GDT: 2021-2022 Trade Deadline frenzy

[Bowe Byrum]

Totally fair assessment. Maybe I'm being too cautious like Sakic the past years. But we just brought in a lot of depth that seems to indicate Kaut and Bowers have no future with us, so why not deal them? As far as selling high, part of my problem is I think we sold low on higher value prospects. We attached a 2nd to both of them for a 3rd line winger and a bottom pairing UFA defensive defender. Feel like both prospects ~1:1 would have been more reasonable.

Am I the only one thinking that way? I'm happy we're loading up for a run, I'd just prefer in 2 years we weren't then struggling to bring in quality youth to reinforce an expensive aging team.

I'm with you.

 

[Bowe Byrum]

A prospect + pick is a pretty standard price at the deadline, especially for a player with term. As fans we get a bit attached to prospects and also tend to overvalue picks but GM's look at 2nd rounders as having <25% chance of becoming impact players in the NHL. Getting 100 NHL games out of a 2nd round pick is statistically a success, and yet you can pick up players on waivers for free who have 100 games. A 2nd + prospect is just the price of doing business if you want to acquire good players.

42% 100 games for 2nd rounder was the number on the Sportsnet show. PJ stocks side of the argument. Anthony Stewart side was well Shea Weber and Patrice Bergeron

 

[Bowe Byrum]

A prospect + pick is a pretty standard price at the deadline, especially for a player with term. As fans we get a bit attached to prospects and also tend to overvalue picks but GM's look at 2nd rounders as having <25% chance of becoming impact players in the NHL. Getting 100 NHL games out of a 2nd round pick is statistically a success, and yet you can pick up players on waivers for free who have 100 games. A 2nd + prospect is just the price of doing business if you want to acquire good players.

100 games for 2nd rounder was the number on the Sportsnet show. PJ stocks side of the argument. Anthony Stewart side was well Shea Weber and Patrice Bergeron.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

Retaining 50% also increases the cost.

As for Kaut and Bowers let's not forget that the Eagles are doing very well this year and they need these players for their own playoffs run.

 

[Richard88]

42% 100 games for 2nd rounder was the number on the Sportsnet show. PJ stocks side of the argument. Anthony Stewart side was well Shea Weber and Patrice Bergeron

42% for 100 games, but far less for an impact player. Rebuilding teams aren't interested in 4th liners who can get 100 games, they want potential impact players (ie. top 9F and top 4D).

 

[niwotsblessing]

Oh I was here. People are always going to speculate and be pessimistic. Nobody is going to love every trade (but I don't recall seeing anyone complain about Lehkonen). Even then, none of that lessens their fan status.

All good.

But I will note for the record that you criticized me for criticizing others, it felt like a strange loop.

 

[Richard88]

Retaining 50% also increases the cost.

As for Kaut and Bowers let's not forget that the Eagles are doing very well this year and they need these players for their own playoffs run.

If a good deal was to be had using Kaut or Bowers I have no doubt Sakic would have traded them. He traded Barron after all who was also an important player on the Eagles.
Most likely Kaut and Bowers didn't carry enough value to bring back a significant piece.

 

[Bowe Byrum]

42% for 100 games, but far less for an impact player. Rebuilding teams aren't interested in 4th liners who can get 100 games, they want potential impact players (ie. top 9F and top 4D).

Sorry I meant to say 24 % not 42 . I saw that stat on the deadline show was my point in agreement with you. I can't remeber the exact number for 3rd to 5th rounders but was surprised they aren't much lower. 20 ish %

Also Stewart made a good point about a % of 1sts that get 100 ganes because they were 1sts and teams want to save face in those

 

[Balthazar]

Retaining 50% also increases the cost.

Not sure if it's been answered but did we really need the Habs to retain 50% on Lehkonen? I hope we didn't pay more in assets for them to retain and then didn't spend the extra cap space.

 

[Avs44]

If a good deal was to be had using Kaut or Bowers I have no doubt Sakic would have traded them. He traded Barron after all who was also an important player on the Eagles.
Most likely Kaut and Bowers didn't carry enough value to bring back a significant piece.

Is Bowers' value any higher than like a 6th round pick at this point...? He's five years out from being drafted and has 8 points in 31 AHL games this year...

 

[TruePowerSlave]

Totally fair assessment. Maybe I'm being too cautious like Sakic the past years. But we just brought in a lot of depth that seems to indicate Kaut and Bowers have no future with us, so why not deal them? As far as selling high, part of my problem is I think we sold low on higher value prospects. We attached a 2nd to both of them for a 3rd line winger and a bottom pairing UFA defensive defender. Feel like both prospects ~1:1 would have been more reasonable.

