2020-21 Around the League part VI

[Metallo]

They've won Cups recently, have high end talent, and have gathered a solid collection of young talent.

Their depth and defense is putrid. They are years aways from contending, by then Jones will be declining.

 

[henchman21]

Their depth and defense is putrid. They are years aways from contending, by then Jones will be declining.

That's just not true. They are rebuilding and still a touch away, but they'll start being back in the playoffs next year. If Dach progresses like some believe (I'm not in that camp), they'll have the pieces to be contenders again in ~3 years.

 

[Pokecheque]

Yeah, the Hawks have done the rebuild-on-the-fly thing better than any other team I can remember. That said, I'm skeptical as to whether or not they can pull it off. But if they already have a legit franchise goalie then that's a huge piece of the puzzle right there.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

 

[Shane Diesel]

That's just not true. They are rebuilding and still a touch away, but they'll start being back in the playoffs next year. If Dach progresses like some believe (I'm not in that camp), they'll have the pieces to be contenders again in ~3 years.

Chicago Blackhawks - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

That defense is objectively terrible. They aren't going anywhere until they fix it. Not to mention in three years Kane will be 35 and Toews (if he's even healthy to play) will be 36. Chicago will need Dach to be an absolute superstar for Chicago to be contending in three years. And that doesn't even take into account the fact they have nothing along the lines of proven goaltending.

 

[henchman21]

Chicago Blackhawks - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

That defense is objectively terrible. They aren't going anywhere until they fix it. Not to mention in three years Kane will be 35 and Toews (if he's even healthy to play) will be 36. Chicago will need Dach to be an absolute superstar for Chicago to be contending in three years. And that doesn't even take into account the fact they have nothing along the lines of proven goaltending.

I know their build of the team... Boqvist, Mitchell, Kalynuk, and especially Beaudin are a solid young base of defensemen. They probably get 2 legit top 4 guys in that group and all are full time NHL level players. Beaudin might end up a low end top pairing guy. Stillman is also a name a lot around the NHL like (I'm not as convinced). They also have a few guys still coming up including Vlasic. Throw Seth Jones into that mix, and they should be able to build up a solid defensive group.

Up front they have Cat, Dach, Kurashev, and Hagel as 23 and under top 9 guys. Doesn't include Reichel or Slaggert who are coming up. Nor the early career guys like Strome, Suter, Gaudette, and Kubalik. Nor Borgstrom who might finally click one day. You're underrating their team and scouting.

 

[Shane Diesel]

I know their build of the team... Boqvist, Mitchell, Kalynuk, and especially Beaudin are a solid young base of defensemen. They probably get 2 legit top 4 guys in that group and all are full time NHL level players. Beaudin might end up a low end top pairing guy. Stillman is also a name a lot around the NHL like (I'm not as convinced). They also have a few guys still coming up including Vlasic. Throw Seth Jones into that mix, and they should be able to build up a solid defensive group.

Up front they have Cat, Dach, Kurashev, and Hagel as 23 and under top 9 guys. Doesn't include Reichel or Slaggert who are coming up. Nor the early career guys like Strome, Suter, Gaudette, and Kubalik. Nor Borgstrom who might finally click one day. You're underrating their team and scouting.

Projection, projection, projection. If all of those players hit their ceiling then maybe they're a contender. Not all of those players will.

 

[henchman21]

Projection, projection, projection. If all of those players hit their ceiling then maybe they're a contender. Not all of those players will.

They don't need all of them to... just some of them. Chicago has a fantastic set of scouts, they are good at developing, and they've been building talent.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

 

[sethro109]

I hope Chicago at least bought Edmonton dinner first.

 

[S E P H]

I don't understand that just because "x" got traded to "y" team, then "x" player has to be on his way there type of posts. If Tkachuk gets traded to the Blues, then I'll have to read multiple posts about how Brady is eventually going to join him. I just don't think that's the case for Seth or Brady, the only reason they'd eventually join those clubs is because nobody wants to play for the Senators or Blue Jackets. However, if Seth Jones was ever traded to the Bruins or Flyers (not considering cap circumstances) I have a hard time believing he'll go to UFA to join his bro in Chicago. If Seth decides to go to Chicago, it'll be because of the organisation being in a city and also being an original six instead of Caleb being traded there.

 

[Pokecheque]

I don't understand that just because "x" got traded to "y" team, then "x" player has to be on his way there type of posts. If Tkachuk gets traded to the Blues, then I'll have to read multiple posts about how Brady is eventually going to join him. I just don't think that's the case for Seth or Brady, the only reason they'd eventually join those clubs is because nobody wants to play for the Senators or Blue Jackets. However, if Seth Jones was ever traded to the Bruins or Flyers (not considering cap circumstances) I have a hard time believing he'll go to UFA to join his bro in Chicago. If Seth decides to go to Chicago, it'll be because of the organisation being in a city and also being an original six instead of Caleb being traded there.

