2018 Hall of Fame Ballot released (Vlad, Chipper, Thome & Hoffman are in)

[robert terwilliger]

the idea is that you put in the guys who excel at what they do. obviously different positions are held to different standards because every player is different. positions are all different and have different impacts on the game. it's why sandy koufax and cal ripken jnr are in the same hall.

if you're a relief pitcher and throw about 1,000 innings in your career, they'd better be the best f***ing 1,000 innings possible of someone to pitch 1,000 innings. comparing mariano, who was given a job and stood out better than the 99% of the 99% of relief pitchers to ever pitch in relief of starters, who also was birthed onto a dynasty and tasked with pitching in the postseason every year...and absolutely crushed it. he was the best at his job that there ever was.

trevor hoffman wasn't. he was a guy who was present for 20 years, never really the best. i made the comparison earlier in this thread that if rivera and hoffman are retiring from the same job at the same building, you give hoffman a gold watch and name the building after rivera. they may have been playing the same position but boy was one of them a shit load better than the other.

 

[robert terwilliger]

and people are going to have to accept the specialization of baseball. there are closers in the hall now, undeserving ones like sutter, hoffman and probably fingers. the idea that edgar can't get in because he played a specialist position is a f***ing joke worthy of hawkman.

 

[darko]

Maybe someone will say but Roberto Alomar was elected, however I wonder if Delgado playing in Toronto all those years hurt his chances of at least staying on the ballot more than one year?

Now this also might not be a fair comparison but there was that one writer from Chicago who had his voting privileges taken away who didn't have Delgado on his MVP ballot in 2003 because he played in Toronto and basically hated Canada.

Nope. Fools like that guy are fortunately few and far between.

 

[robert terwilliger]

Major League Leaderboards » 2017 » Batters » Dashboard | FanGraphs Baseball

carlos delgado wears jim thome pajamas.

 

[Cheese Wagstaff]

Major League Leaderboards » 2017 » Batters » Dashboard | FanGraphs Baseball

carlos delgado wears jim thome pajamas.

You can convince me that Delgado deserved longer on the ballot, but he's hardly the worst one-and-done guy of this bloated ballot era. And yeah, he's not close to the same tier as Thome.

 

[robert terwilliger]

jim edmonds and bobby grich are laughing at the delgado truthers.

 

[Voight]

Hoffman gets in yet the best DH of all time, a top 3 pitcher of all time and arguably the second best player ever can't get in. Oh boy.

I strongly disagree Ortiz will get in on the 1st ballot, if at all.

He's linked to PEDs via Mitchum report and he's a DH.

He is absolutely deserving though. One of the best hitters ever, clutch AF in the playoffs.

Edgar is will get in in the next 2-4 years.

The DOJ should charge Cooperstown voters if the inferior Ortiz gets in before Edgar. Either way, Ortiz is not a first ballot player.

 

[Bjorn Le]

You can convince me that Delgado deserved longer on the ballot, but he's hardly the worst one-and-done guy of this bloated ballot era. And yeah, he's not close to the same tier as Thome.

There’s not many better players who were knocked of the first time. If he was a Yankee he likely would have stayed on for the full ten years.

 

[Cheese Wagstaff]

There’s not many better players who were knocked of the first time. If he was a Yankee he likely would have stayed on for the full ten years.

Jorge Posada and Bernie Williams were knocked off their first times. Both have higher fWARs than Delgado (they're all close and WAR isn't gospel, but they had comparably successful careers). And in Bernie's case his WAR doesn't account for the fact that he is possibly the best postseason performer of the Wild Card era.

For non Yankees in recent years I'd take Kenny Lofton, Jim Edmonds, and John Olerud over Delgado easily. (Olerud and Lofton were briefly Yankees, I know, but point remains).

Edit: Bernie lasted two ballots, my mistake. The other four though I still contend have better Hall resumes than Delgado.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

I Don't want to live in a world where Hoffman gets in and Manny only got 22%.

 

[Neutrinos]

You can convince me that Delgado deserved longer on the ballot, but he's hardly the worst one-and-done guy of this bloated ballot era. And yeah, he's not close to the same tier as Thome.

According to Jayson Stark, "Carlos Delgado is the best player in history to get booted off the Hall of Fame ballot after his first year."

Delgado deserved far better in HOF voting

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Johan getting only 2.8 percent is also sad. He was dominant at his peak. Yeah, it was short due to injury, but he still deserved better.

 

[Cheese Wagstaff]

According to Jayson Stark, "Carlos Delgado is the best player in history to get booted off the Hall of Fame ballot after his first year."

Delgado deserved far better in HOF voting

I strongly disagree with Jayson. Not a single one of the milestones he cites here accounts for the hitter's era Delgado played in or that he was a first baseman.

Delgado was awesome and I totally get why his fans wanted better for him. Unfortunately the ballot glut has created a lot of undeserved one-and-dones recently. He's one but he's far from the best.

 

[tony d]

Congrats to Vlad, Thome, Chipper and Hoffman on getting into the Hall. Thought Edgar would have got in too. Maybe next year. As to Bonds and Clemens, they should get in, think they finally get in by 2020 or 2021.

 

[Terry Yake]

I Don't want to live in a world where Hoffman gets in and Manny only got 22%.

we're living in a world where jack morris is in the HOF and bonds/clemens aren't

also, my favorite part of the ballot being released is going through it and seeing which players not even close to being HOF worthy got voted

this year we have:
10 votes for jamie moyer (same # as santana)
4 votes for matsui
2 for kerry wood
1 for carlos lee
1 for livan hernandez

i'm shocked no one voted for kevin millwood or carlos zambrano

 

[DoyleG]

Wow Clemens and Bonds only up 3%, not a positive day for them. Edgar's 50/50 imo next year.

Edgar should get in if the voters get over his loyalty to the Mariners.

 

[Runner77]

 

[Square Hammer*]

Boo. Was hoping he'd choose the Expos

 

[GIN ANTONIC]

First Angel to be inducted I think.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

we're living in a world where jack morris is in the HOF and bonds/clemens aren't

also, my favorite part of the ballot being released is going through it and seeing which players not even close to being HOF worthy got voted

this year we have:
10 votes for jamie moyer (same # as santana)
4 votes for matsui
2 for kerry wood
1 for carlos lee
1 for livan hernandez

i'm shocked no one voted for kevin millwood or carlos zambrano

Whoever voted for Lee and Livan should have to give up their voting privileges immediately.

 

[Quid Pro Clowe]

Boo. Was hoping he'd choose the Expos

Why would he go in for a team that doesn't exist anymore? Add the fact his mvp year was with the Angels.

 

[Bjorn Le]

Why would he go in for a team that doesn't exist anymore? Add the fact his mvp year was with the Angels.

Gary Carter, Andre Dawson, and Tim Raines all did. He also played his best years in Montreal, including multiple seasons better than his MVP season. I suspect he's going in as an Angel because there is no Angel's in the HOF. I didn't think players really got to pick anymore.

 

[Cheese Wagstaff]

Why would he go in for a team that doesn't exist anymore? Add the fact his mvp year was with the Angels.

Both of these are true about Andre Dawson (Cubs, not Angels) and he went in as an Expo.

 

[Neutrinos]

I thought the Hall of Fame no longer allowed players to choose their own cap after Wade Boggs put his up for auction to the highest bidder and tried to go in as a Devil Ray

I also remember Gary Carter wanting to go in as a Met

It really doesn't seem right, IMO. I think Guerrero absolutely should be inducted as an Expo

 

[darko]

Johan getting only 2.8 percent is also sad. He was dominant at his peak. Yeah, it was short due to injury, but he still deserved better.

Has no business in HOF but that 3 year stretch was dominant. Best pitcher in baseball during those years (04-06 i think).