WJC: 2021 Sweden Roster Talk

swedehollow

Registered User
Aug 15, 2018
372
304
Elias Pettersson was useless in WJC 2017. It's not a good idea to measure the strength of swedish players based on WJC, Swedish players are almost always underwhelming, Backstrom in 2007, Hedman&Karlsson in 2009 playoffs, Nylander was meh in playoffs in 2015, Pettersson had 1 point in 2017 etc.
I agree with this. I actually think Sweden's biggest problem is on the coaching side, not the lack of player material. All players have to pass the eye of a needle to get where they are, but what do coaches do? The number of flagrant mistakes being made leading to the loss against Finland is staggering. For instance; why did they hold on to the Holtz-Raymond combo for the entire tourney, why didn't the seize the chance to try different things against Austria, why not Wallstedt in the quarter, why play Broberg when he was struggling, why stop playing after being up 2-0, etc etc ...

I realize they didn't have quite the time this year to prepare, and I'm sure Ronnmark did the best he could and was pretty alone with it, but this is a recurring theme. If Sweden want better results, they need to start with the coaching. It's up to the coaches to make best use of the player material, but they always seems to get the worst out of it.
 
Last edited:

Wings4Life

Registered User
Apr 11, 2007
3,197
731
Ov Steamrolls Jagr!
Players I thought had good tournaments, or at least did what the could given their role:

Björnfot
Niederbach
Raymond
Nybeck
Söderblom

A couple of others did okay and about a dozen players were underwhelming.

Agreed with all your picks.

Söderström was disappointing especially in his own end I thought. Broberg was playing injured so his performance was understandable.
 

OiledUp

Registered User
Sep 17, 2011
2,233
1,529
Players I thought had good tournaments, or at least did what the could given their role:

Björnfot
Niederbach
Raymond
Nybeck
Söderblom

A couple of others did okay and about a dozen players were underwhelming.

Agreed, the majority of the players on the team had a weak tournament.

Outside of a couple of short spells, ten minutes against Finland, a short stretch against the Czech, a PP fuelled period against Russia, the team never found any type of rythm or cohesive team play. And the only stretch where they played with any kind of intensity was those ten minutes against Finland.

When so many players perform badly you have to look at the coaches and management. Rönnmark felt like a deer in headlights tbh and was put in tough situation. Was probably unfortunate they weren't allowed to bring in Alfie and his brother, while inexperienced as coaches at this level Alfie at least has some authority.

Swedish U20 teams tend to perform at their best when they play a pro style in these tournaments, when they utilize the fact that most of the players are regulars on SHL or Allsvenskan teams and play a similar structured game. But the last couple of WJCs they've played a much more junior style of play with guys playing much more based on their individual skill, much less focus on team play, not nearly as aggressive in the neutral and defensive zone.
The SHL is almost unwatchable some games because there’s such a major focus on skating hard, checking through all zones, structured play, making the simple play at all times and so on. And I sure don't want them to fully adopt the SHL style, there should be way more room for skill plays and creativity, but you'd like to see some of that structure, team play and constant skating translate to the U20 team. This year it felt like they were completely disjointed both defensively and offensively and I don't think they ever brought their skating legs to Canada. Or maybe the skating legs are still in quarantine.
Offense was just based on individual efforts and you rarely saw any of that cycling game which is often a strength for swedish teams just a lot of one and done shots. The first PP lineup was a brilliant example of how all offense was based on individual performance, it just felt like five guys doing their specific skill on the PP, never five guys connecting and moving as a unit.

Overall just a poor performance and I hope swedish hockey goes back to the drawing table a bit.

As far as individual players I think it's difficult to rate them due to the team as a whole being such a mess. But of the high end guys I was a bit concerned that Söderström looked so slow, his skating looks good technically but he gets beaten in races all the time, that's not a great sign for a prospect, that he has work to do defensively wasn't surprising but that lack of speed was a surprise to me. Also Holtz looking as bad as he did, he looked a step behind the play the whole time, not from lack of skating speed but just seemed slow to react. And less agile than I remember from last year, has he been injured? I can't recall if he missed any time in the SHL the last while. Both issues could be from him putting too much pressure on himself, he didn't seem like a guy in the right head spade this tournament. Had a similar feeling with Broberg, hard to tell how much of that was him being frustrated with his injury though, I think he really wanted to show well in his future home rink, as the captain and in his third and final WJC, to then be injured and not able to use your main skill must be frustrating as hell.
 