There's a huge difference here. Tkachuk is a fantastic NHL player in his own right so I don't think people would automatically assume because STL traded for Matthew that they were going for a Tkachuk brothers reunion. Sure, there'd be speculation, but it wouldn't be assumed. Here, there's too much smoke for there to be a fire. Caleb Jones is not a good NHL player in his own right.

Also, if Bowman traded for Caleb Jones as part of an attempt to sell the idea of trading for and signing Seth to an extension, then it's possible he did his homework and found out either through the family or his agent that playing on the same team as his brother would play a factor.

 

[Metallo]

That's just not true. They are rebuilding and still a touch away, but they'll start being back in the playoffs next year. If Dach progresses like some believe (I'm not in that camp), they'll have the pieces to be contenders again in ~3 years.

So waste 3yrs of your prime for a what if scenario or join a contender now (not necessarily the Avs).

 

[Pokecheque]

So waste 3yrs of your prime for a what if scenario or join a contender now (not necessarily the Avs).

We don't know what Seth Jones wants. Probably a better market to play in than Lumbus, a more stable organization that's building toward a more sustainable contention window, and I'm sure he wants to get paid. But those are just guesses on my part--I don't think the "play on a legit contender or Cup favorite" plays as big a role as people might think.

 

[henchman21]

So waste 3yrs of your prime for a what if scenario or join a contender now (not necessarily the Avs).

Jones has given indications that he wants to choose where he goes long term. We don't know his priorities.

 

[henchman21]

We don't know what Seth Jones wants. Probably a better market to play in than Lumbus, a more stable organization that's building toward a more sustainable contention window, and I'm sure he wants to get paid. But those are just guesses on my part--I don't think the "play on a legit contender or Cup favorite" plays as big a role as people might think.

It doesn't play nearly as big of factor as people think. Specific instances for low dollar guys who have already made enough will make sacrifices to go to contenders (see Shatty, Bogo, and Maroon in Tampa), but guys who are key core level pieces. They can turn franchises and as we've seen many times, teams go on runs and compete when the experts don't think they can.

 

[Metallo]

We don't know what Seth Jones wants. Probably a better market to play in than Lumbus, a more stable organization that's building toward a more sustainable contention window, and I'm sure he wants to get paid. But those are just guesses on my part--I don't think the "play on a legit contender or Cup favorite" plays as big a role as people might think.

That’s part of my initial question. What motivates him appart from money and baby brother? Maybe nothing. Maybe he likes wind.

 

[Pokecheque]

That’s part of my initial question. What motivates him appart from money and baby brother? Maybe nothing. Maybe he likes wind.

Chicago is a great city if you can stand the weather--and I imagine the weather there can't be much worse than it is in Ohio.

I don't know how much playing with his brother factors into this--but as I said before I don't think Bowman goes out and gets him if he didn't at least have a faint notion that it would play a factor in getting him to sign. I remember reading how Scott Niedermayer, when he was deciding on a FA destination, said that he wanted to play closer to home, he wanted to play for a contender, and he wanted to play with his brother Rob. Brian Burke said that Anaheim was the only team that could cross everything off his list, and so they got him.

 

[Balthazar]

That’s part of my initial question. What motivates him appart from money and baby brother? Maybe nothing. Maybe he likes wind.

Chicago is a big city in a big market and one of the original 6.

Tons of players want to go play for the Rags all the time and it sure isn't because of their playoff success.

 

[Bill Peckerskull]

Full trade...

 

[Pokecheque]

The more I look at that trade the more I hate it for Edmonton. Holland was competing with absolutely NO ONE for Keith's services, and yet still didn't leverage more amenable terms.

 

[Pokecheque]

Oh, BTW, with the Winterhawks announcing they're ditching the Blackhawks-inspired look, I'm guessing the Hawks themselves will be moving on from this logo in the next year or two...

 

[Foppberg]

Oh, BTW, with the Winterhawks announcing they're ditching the Blackhawks-inspired look, I'm guessing the Hawks themselves will be moving on from this logo in the next year or two...

Better freaking not. It's a beautiful logo.

 

[Balthazar]

The more I look at that trade the more I hate it for Edmonton. Holland was competing with absolutely NO ONE for Keith's services, and yet still didn't leverage more amenable terms.

We don't know that. In fact we have to believe that he was competing with someone otherwise he'd never have done that.

If I had to guess Seattle was going to pick him in the expansion draft (Keith agreed to go there), and to get him Holland had to pay up to compensate for the loss of the other player that Seattle will pick now that Keith is gone.

So the 3rd pick and Jones is for the player that the Hawks will now lose in the XD.