Thats it! Maybe sign one FA forward and one FA D-man as extras. Thats all that HAS to be done before the next years starts in Buffalo. That said, once that's done.

3. It becomes time to patiently allowing the talent to develop and increase in value, while fishing for good hockey trades that improve the team by concentrating assets into more value per player, and creating balance.

I have Joker, Fitz, Bryson, Aspland, Bjork, all as no brainers to use in trades. Olofsson is a valuable player, but if he is needed to get item #1 or #2 I think his production will be replaced. Some mention Mittelstadt, but it would have to be a hell of a trade. As I see it we potentially have four top six centers, and I am not trading any of them until I know exactly what I am trading.

 

[Djp]

I dont think any major move we make this offseason will make us a Stanley Cup contenders the next two seasons. To me Fiala is young enough to take a big swing on. Dumba isn't. Lets say 24/25 is the start of our peak. I dont care if the cap does go up, Dumba at 9 million for diminishing returns is a complete no-go.

Just look at what the Wild are going through with Parise and Suter. Why would we want to replicate that with Skinner and Dumba.

And all these kids are gonna get paid. If you want to sign them to 4 to 6 year deals the bidding starts at 4 million for maybe all 8 of them (Mitts/Peterka/Power/Krebs/Cozens/Samuellson/Quinn/Joker). I've projected our cap out the next 8 seasons. Its not gonna be easy to keep them all. In fact definitely one, if not two, of that group of 8 won't be on the team in 4 years.

assuming Power is signed after the weekend…

there is going to be a competition between Dahlin and Power on who is the top LHD. When the next contracts come up I see one getting traded. You can’t pay a second LD that kind of high money.

Petrrka and Quinn do their 3 yr ELS thrn go on bridges which end when Skinners contract ends. You coukd pencil his money going to them.

Similarly there likely will be decisions made on tage/ Mitts/ Cozens/Krebs where 1-2 could be traded.

you will have young players coming from the 2021-2023 draft classes

ignoring Power you have 5 top 100 drafted players in 2021. Thry shoukd be adding 9 more in the next 2 drafts.

when Peterka and Quinn ELCs are done they could have 6+ F prospects in the system who can play forward.

 

[Fjordy]

there is going to be a competition between Dahlin and Power on who is the top LHD. When the next contracts come up I see one getting traded. You can’t pay a second LD that kind of high money.

That would be the dumbest decision.

 

[thewookie1]

assuming Power is signed after the weekend…

there is going to be a competition between Dahlin and Power on who is the top LHD. When the next contracts come up I see one getting traded. You can’t pay a second LD that kind of high money.

Petrrka and Quinn do their 3 yr ELS thrn go on bridges which end when Skinners contract ends. You coukd pencil his money going to them.

Similarly there likely will be decisions made on tage/ Mitts/ Cozens/Krebs where 1-2 could be traded.

you will have young players coming from the 2021-2023 draft classes

ignoring Power you have 5 top 100 drafted players in 2021. Thry shoukd be adding 9 more in the next 2 drafts.

when Peterka and Quinn ELCs are done they could have 6+ F prospects in the system who can play forward.

I doubt either are traded anytime soon, you can most certainly keep two top end defensemen if you keep the rest on good contracts. I highly doubt Dahlin makes 10+ mil barring Hughes and Makar both getting 10+.

Again there is no need to deal any of the centers, 2 of them can either become wingers or 1 can lead a great 3rd line. It helps that the 4 don’t have much in common in terms of skill sets. Cozens and Thompson are completely different than the others. Mitts and Krebs have more in common being both playmakers but if one plays wing we’d be fine

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

there is going to be a competition between Dahlin and Power on who is the top LHD. When the next contracts come up I see one getting traded. You can’t pay a second LD that kind of high money.

I don't expect Power to raise his stock to the level that he gets a big money contract in just 2 full seasons. If he does however that means he had some sort of Adam Fox or Cale Makar type of 2 year run. If that was to happen there is still no reason to not have Dahlin and Power anchoring the left side.

Take a look at the Rangers. They have Fox and Trouba on the right side, both on big money contracts starting next season and both playing big minutes.
Tampa has Hedman, McDonagh, and Sergachev on the left all playing big minutes and all 3 are on fairly high dollar contracts, though they are a bargain at this point but were fair value when signed.