Zub

Registered User
Nov 7, 2015
2,998
2,955
Helsinki
Feeling abit pissed off about 3 of your players going after one of ours after the game has ended and to top that off one of your players kept his helmet on at the national anthem of Finland, this Swedish team had some serious attitude problems it seems like. Leaving your helmet on in national anthem is strictly against the rules too and not to mention disrespectful as hell, unacceptable.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Svedu

swedehollow

Registered User
Aug 15, 2018
372
304
Feeling abit pissed off about 3 of your players going after one of ours after the game has ended and to top that off one of your players kept his helmet on at the national anthem of Finland, this Swedish team had some serious attitude problems it seems like. Leaving your helmet on in national anthem is strictly against the rules too and not to mention disrespectful as hell, unacceptable.
While I agree regarding the three players, I guess there is no smoke without a fire. Something started this. It's not uncommon for some Finns to mock Swedes if they win. I heard of people in Tornedalen getting visited by Finns driving around in cars and waving flags, just to mock and to rub it in, even burning Swedish flags when Finland beats Sweden. So, the respect goes both ways...
 
  • Like
Reactions: canswetoxic

Garl

Registered User
Oct 7, 2006
8,032
1,016
I feel bad for Sweden overall. Losing Henriksson and Lundkvist definitely hurt.
It didn't hurt actually. People keep thinking it is because player A was ill, or player B was injured. Reality is, in last 15 years, Sweden had good rosters and not so good rosters, result is usually the same. And the best junior team we had in this timespan was actually the worst i terms of roster, in 2008.

Again, individual players level is fine, it is the coaching and maybe some mental stuff that is preventing Sweden from doing better.
 

swedehollow

Registered User
Aug 15, 2018
372
304
It didn't hurt actually. People keep thinking it is because player A was ill, or player B was injured. Reality is, in last 15 years, Sweden had good rosters and not so good rosters, result is usually the same. And the best junior team we had in this timespan was actually the worst i terms of roster, in 2008.

Again, individual players level is fine, it is the coaching and maybe some mental stuff that is preventing Sweden from doing better.
Yes, I believe sports psychology is a huge untapped well of potential for any athlete. Just look at what happens when a goal scorer gets "snake bitten" vs "hot", or when a goalie is "in the zone"... And it goes further; posture, demeanour, what you say and what you don't, how you lead. All these things showed in the Swedish players in the second half of the game. This is what ultimately cost them a place in the semis.
 

swedehollow

Registered User
Aug 15, 2018
372
304
Yes, I believe sports psychology is a huge untapped well of potential for any athlete. Just look at what happens when a goal scorer gets "snake bitten" vs "hot", or when a goalie is "in the zone"... And it goes further; posture, demeanour, what you say and what you don't, how you lead. All these things showed in the Swedish players in the second half of the game. This is what ultimately cost them a place in the semis.
...just look at "Miracle on Ice (1980)". Did USA have a better team than the Soviets? No. they did not. Did Finland have a better team than Sweden. I believe not.
 

canswetoxic

Registered User
Dec 29, 2015
989
250
Toronto
While I agree regarding the three players, I guess there is no smoke without a fire. Something started this. It's not uncommon for some Finns to mock Swedes if they win. I heard of people in Tornedalen getting visited by Finns driving around in cars and waving flags, just to mock and to rub it in, even burning Swedish flags when Finland beats Sweden. So, the respect goes both ways...

Well, when the Finns get mocked they are outrageous, but when they mocks Sweden, its fine because they think its feel so good to mock Sweden because they wouldn't get much chances on other sports or others or worse probably still hurts from the ancient history of OS 2006.
 

aphyro

För evigt trogen AIK
May 16, 2013
2,445
250
Sundsvall
It didn't hurt actually. People keep thinking it is because player A was ill, or player B was injured. Reality is, in last 15 years, Sweden had good rosters and not so good rosters, result is usually the same. And the best junior team we had in this timespan was actually the worst i terms of roster, in 2008.

Again, individual players level is fine, it is the coaching and maybe some mental stuff that is preventing Sweden from doing better.

Thats because we have a loser mentality in this country... it's the hurtfull and hard truth.

Sure winning a bronze is "okay" but you don't need to celebrate it like you won the gold like they do in other sports... you should allways aim to be the best.
 

