2017-18 Roster Talk: Part Ten

[Striiker]

Striiker, an English professor at your college should have taught you by now not to use “clearly,” “obviously,” & other absolutes in your persuasive essays.

Then I guess it’s a good thing Im not trying to write persuasive essays, right?

But I appreciate your valuable input.

 

[Striiker]

Kane was a smart choice. Whenever you get a player that can produce on his own it's a always a great thing for your team. Kessel, Patrick Kane, Hall are similar. And just like someone mentioned Skinner in off-season thread, he is pretty much in next tier alongside e.kane.
Think of Moluson and Okposo in their pre Tavares days. If Sharks really go after him that's another smart pickup for them.

Kane was fine for a team trying to compete this year.

But not for a team that had zero chance.

The Flyers wasting assets to add rentals would have been idiotic. Look at how the team has looked in this series.... that proves why. No rental forward fixes this. Not even close.

 

[deadhead]

You should be ashamed.

I pity you.

Being patronized by some kid who can barely shave is amusing.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

Kane was fine for a team trying to compete this year.

But not for a team that had zero chance.

The Flyers wasting assets to add rentals would have been idiotic. Look at how the team has looked in this series.... that proves why. No rental forward fixes this. Not even close.

Hextall wouldn't even touch that, considering he is not a two way player with a standpit character.

 

[Striiker]

Hextall wouldn't even touch that, considering he is not a two way player with a standpit character.

The character issues probably would have kept him away, but I don’t buy that the two-way play obsession.

He didn’t shy away from drafting a flashy offensive guy like Konecny. Even targeted him and moved up to get him.

 

[Striiker]

Being patronized by some kid who can barely shave is amusing.

Almost as amusing as I find being lectured on hockey by someone who doesn’t even watch the team he talks about.

Especially when the lecture is full of dishonesty.

 

[deadhead]

Moved up to #24 from #29, which cost some assets, but wasn't a back breaker. #61.

Konecny has the potential to be a top two way forward, he's filling out and can deliver solid hits on the forecheck, his biggest issue going forward is being responsible when he doesn't have the puck, work as hard on his backcheck as he does on his forecheck.

He's not a "figure skater" by any means, he just gets overly aggressive, makes bad passes and gets caught up ice. That can be taught.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

The character issues probably would have kept him away, but I don’t buy that the two-way play obsession.

He didn’t shy away from drafting a flashy offensive guy like Konecny. Even targeted him and moved up to get him.

Hartnell, schenn are gone. filppula, umerger come in and we hear about their two way play. Same reason why Laughton, Sanheim are sent to ahl, sushko comments and picking frost ahead of tolvanen. Trading down with bellows and Gauthier on the board due to rubtsov availability. Thank god for kony though.
Edit: this isn't criticism, just pointing out a pattern and considering he came from kings organization it's not all that surprising.

 

[Striiker]

Hartnell, schenn are gone. filppula, umerger come in and we hear about their two way play. Same reason why Laughton, Sanheim are sent to ahl, sushko comments and picking frost ahead of tolvanen. Trading down with bellows and Gauthier on the board due to rubtsov availability. Thank God for kony though.

Hartnell was declining and had a bad contract

Schenn couldnt play C and was behind Voracek and Simmonds at RW, while blocking TK. Plus they got a great return for him. He wasn’t traded to dump him because Hakstol didn’t like his style.

Filppula, yes.

Umberger was merely a cap dump. Cliches were used to describe him because no GM will be brutally honest and say their player is trash.

Laughton wasn’t scoring or defending well. He obviously needed AHL time.

Sanheim needed AHL time last year. This year Hextall put him in the NHL to be played, so blame Hakstol for him sitting.

The Frost pick speaks for itself. Massive steal.

Passing on Gauthier and Bellows isn’t much of an argument either. It’s not like Rubtsov was some horrible reach and those two were the clear choice.

 

[deadhead]

Well, if you watched Laughton at center lately, you can see why they stress two way play, very few players are good enough to outscore their gaffes.

Couts is a great two way player who Hakstol gave more offensive responsibilities, Patrick will be a great two way player when he grows up. Frost and Vorobyev are also responsible two way centers - that's serious depth down the middle.
Having guys like this at center, and two way defensemen like Provorov, allow you to carry some offensive guys with defensive weaknesses.

But your top guys should be two way players - as we've seen in the playoffs, there's less room for flashy offensive play, and more emphasis on checking, hitting, positioning, etc.

Hextall has drafted a number of more offensive oriented wings, Laczynski, Ratcliffe, Allison, Strome, Kase, Lycksell, Cates.
But you need some grinders, NAK, Lindblom, Rubtsov, Twyarnski, Sushko, Bunnaman (at LW), if they can also score that's a big bonus.

 

[MacDonald4MVP]

Hartnell was declining and had a bad contract

Schenn couldnt play C and was behind Voracek and Simmonds at RW, while blocking TK. Plus they got a great return for him. He wasn’t traded to dump him because Hakstol didn’t like his style.

