Proposal: 2016 Trade Rumours and Proposals Thread Part VI

[SAK11]

Career Point Per Game

Derek Brassard - .61
Jordan Staal - .568
Kyle Turris - .564

Jordan is also 6'4 220, more physical and better defensively.

Pretty useless to look at career points per game. Turris and Brassard have grown in big ways in more recent years. Lets look at a more recent time frame, the last 3 full seasons, plus this year so far:

Brassard: 243 games- 65 goals, 165 points [0.68 points per game]
Turris: 223 games- 65 goals, 154 points [0.69 points per game]
Staal: 211 games- 42 goals, 113 points [0.54 points per game]

Those points per game are the difference between a 56-57 point season, and a 44 point season over 82 games. Much more relevant than what they did 7-10 years ago as very young players.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

What can we trade Ceci for? Seriously though 2 games in and he's been brutalllllllllllll

I thought Ceci was much better vs the Habs. I Don't agree...

How exactly was he brutalllllllllllll vs the Habs in your opinion?

 

[Benjamin]

Ceci played like a legit #2 last night. 25mins of great hockey. Just a couple mistakes.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Everybody was much better vs the Habs. They had a decent amount of time between games and are implementing a new system. Maybe it is because we played Montreal, but it isn't hard to imagine as time goes by the team will look more in place during games.

As far as trades go, I think we'll see Dzingel grab the open top 6 spot which will stop the Senators from trading for a forward. If we're high in the standings come the deadline, I could see us adding a solid #5 defender, but I'm not sure we'd add a forward especially with Lazar eventually coming back.

Darkhorse trade would be Anderson for MA Fleury. This isn't in direct reaction to Anderson's play the last two games, it has been talked about previously in the trade threads. But if Anderson seems to be slowing down, Fleury with two more years under contract after this season could be a good stop gap until Dreidger (or whoever) is ready.

Pens have to move him to get out from his NMC, and not many teams will need goalies. The market will be flooded as a result of multiple teams having two valuable goalies when they can only protect one in the expansion draft, and Bishop who will be an option for a team looking for a veteran starter will be approaching free agency. It isn't inconceivable to imagine that PITS would be pushed into a corner where they have to almost give Fleury away just to keep Murray, or give him away for a very minimal return. Anderson gives them a veteran mentor/2B for Murray with only a year left on an affordable 4M per deal.

 

[sens613]

Everybody was much better vs the Habs. They had a decent amount of time between games and are implementing a new system. Maybe it is because we played Montreal, but it isn't hard to imagine as time goes by the team will look more in place during games.

As far as trades go, I think we'll see Dzingel grab the open top 6 spot which will stop the Senators from trading for a forward. If we're high in the standings come the deadline, I could see us adding a solid #5 defender, but I'm not sure we'd add a forward especially with Lazar eventually coming back.

Darkhorse trade would be Anderson for MA Fleury. This isn't in direct reaction to Anderson's play the last two games, it has been talked about previously in the trade threads. But if Anderson seems to be slowing down, Fleury with two more years under contract after this season could be a good stop gap until Dreidger (or whoever) is ready.

Pens have to move him to get out from his NMC, and not many teams will need goalies. The market will be flooded as a result of multiple teams having two valuable goalies when they can only protect one in the expansion draft, and Bishop who will be an option for a team looking for a veteran starter will be approaching free agency. It isn't inconceivable to imagine that PITS would be pushed into a corner where they have to almost give Fleury away just to keep Murray, or give him away for a very minimal return. Anderson gives them a veteran mentor/2B for Murray with only a year left on an affordable 4M per deal.

Why would fleury accept a trade to Ottawa. Murray is a lock to be picked and he gets to stay on a perennial contender . Would be weird for him to waive his nmc to pay higher taxes on a worse team.

 

[TheNewEra]

Why would fleury accept a trade to Ottawa. Murray is a lock to be picked and he gets to stay on a perennial contender . Would be weird for him to waive his nmc to pay higher taxes on a worse team.

it really depends on if pittsburgh goes straight back to murray to be the #1G after he comes back from injury or not. Fleury might waive to reestablish himself as a full fledge starter and he would get said playing time in ottawa

that being said i dont want fleury in ottawa, people get upset when anderson lets in the occasional weak goal, they would be really upset seeing fleury on a regular basis

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

it really depends on if pittsburgh goes straight back to murray to be the #1G after he comes back from injury or not. Fleury might waive to reestablish himself as a full fledge starter and he would get said playing time in ottawa

that being said i dont want fleury in ottawa, people get upset when anderson lets in the occasional weak goal, they would be really upset seeing fleury on a regular basis

Sens fans mad about weak goals from Anderson call for him to be traded for Marc Andre Fleury. You can't make this **** up.

Wonder what Dan Clouthier or Patrick Lalime are up to these days? Maybe we could get them too.

 

[sens613]

it really depends on if pittsburgh goes straight back to murray to be the #1G after he comes back from injury or not. Fleury might waive to reestablish himself as a full fledge starter and he would get said playing time in ottawa

that being said i dont want fleury in ottawa, people get upset when anderson lets in the occasional weak goal, they would be really upset seeing fleury on a regular basis

I don't see how it would make a difference if he is a back up this year or starter. Murray is gone next year if he doesn't waive making him the starter then and giving himself a chance to reestablish himself on a much better team.

Also I doubt he needs to reestablish himself he is a starter on 20ish teams

 

[trentmccleary]

Anderson for Fleury makes sense before the expansion draft.
Why Ottawa does it: Fleury is at a similar level to Anderson, but is 4 years younger and Ottawa doesn't have a potential starter to replace a 36 yo Anderson in the pipeline. Fleury also has Cup winning experience and is a marketable, bilingual star.
Why Pittsburgh does it: they want to keep the younger, cheaper Murray.
Why Fleury does it: if Pittsburgh asks him to waive, they don't want him. Most players are smart enough to avoid pushing to stay somewhere that they are not wanted. He gets to choose which team he goes to. Ottawa is a decent team. It's 1 of only 2 markets in the NHL with a significant francophone population and it'll be the closest he ever gets to play to his hometown.


FWIW, I think this deal makes a tonne of sense. As much sense as I thought that a Marc Staal deal would (for say; Cowen, Greening and maybe a 2nd)... well, that deal basically happened; only it was called Phaneuf.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Why would fleury accept a trade to Ottawa. Murray is a lock to be picked and he gets to stay on a perennial contender . Would be weird for him to waive his nmc to pay higher taxes on a worse team.

He doesn't have a full NTC. He has a limited NTC. We don't know if Ottawa is one of the teams that is on his list. Obviously, if Ottawa isn't on his trade list, that trade can't happen. But because we don't know which teams he has named, it is worth speculating on.

There's about a 60 percent chance that we aren't on his no trade list since he can name 12 of 29 teams. I could be wrong but I am also pretty sure players have to submit it at the start of each season and not when the trade request is tendered.

 

[bert]

Anderson for Fleury makes sense before the expansion draft.
Why Ottawa does it: Fleury is at a similar level to Anderson, but is 4 years younger and Ottawa doesn't have a potential starter to replace a 36 yo Anderson in the pipeline. Fleury also has Cup winning experience and is a marketable, bilingual star.
Why Pittsburgh does it: they want to keep the younger, cheaper Murray.
Why Fleury does it: if Pittsburgh asks him to waive, they don't want him. Most players are smart enough to avoid pushing to stay somewhere that they are not wanted. He gets to choose which team he goes to. Ottawa is a decent team. It's 1 of only 2 markets in the NHL with a significant francophone population and it'll be the closest he ever gets to play to his hometown.


FWIW, I think this deal makes a tonne of sense. As much sense as I thought that a Marc Staal deal would (for say; Cowen, Greening and maybe a 2nd)... well, that deal basically happened; only it was called Phaneuf.

I would also do it, I think the sens would probably have to add though, a pick or a prospect. Would be a smart trade to make in my opinion.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

He could be convinced to waive, it is possible and I agree that it makes sense for both teams as far as on-ice product goes.

Unsure of we can afford it though.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Sens fans mad about weak goals from Anderson call for him to be traded for Marc Andre Fleury. You can't make this **** up.

Wonder what Dan Clouthier or Patrick Lalime are up to these days? Maybe we could get them too.