Point is that you can have 2 top pairing D-men on the same side, both can play 25 minutes a game and can carry a pairing if they are good enough to be worth 8 - 10 million a season. If they both reach that level where they carry the pairing you plug in a relatively inexpensive partner for them who is reliable but doesn't need to be a gamebreaker. Guys like Cernak and Rutta.

 

[Jim Bob]

Making the Sabres a Bubble Team - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Create your own team. Trade, sign, recall, reassign, and buyout players as though you were your favourite teams general manager.

www.capfriendly.com

Flame away. If one team can pay Filip Forsberg his asking price of 8 years 8.5 million. It’s us. Wishful thinking, I know.

I think that is reasonable.

The problems I see with this approach is that both the 2nd & 3rd lines lack a 200 foot conscience (unless you think Cozens brings that with Quinn and FF, but Krebs-Mitts-VO...) that will put in work to let the skill guys feast.

You almost need Quinn and Krebs to play like Tuch for those lines to thrive and I don't know about that.

Gudas is a sneaky good candidate to play RHD with Power. I just don't know that Florida moves him at all given his affordable contract and their cap situation moving forward. They are a win now team that will look to get better. I don't know how they get better by moving Gudas @ $2.5M out for a pick. If there were a better RHD option for cheaper out there, the Sabres would be all over it.

I don't know if the Husso deal is enough to get him, but I like the idea.

 

[Djp]

I don't expect Power to raise his stock to the level that he gets a big money contract in just 2 full seasons. If he does however that means he had some sort of Adam Fox or Cale Makar type of 2 year run. If that was to happen there is still no reason to not have Dahlin and Power anchoring the left side.

Take a look at the Rangers. They have Fox and Trouba on the right side, both on big money contracts starting next season and both playing big minutes.
Tampa has Hedman, McDonagh, and Sergachev on the left all playing big minutes and all 3 are on fairly high dollar contracts, though they are a bargain at this point but were fair value when signed.

Point is that you can have 2 top pairing D-men on the same side, both can play 25 minutes a game and can carry a pairing if they are good enough to be worth 8 - 10 million a season. If they both reach that level where they carry the pairing you plug in a relatively inexpensive partner for them who is reliable but doesn't need to be a gamebreaker. Guys like Cernak and Rutta.

just because other teams have it, it’s ok???

Making the Sabres a Bubble Team - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Create your own team. Trade, sign, recall, reassign, and buyout players as though you were your favourite teams general manager.

www.capfriendly.com

Flame away. If one team can pay Filip Forsberg his asking price of 8 years 8.5 million. It’s us. Wishful thinking, I know.

you don’t give a UFA a max year contract that long to him. He’s 28 next year. Max id go us 4 yrs.

 

[threeVo]

assuming Power is signed after the weekend…

there is going to be a competition between Dahlin and Power on who is the top LHD. When the next contracts come up I see one getting traded. You can’t pay a second LD that kind of high money.

Petrrka and Quinn do their 3 yr ELS thrn go on bridges which end when Skinners contract ends. You coukd pencil his money going to them.

Similarly there likely will be decisions made on tage/ Mitts/ Cozens/Krebs where 1-2 could be traded.

you will have young players coming from the 2021-2023 draft classes

ignoring Power you have 5 top 100 drafted players in 2021. Thry shoukd be adding 9 more in the next 2 drafts.

when Peterka and Quinn ELCs are done they could have 6+ F prospects in the system who can play forward.

lol No. You can play both 25 mins a night and let the other 4 guys earn their minutes. It would literally be the dumbest thing in the world

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

just because other teams have it, it’s ok???

The point is that in the context of other teams being able to manage the cap and playtime of 2 top pairing caliber defensemen while staying competitive means exactly that. You can win and have a solid team balance while having 2 guys who are arguably both franchise level players in the same position.

If the Rangers had both Fox and Makar do you think they would trade one of them? If the Avs had both would they trade one? Should the Ducks have traded one of Niedermayer or Pronger when they made 13 million against the cap combined when the team cap limit was 44 million in 06-07? They took up 30% of the teams cap. They were both LD playing 27 minutes a game and they still won the cup.