Filppula, yes.

Umberger was merely a cap dump. Cliches were used to describe him because no GM will be brutally honest and say their player is trash.

Laughton wasn’t scoring or defending well. He obviously needed AHL time.

Sanheim needed AHL time last year. This year Hextall put him in the NHL to be played, so blame Hakstol for him sitting.

The Frost pick speaks for itself. Massive steal.

Passing on Gauthier and Bellows isn’t much of an argument either. It’s not like Rubtsov was some horrible reach and those two were the clear choice.

Yes

 

[1865]

Finally, we’re put out of our misery. Changes need to be made.

• Hakstol needs to go. Lappy needs to follow.
• Simmonds, Gudas, Neuvirth, Mrazek, Read, Weise, Lehtera and Manning need to go to any interested party. I know that may be difficult for some, but most are easily removed.
• Keep Giroux as captain, give the A’s to Couturier and Provorov.
• I’d see who is kicking the tires on Voracek too. I’m not saying move him, but he’s clearly not a clutch time player and his value is never going to be higher.
• We go for Hoffman, providing the price is right.
• We play the kids. We remove the leash. We expect and allow mistakes and let them grow through them.
• We don’t give the ‘vets’ free reign to make the same mistakes with no repercussion.

I know we’re not the finished article, but the mistakes and incompetences of this team anger me so much that it removes all element of fun or enjoyment. This team is being sabotaged from within.

 

[freakydallas13]

Finally, we’re put out of our misery. Changes need to be made.

• Hakstol needs to go. Lappy needs to follow.
• Simmonds, Gudas, Neuvirth, Mrazek, Read, Weise, Lehtera and Manning need to go to any interested party. I know that may be difficult for some, but most are easily removed.
• Keep Giroux as captain, give the A’s to Couturier and Provorov.
• I’d see who is kicking the tires on Voracek too. I’m not saying move him, but he’s clearly not a clutch time player and his value is never going to be higher.
• We go for Hoffman, providing the price is right.
• We play the kids. We remove the leash. We expect and allow mistakes and let them grow through them.
• We don’t give the ‘vets’ free reign to make the same mistakes with no repercussion.

I know we’re not the finished article, but the mistakes and incompetences of this team anger me so much that it removes all element of fun or enjoyment. This team is being sabotaged from within.

Don't worry, the front office will look at this season, and say they would have won with a healthy coots and provorov. They will resign more trash vets, roll almost the exact same lineup, keep the coaching staff, and wonder why it all goes wrong again next year.

 

[bb12]

Finally, we’re put out of our misery. Changes need to be made.

• Hakstol needs to go. Lappy needs to follow.
• Simmonds, Gudas, Neuvirth, Mrazek, Read, Weise, Lehtera and Manning need to go to any interested party. I know that may be difficult for some, but most are easily removed.
• Keep Giroux as captain, give the A’s to Couturier and Provorov.
• I’d see who is kicking the tires on Voracek too. I’m not saying move him, but he’s clearly not a clutch time player and his value is never going to be higher.
• We go for Hoffman, providing the price is right.
• We play the kids. We remove the leash. We expect and allow mistakes and let them grow through them.
• We don’t give the ‘vets’ free reign to make the same mistakes with no repercussion.

I know we’re not the finished article, but the mistakes and incompetences of this team anger me so much that it removes all element of fun or enjoyment. This team is being sabotaged from within.

This is pretty close to my thoughts. Though I don't think hak is gone and I'm accepting it. Promote frost to 3c and sign a big name lw.

G - coots - tk
Xxx - Patrick - Jake
Lindbolm - frost - simmonds
Raffl - Laughton - xxx

Ghost - provy
Sanhiem - Morin
Hagg - Macdonald

Elliott
Stolarz/Lyon

 

[Maurice of Orange]

Don’t see many moves being made this offseason if I had to guess Hexy will probably promote from within the organization, rather then waste assets acquiring roster players or salary and term to FA’s on open market.

Line 1 LW Giroux C Couturier RW Konecny
Line 2 LW Lindblom C Patrick RW Voracek
Line 3 LW Laughton C Frost RW Simmonds
Line 4 LW Raffl C Vorobyov RW Weal

1st D-Pair LD Provorov RD Gostisbehere
2nd D-Pair LD Sanheim RD Gudas
3rd D-Pair LD Hagg RD MacDonald

Goalie's:
Starter: Elliott
Backup: Lyon

Scratched List
C Lehtera
LW Leier
(FA RHD-man) 1 year deal
LD Morin + Knee Surgery SOIR

RW Weise < waived to AHL (18-19 Matt Read)
G Neuvirth < Traded for late RD pick or bought out.