Lartsaman

Registered User
Aug 2, 2018
537
309
Finland
While I agree regarding the three players, I guess there is no smoke without a fire. Something started this. It's not uncommon for some Finns to mock Swedes if they win. I heard of people in Tornedalen getting visited by Finns driving around in cars and waving flags, just to mock and to rub it in, even burning Swedish flags when Finland beats Sweden. So, the respect goes both ways...

Thats true unfortunately. It was mentioned at the Finnish news also. It happened in 2011 and I think many finns were ashamed of those drunk idiots. The vast majority of supporters are respective though. Not much swede-mocking nowadays. It was purely because of low self-esteem and too many years without winning anything at all and allways losing the decisive games....
 

NyQuil

Big F$&*in Q
Jan 5, 2005
95,686
59,931
Ottawa, ON

swedehollow

Registered User
Aug 15, 2018
372
304
Thats because we have a loser mentality in this country... it's the hurtfull and hard truth.

Sure winning a bronze is "okay" but you don't need to celebrate it like you won the gold like they do in other sports... you should allways aim to be the best.
I don't think there's a "loser mentality". You could see that on the faces of the Swedish team after the horn. But, there's a difference between wanting to win and being afraid to lose. According to the players, they became afraid to lose after they took the lead. This is where you need leaders both behind the bench, on the bench and on the ice. And it all starts behind the bench.
 

Fatass

Registered User
Apr 17, 2017
22,121
14,043
I don't think there's a "loser mentality". You could see that on the faces of the Swedish team after the horn. But, there's a difference between wanting to win and being afraid to lose. According to the players, they became afraid to lose after they took the lead. This is where you need leaders both behind the bench, on the bench and on the ice. And it all starts behind the bench.
Coaches need to put players into positions where those players have the confidence to be their best, and win. But the Swedish top players didn’t come through, regardless of what their coaches did. Raymond, Holts, Broberg, and Soderstrom. Those were the Swede’s win or lose key players.
 

OgeeOgelthorpe

Baldina
Feb 29, 2020
17,170
18,270
I don't think there's a "loser mentality". You could see that on the faces of the Swedish team after the horn. But, there's a difference between wanting to win and being afraid to lose. According to the players, they became afraid to lose after they took the lead. This is where you need leaders both behind the bench, on the bench and on the ice. And it all starts behind the bench.

That's kinda what I noticed, too. They went into the 2nd period with a lead and then sat back on their heels and let Finland dictate the game. This team was passive against the Russians and they lost. Same against USA, and same against Finland from the 2nd period on. They were at their best playing up-tempo and attacking as a 5 man unit. Coaching and leadership are key to taking care of that.
 
  • Like
Reactions: swedehollow

aphyro

För evigt trogen AIK
May 16, 2013
2,445
250
Sundsvall
I don't think there's a "loser mentality". You could see that on the faces of the Swedish team after the horn. But, there's a difference between wanting to win and being afraid to lose. According to the players, they became afraid to lose after they took the lead. This is where you need leaders both behind the bench, on the bench and on the ice. And it all starts behind the bench.

I know that... but just check how our socity is built it's loser mentality all over it... it was a hugh debate about the kids leauge if or if we should not have a system were the winner gets prizes and the losers gets nothing and everyone went bananas about it... we should start from young age to drill our kids in to be winners... and the mentality it's "okay to lose".
 

Jussi

Registered User
Feb 28, 2002
91,528
11,131
Mojo Dojo Casa House
Well, Barrett Hayton had to come out and issue a public statement when this happened last year.

I assume that this incident is equally scandalous and will result in hundreds of HF posts just like when a Canadian does it.

Canadian Captain Barrett Hayton didn't remove his helmet for the Russian anthem

Swedes were handed a "strong warning" from the IIHF for it. Team Finland GM Kimmo Oikarinen said Swedes approached him after the game and apologized, saying "sometimes these kids don't remember to behave accordingly."

https://www.is.fi/jaakiekko/art-2000007720095.html
 
  • Like
Reactions: NyQuil

Garl

Registered User
Oct 7, 2006
8,032
1,016
Ok, some summary of my thoughts:

In terms of player development Sweden is doing good overall. If you take Team Sweden Olympic 2014 roster and compare it with the current best roster, current one is superior. So, the players are incoming, we see it.