Am I the only one thinking that way? I'm happy we're loading up for a run, I'd just prefer in 2 years we weren't then struggling to bring in quality youth to reinforce an expensive aging team.

Either you pay the price or give up on a possible cup run, those were the Avs options this deadline.

Nobody was going to trade quality pieces that are needed for the playoffs for a bunch of meh crap like Kaut or Bowers.

 

[AllAboutAvs]

If a good deal was to be had using Kaut or Bowers I have no doubt Sakic would have traded them. He traded Barron after all who was also an important player on the Eagles.
Most likely Kaut and Bowers didn't carry enough value to bring back a significant piece.

Oh I completely agree with that. I meant that you don't trade them just to trade them. If you do trade them it needs to be for upgrade for at least the AHL level because currently they have more value to the Eagles than to the Avs. You don't want to affect their own (the Eagles I mean) chemistry just for the sake of trading them.

 

[MacKaRant]

Not sure if it's been answered but did we really need the Habs to retain 50% on Lehkonen? I hope we didn't pay more in assets for them to retain and then didn't spend the extra cap space.

We used that extra cap space to acquire Cogliano.

 

[VikingAv]

Is Bowers' value any higher than like a 6th round pick at this point...? He's five years out from being drafted and has 8 points in 31 AHL games this year...

Don't think he even has that value anymore. If he's waiver eligible next year I expect him to not ber picked up and 90% of hf posters will be in shock and awe that a former 1st rounder wasn't picked up.

 

[Goulet17]

I am still trying to wrap my head around that at this time last year, Colorado had Timmins, Barron, and Helleson as RHD prospects in the organization. It was a unique position of strength. A year later and they are all gone.

As Sakic said, I guess you have to give to get.

 

[EdAVSfan]

I am still trying to wrap my head around that at this time last year, Colorado had Timmins, Barron, and Helleson as RHD prospects in the organization. It was a unique position of strength. A year later and they are all gone.

As Sakic said, I guess you have to give to get.

It’s definitely true.

But, as a counter point, this is also probably the best and most balanced team we’ve had in close to 15-20 years.

 

[Alex Jones]

I am still trying to wrap my head around that at this time last year, Colorado had Timmins, Barron, and Helleson as RHD prospects in the organization. It was a unique position of strength. A year later and they are all gone.

As Sakic said, I guess you have to give to get.

We don't know if any of those guys will be good.

 

[Pokecheque]

I am still trying to wrap my head around that at this time last year, Colorado had Timmins, Barron, and Helleson as RHD prospects in the organization. It was a unique position of strength. A year later and they are all gone.

As Sakic said, I guess you have to give to get.

Good point, things change in a hurry I suppose. Barron and Helleson will be legit NHL players, I have very little reason to doubt that. I think we all know why they moved on from Timmins.

 

[shadow1]

I am still trying to wrap my head around that at this time last year, Colorado had Timmins, Barron, and Helleson as RHD prospects in the organization. It was a unique position of strength. A year later and they are all gone.

As Sakic said, I guess you have to give to get.

I'm definitely surprised too. I thought 1-2 of those guys would be dealt, but not all 3.

I don't blame Sakic though. Those guys (aside from Timmins) are a couple years away from moving the needle and probably would've busted based on this organization's development of late-1st rounders/2nd rounders.

 

[Bowe Byrum]

Joe says Lehkonen will be a great winger for Alex Newhook.
Sounds to me like Newhook will be and is expected to be a center

 

[Pokecheque]

Joe says Lehkonen will be a great winger for Alex Newhook.
Sounds to me like Newhook will be and is expected to be a center

At present he's probably their best option at 3C, and I'm sure they want to try him with a legit play-driver who does well in all three zones before they decide where he's at going forward.

 

[Hans Landaskog]

At present he's probably their best option at 3C, and I'm sure they want to try him with a legit play-driver who does well in all three zones before they decide where he's at going forward.

I'd prefer if Bednar learned who Lehkonen was first

 

[Hesher]

The lack of a true #3C is still an issue, but the team is undoubtedly better now than it was before all the trades.

 

[Pokecheque]

In all the excitement of last night I forgot to be relieved the Avs did not trade for the one player I did not want them to trade for.

 

[Cousin Eddie]

My fear with Newhook as a 3C isn’t that he can’t be a 3C. It’s that I don’t think he’s good enough to handle a bigger role of one of our top 6 C’s go down with an injury. However I’ve been reminded of the job Mikko did at centre last month and it makes me feel a little better.