 

[deadhead]

I think it's unlikely right now that Frost makes the team, but we'll see in September, it comes down to convincing Ron he's physically ready for the NHL, he can certainly handle 12 minutes a night as the 3C otherwise.

Same with Vorobyev, he'll be up at some point next year, but whether he starts with the team is a big question mark, though playoff experience helped his chances.

So to me, the most likely addition this offseason will be a 3C, with MV, Bardeau, Knight and Vorobyev competing for 4th line spots in camp.

I'll be surprised if Weal is on the team next year, his best position would be LW on the 3rd line, but I don't know if he can score enough to justify that spot.
Myers will make this team.

Line 1 LW Giroux C Couturier RW Konecny
Line 2 LW Lindblom C Patrick RW Voracek
Line 3 LW Laughton C ??? RW Simmonds
Line 4 LW Raffl C ??? RW NAK
free agent as the 3C, MV, Bardreau, Knight, Vorobyev compete for 4C and 13th forward spot (Vorobyev either 4C or AHL).

1st D-Pair LD Provorov RD Gostisbehere
2nd D-Pair LD Sanheim RD Gudas
3rd D-Pair LD MacDonald RD Myers
Hagg as the 7th D-man

If Myers plays well, he'll replace Gudas at some point on the 2nd pair.

 

[Alex91]

If Frost makes the team, then I’d say their is less then 1% chance that the 4th C is another internal guy. If Frost is on the team then they will re signs flippula or go with a vet presences and give Frost the Patrick treatment.

 

[deadhead]

The decision to bring in a veteran center will be independent of Frost in September, because that decision has to be made in June or July, whereas Ron won't know if Frost is ready until the end of TC.

 

[Tripod]

They are not going to assume Frost will be the #3. They will definitely add a guy for that role. They may hovered not fill the #4 spot knowing that Laughton, Vorobyev....and yes Lehtera are options. And if Frost DOES show he is ready, then that's a great problem to have.

 

[FlyTimmo]

Of course the most ideal outcome is getting a 3C that is capable of playing LW.

 

[Magua]

Too bad Laughton was never given a shot at 3C to find out where they stand going into the off-season. I may just be an Internet peon who named himself after a villain from a work of historical fiction........but maybe that would have been a good idea?


incoming deadhead post about Laughton not being a center

 

[Captain Dave Poulin]

Too bad Laughton was never given a shot at 3C to find out where they stand going into the off-season. I may just be an Internet peon who named himself after a villain from a work of historical fiction........but maybe that would have been a good idea?


incoming deadhead post about Laughton not being a center

The source of much of my frustration is that we didn't punt this season in the service of seeing what we had, Laughton as 3C being one of those mysteries we could have explored. I say "punt the season," but there's no telling whether we would have been any worse had we been more brave with our youth. Hopefully the Bunny-led tsunami of prospects matriculating will force the organizational hands, if dinosaurs can be said to have hands.

 

[Striiker]

They are not going to assume Frost will be the #3. They will definitely add a guy for that role. They may hovered not fill the #4 spot knowing that Laughton, Vorobyev....and yes Lehtera are options. And if Frost DOES show he is ready, then that's a great problem to have.

They’ll probably sign a 3C to be safe, then if Frost can make the team they could just bump that guy down to the 4th line. A good 3C would make a great 4C.

 

[Stizzle]

Shouldn't we have a 18-19 roster thread?

@MiamiScreamingEagles

 

[deadhead]

Too bad Laughton was never given a shot at 3C to find out where they stand going into the off-season. I may just be an Internet peon who named himself after a villain from a work of historical fiction........but maybe that would have been a good idea?


incoming deadhead post about Laughton not being a center

No. I've seen enough of Laughton to like him as the LW on the 3rd line with Simmonds, if we don't trade him.

If Ron doesn't think Frost is ready, find a 3C who is a playmaker, if you play Laughton at 3C, you'd have to move Voracek down to RW so someone can control play in the O-zone. And who is the LW? Because Laughton simply doesn't control play, he skates, he shoots, he forechecks, but he's not a good possession guy and a below par passer with limited ice vision. He's best suited at center on a checking line with wings who can skate and create havoc with him, Raffl and NAK. Don't expect a lot of offense from that trio, but NAK would bring the same speed and a lot more presence than Leier.

They tried Weal with Laughton, which was a good idea but a bad fit, Laughton is a "balls to the walls" kind of player, whereas Weal is a deliberate, control the puck and set someone up guy, the two did not fit well.

Fit matters, Frost, Vorobyev, Rubtsov are all defensively responsible with good vision, it'll be a lot easier matching up forwards with them.
MV? Is he good enough for 3C? Seems to have the offensive chops. Can he play good enough defense for 4C?

Right now the Flyers are in a similar situation that a lot of teams find themselves, finally get enough talented players but then the struggle is fitting them together.
We saw this with Schenn, he never really looked comfortable except when he moved to RW with Couts at center. But we had lots of RWs who looked good next to Couts.