However, almost all of this players did bad at WJC. And I tend to think that this is on coaching. How you can tell a good coach from a bad one? A good coach will make so, that his best players will deliver, a bad one will not.
Best swedish performances in WJC in last 15 years have been largerly "grunts" victories. 2008 team had no stars(if you don't count very young Hedman), 2018 was largerly Jonsson Fjalby, Soderlund, Steen etc success against the US in the semis, 2012 our hero was Friberg. Star player performance is our biggest issue and that comes from coaching.
Listen, take a look at Valery Bragin from Team Russia. Under him, almost all russian stars had great WJCs. Tarasenko, Kuznetsov, Panarin, Provorov, Kaprizov, Kucherov. Why Russia got 24 pts in 14 games from Evgeny Kuznetsov, and Sweden got 8 pts in 14 games from Elias Pettersson, a player of similar, if not superior talent? And it is not a coincidence, it is a long time trend.

On a senior level, Sweden has less failures mainly due to the fact, that coaching young men and grown men is not the same. This guys like Hedman, Hornqvist, Backstrom etc have been through a lot in their careers already, and they don't need leadership as much. Still, Sweden suffers from lousy tactics time to time, and the last time team Sweden overperformed was probably under BA Gustafsson, whom many didn't like, but his teams did not crumble and got scored on like Marts/Gronborg teams.
But with juniors it is even more evident, without proper leadership it is very hard to win and to show your best performance.
 

Zub

Registered User
Nov 7, 2015
2,998
2,955
Helsinki
Ok, some summary of my thoughts:

In terms of player development Sweden is doing good overall. If you take Team Sweden Olympic 2014 roster and compare it with the current best roster, current one is superior. So, the players are incoming, we see it.

However, almost all of this players did bad at WJC. And I tend to think that this is on coaching. How you can tell a good coach from a bad one? A good coach will make so, that his best players will deliver, a bad one will not.
Best swedish performances in WJC in last 15 years have been largerly "grunts" victories. 2008 team had no stars(if you don't count very young Hedman), 2018 was largerly Jonsson Fjalby, Soderlund, Steen etc success against the US in the semis, 2012 our hero was Friberg. Star player performance is our biggest issue and that comes from coaching.
Listen, take a look at Valery Bragin from Team Russia. Under him, almost all russian stars had great WJCs. Tarasenko, Kuznetsov, Panarin, Provorov, Kaprizov, Kucherov. Why Russia got 24 pts in 14 games from Evgeny Kuznetsov, and Sweden got 8 pts in 14 games from Elias Pettersson, a player of similar, if not superior talent? And it is not a coincidence, it is a long time trend.

On a senior level, Sweden has less failures mainly due to the fact, that coaching young men and grown men is not the same. This guys like Hedman, Hornqvist, Backstrom etc have been through a lot in their careers already, and they don't need leadership as much. Still, Sweden suffers from lousy tactics time to time, and the last time team Sweden overperformed was probably under BA Gustafsson, whom many didn't like, but his teams did not crumble and got scored on like Marts/Gronborg teams.
But with juniors it is even more evident, without proper leadership it is very hard to win and to show your best performance.
Sure is, the gap is even bigger for Team Finland if you compare our Sochi roster which consisted barely any elite talent with what we now got, now we are going to have a fully loaded NHL team with a heck of alot of elite talent, almost All Star team. Next Olympics is going to be huge.
 
  • Like
Reactions: swedehollow

Chimpradamus

Registered User
Feb 16, 2006
16,634
5,249
Northern Sweden
I don't think there's a "loser mentality". You could see that on the faces of the Swedish team after the horn. But, there's a difference between wanting to win and being afraid to lose. According to the players, they became afraid to lose after they took the lead. This is where you need leaders both behind the bench, on the bench and on the ice. And it all starts behind the bench.
Yes and Sweden was hit particulary hard when it comes to the coaches. Sweden cannot afford to be without the two best centers and the coaching staff. I don't think any team can at junior level.
 
  • Like
Reactions: swedehollow

swedehollow

Registered User
Aug 15, 2018
372
304
Sure is, the gap is even bigger for Team Finland if you compare our Sochi roster which consisted barely any elite talent with what we now got, now we are going to have a fully loaded NHL team with a heck of alot of elite talent, almost All Star team. Next Olympics is going to be huge.
Couldn’t agree more! Even Germany will have a great team!
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad