2017 NHL Draft (Mod warning Post #736)

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Trelane

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I swallowed taking a D man last year because there was legit need. OJ, Tryamkin, Stecher, Brisebois and whoever else emerges from the later rounds in this and previous years should be more than enough to reserve 1st rounders for badly needed help up front for a few drafts.

Hopefully Benning will be as eager to address positional need as he was last time. If the N Americans are gone he can lean on Gradin and get his best Euro, non smurf forward left on the board.
 

PG Canuck

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I swallowed taking a D man last year because there was legit need. OJ, Tryamkin, Stecher, Brisebois and whoever else emerges from the later rounds in this and previous years should be more than enough to reserve 1st rounders for badly needed help up front for a few drafts.

Hopefully Benning will be as eager to address positional need as he was last time. If the N Americans are gone he can lean on Gradin and get his best Euro, non smurf forward left on the board.

Have you looked around the league lately? Those 'smurfs' are doing just fine, as long as they have skills and smarts, they are excelling in this league. Are you already forgetting the 2014 draft?
 

GetFocht

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Smurf to me is anyone that's 5'9 and below, it makes it much harder for those players to make the NHL. Look at what happened to Gaudreau today, absolutely obliterated from one solid hit.
 

PG Canuck

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Smurf to me is anyone that's 5'9 and below, it makes it much harder for those players to make the NHL. Look at what happened to Gaudreau today, absolutely obliterated from one solid hit.

Atkinson 5'8"
Marchand 5'9" (although, he doesn't play like it)
Zuccarello 5"7"
Gaudreau 5'9"

Plus there's more. Gaudreau wasn't smoked because he's a 'smurf'. :laugh:
 

JA

Guest
Look at what happened to Gaudreau today, absolutely obliterated from one solid hit.
Patrik Laine is 6'4''.



It's likely impossible to count how many times 6'3'', 230-pound Jaromir Jagr has been destroyed by a big body check. Below are 13 examples.

[collapse=jagr]






[/collapse]
I agree that size plays a role in determining whether a player can make the NHL; if an individual is undersized, then they require a high degree of skill to be effective. That said, if a player is worthy of being selected in the first round of the NHL draft, then they most likely possess the skill to overcome the obstacle of being undersized.

Size plays a greater factor for the bottom-six positions. A small forward might have more difficulty playing the checking role that is required of those players. Thus, if a small player is not skilled enough to be an offensive forward, they might not have a place with the team unless they possess enough strength to play a checking game. Jordin Tootoo is an example of a short player who has no trouble playing a bottom-six role. He is 5'9'', but he weighs 194 lbs and is stocky.

Jordan Schroeder is a lightweight, on the other hand. A player of his size needs to be skilled enough to be an offensive contributor -- otherwise, they will struggle to find a role.

Smaller forwards tend not to be as versatile as larger forwards.

Kailer Yamamoto is a top-six or bust type of player. At 5'9'', 160 lbs, he would not be deemed ideal for a bottom-six role.
 
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y2kcanucks

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I swallowed taking a D man last year because there was legit need. OJ, Tryamkin, Stecher, Brisebois and whoever else emerges from the later rounds in this and previous years should be more than enough to reserve 1st rounders for badly needed help up front for a few drafts.

Hopefully Benning will be as eager to address positional need as he was last time. If the N Americans are gone he can lean on Gradin and get his best Euro, non smurf forward left on the board.

It was a huge mistake.

If the Canucks finish picking around 10-13th then I would argue they absolutely should look at one of the defensemen on board. Because they would likely be the BPA. The mistake going with Juolevi over Tkachuk last year is you took a lesser prospect to fill a positional need at the time. If you ignore defense now because you think you have it set, then once again you may end up drafting a lesser prospect. It's why drafting based on current positional need is so incredibly stupid.
 

Trelane

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/\/\ Way too early to have any regrets about 2016.

Have you looked around the league lately? Those 'smurfs' are doing just fine, as long as they have skills and smarts, they are excelling in this league. Are you already forgetting the 2014 draft?

Never had Ehlers or Nylander in the smurf category, which I define as less than 5'10 or 5'11 for forwards and D respectively. Always figure average height pencil necks like Ehlers gain beef eventually. Basically, this year it's only Yamamoto I'd be wary of, maybe Tolvanen.


Anyone know what's wrong with Cody Glass that he can't crack top 15 in the rankings? Might be worth investigating seeing as he's behind only Hischier on Sham's draft list. The Potatoe's draft history was already the stuff of legends and he's only added to it since he would have taken Ehlers, Sprong, and Tkachuk had he called the shots for us in the 1st round the last three years.
 

biturbo19

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Jul 13, 2010
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I'm really interested in this whole Lias Andersson vs Elias Pettersson thing.


I'm not super high on Andersson, but he reminds me a lot of what Elias Lindholm has kinda settled into as a player. That's not a bad player to get out of the mid-ranges of this draft from the looks of it. A versatile C/W with decent size who can play an all around game and complement skill well. I like his game, even if i don't see a ton of super dynamic upside there.


Pettersson i just don't get. He's extremely slight of frame, doubt he's ever going to be more than a toothpick relative to NHLers. He gets dumped out of plays so easily. It's concerning to me. The elusiveness isn't there. It's one thing if a player is small or light...but he doesn't seem to have any of the elite skating or general elusiveness that lightweights succeed with. I just don't see him as this top-end NHL centerman so many here are projecting him as.
 

y2kcanucks

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/\/\ Way too early to have any regrets about 2016.

Not really.

Tkachuk was always projected as the better prospect, and the way his rookie season has gone he is showing just how good he is. Sure Juolevi could surprise people, but he never projected as a number 1 defenseman. He would have to exceed his expectations, and there's nothing about his Draft +1 season that suggests he will.
 

Trelane

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Not really.

Tkachuk was always projected as the better prospect, and the way his rookie season has gone he is showing just how good he is. Sure Juolevi could surprise people, but he never projected as a number 1 defenseman. He would have to exceed his expectations, and there's nothing about his Draft +1 season that suggests he will.

Honestly, as a draft day Tkachuk guy, I don't get why this is continuously brought up this early. It's not like we're into year three as is the case with Virtanen v Ehlers (or whoever) and where criticism and worry is justified, though the book is obviously not closed.

I would have thought it understood, especially by long time hockey followers, that D take longer to develop and that we likely won't know who got the better player for another 5 years or more. I can name several guys who got off to hot starts, had 40-50+ point rookie seasons and never took the next step or even finished with careers some would label as bust.

Also this business of putting ceilings on D prospects needs to stop. Tryamkin has allegedly gone from barely an NHL regular to being top 4 soon and now looks to have top pairing upside. I don't believe the hype but play along. What's the point of being anything else since what has Chara done at his age? Tanev a top pairing guy... never would have guessed early on. Larsson for Hall was an eyeopener but a pleasant one since that's the floor I figure Juolevi to have.

Don't remember this Tkachuk > OJ as "always" a thing prior to draft. If so it seems you have the hot hand. Why not put it to productive use and divulge this year's studs in the 5-12 range, instead of lamenting about the past. It is a 2017 draft thread after all.
 

WTG

December 5th
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We had like 2 whole threads about Tkachuck vs Dubios, consensus was which ever falls to us.

A lot of posters IIRC were very upset when Benning leaked that we apparently had a defenseman in our top 5 and thought Benning was going to muck up the pick. Turns out, those people were right. That is why people are upset.

A lot of ppl didn't even have Juolevi as their top defenseman, I had Bean, lots had Sergachev, some had Chychrun.

So when you say:

Don't remember this Tkachuk > OJ as "always" a thing prior to draft.

You are very mistaken
 

y2kcanucks

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Bob McKenzie's mid-season list comes out tomorrow.

This has me very interested.

I fully expect Patrick to be 1, and Hischier to be 2. Would be surprised if he doesn't have Liljegren at 3. From there on though it's a bit of a tossup.

I'm still very high on Vilardi, as well as Mittelstadt. I'm quickly warming up to Tippett as he continues to produce, and Tolvanen looked very good from what I saw at the WJC's. Is that the top 7?
 

Nuckles

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Lines for tonight's top prospects game (starting in a few minutes)



TEAM ORR

Popugaev 71 - Hischier 13 - Yamamoto 17
Rasmussen 15 - Glass 8 - Lind 16
Formenton 80 - Frost 61 - Mattheos 12
Strome 18 - Chmelevski 89 - Schnarr 7

Valimaki 3 - Phillips 53
Hague 41 - Timmins 21
Paquette 6 - Rasanen 77

D'Orio 33
DiPietro 64


TEAM CHERRY

Leschyshyn 9 - Patrick 19 - Tippett 47
Comptois 44 - Vilardi 13 - Suzuki 37
Morand 88 - Thomas 27 - Ruzicka 21
Ratcliffe 91 - Entwistle 4 - Lodnia 72

Joseph 15 - Foote 25
Tyszka 5 - Minulin 55
Crete-Belzile 6 - Jokiharju 16

Scott 33
Skinner 74
 

JA

Guest
Did anyone catch the Top Prospects game? Of the "Big Four" of today's game, only Owen Tippett hurt his stock.

Nico and Gabe were terrific today. Patrick played a fine game.

Vilardi showcased his strength around the net; he was very difficult for the opposition to handle down low; he's not fast, but he's smart, crafty, and strong. I compare him to Alex Frolov. His sub-par skating ability has worried many, but he didn't do anything today to hurt his draft stock and instead offered today's onlookers a glimpse of his better attributes.



Hischier was fabulous.

http://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/1220946-hischier-outshines-patrick-at-prospects-game-takes-top-player-honors
Hischier outshines Patrick at prospects game, takes top player honors
by Justin Cuthbert 1h ago

Nolan Patrick got his hands on the trophy in the end, but it was No. 2 ranked North American skater Nico Hischier who had scouts, pundits, and fans alike buzzing after the CHL/NHL Top Prospects Game in Quebec City.

Hischier scored a gorgeous breakaway goal off a Patrick turnover with a silky backhand move and also added two assists to take top player honors in a losing effort for Team Orr.

He outshone the presumptive No. 1 NHL draft choice with a dynamic offensive showcase, though Patrick, the captain for Team Cherry, did have a productive outing, collecting two assists and impressing physically.

Hischier, a Halifax Mooseheads center, has picked up momentum throughout his draft season. He scored four goals and seven points in five games at the World Junior Championship, and U.S. coach Bob Motzko labeled Hischier the best player his gold medal-winning side faced in the tournament after he nearly willed Switzerland past the Americans in the quarterfinal.

...

 
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Jack Burton

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Did anyone catch the Top Prospects game? Of the "Big Four" of today's game, only Owen Tippett hurt his stock.

Nico and Gabe were terrific today. Patrick played a fine game.

Vilardi showcased his strength around the net; he was very difficult for the opposition to handle down low; he's not fast, but he's smart, crafty, and strong. I compare him to Alex Frolov. His sub-par skating ability has worried many, but he didn't do anything today to hurt his draft stock and instead offered today's onlookers a glimpse of his better attributes.



Hischier was fabulous.

http://www.thescore.com/nhl/news/1220946-hischier-outshines-patrick-at-prospects-game-takes-top-player-honors




Yep I watched it :)

Patrick tried to do way too much out there and turned the puck over lots but you could see why he is a projected #1

Hischier is a absolute gem...definitely going to challenge for #1

Agree about everything you said about Vilardi, definitely a top 5 pick.

The player who impressed me the most, he's in those tweets...Popugaev! Excellent skating for his size with good vision and shot. I also really liked Entwistle's game, for a toothpick he sure didn't play like it and I thought he played a complete game given the ice time he received.

Special shout out to Yamamoto, Foote, Skinner and Dipietro as they all played well.
 
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Jack Burton

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On a final note...Patrick & Hischier are elite prospects.

The rest are very good complentary players @ a NHL level. I would be very happy if the Canucks could score a mid 1st & a early 2nd round pick :thumbu:
 
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