Like I said in my post. This isn't reactionary, myself and others have made similar proposals in the past with regards to the expansion draft. Not sure what your weird ramblings about Patrick Lalime have to do with Marc Andre Fleury.

it is like you don't even read the post that you talk **** about.

Darkhorse trade would be Anderson for MA Fleury. This isn't in direct reaction to Anderson's play the last two games, it has been talked about previously in the trade threads. But if Anderson seems to be slowing down, Fleury with two more years under contract after this season could be a good stop gap until Dreidger (or whoever) is ready.

Lots of variables in there, and very much not an "OMG ANDERSON STINKS WE NEED SOMEONE ASAP AUSTON MATTHEWS IS ON PACE FOR 400 GOALS WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO TIME TO REBUILD FIRE DOORIAN" type post.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

Like I said in my post. This isn't reactionary, myself and others have made similar proposals in the past with regards to the expansion draft. Not sure what your weird ramblings about Patrick Lalime have to do with Marc Andre Fleury.

it is like you don't even read the post that you talk **** about.



Lots of variables in there, and very much not an "OMG ANDERSON STINKS WE NEED SOMEONE ASAP AUSTON MATTHEWS IS ON PACE FOR 400 GOALS WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO TIME TO REBUILD FIRE DOORIAN" type post.

Fair enough on your first point, I'm more reacting to the overwhelming Anderson bashing going on the GDTs. No one seems to want to acknowledge that Andy missed almost all of training camp and has only really been with the team since last Tuesday. He's behind and will play better. You're obviously not guilty of this criticism.

As for Fleury, he's about the last goalie I'd ever want on my team. He's collapsed so many times in big situations and Ottawa wants to be a successful playoff team. I don't know how we could ever do that with a guy like MAF in goal. Everyone on the team would be just waiting for him to implode in April. Not only this but he actually makes more money than Andy, which is a big deal for a budget team.

I mentioned Lalime and Clouthier because they were the best examples of playoff choking goalies I could think of besides MAF.

 

[50 in 07]

Why would fleury accept a trade to Ottawa. Murray is a lock to be picked and he gets to stay on a perennial contender . Would be weird for him to waive his nmc to pay higher taxes on a worse team.

Would he really want to stay with the Pens if it becomes clear that they don't want/need him with the emergence of Murray and the expansion draft looming?

Also can't the Pens as a last resort simply buy him out. Obviously they'd prefer to trade him but if that doesn't happen...

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Fair enough on your first point, I'm more reacting to the overwhelming Anderson bashing going on the GDTs. No one seems to want to acknowledge that Andy missed almost all of training camp and has only really been with the team since last Tuesday. He's behind and will play better. You're obviously not guilty of this criticism.

As for Fleury, he's about the last goalie I'd ever want on my team. He's collapsed so many times in big situations and Ottawa wants to be a successful playoff team. I don't know how we could ever do that with a guy like MAF in goal. Everyone on the team would be just waiting for him to implode in April. Not only this but he actually makes more money than Andy, which is a big deal for a budget team.

Fleury's supposed mental weakness is a fair concern in regards to acquiring him, especially with Dorion apparently wanting a certain type of character on the team with guys who he'd want to be in the trenches with or however that saying goes. The team would have to do their homework on him before pulling the trigger on a trade, but ultimately IF Anderson begins to show his age, its an opportunity to get a veteran starting goalie who has significant experience as a stop gap until someone from within the system is ready to take over.

There are better alternatives like Ben Bishop out there, but the issue with him is that the Senators would have to devote significant money (more than Fleury) and term to him. He wouldn't be a stop gap. Unless he takes a miraculous discount to stay in Tampa, he is going to sign somewhere for 7 years. I think the leaked asking price for Calgary was 7x7.

Prompted by the expansion draft there'll potentially be guys who are less proven with potential like Pickard available who wouldn't be bad choices to go after, but as far as proven veterans, even with his blemishes, Fleury might be the best guy out there who could conceivably be on the block between now and the 2017 off season.

Fleury makes only about 1M more than Anderson makes this season in real money. So increasing the amount put towards a starter by 1M might not be that out there budget wise. Anderson's salary drops down to 3M next season, so if he is still able to play at the level he has played at in the past, Ottawa keeps him as a dirt cheap reliable starting goalie.

Trading for another goalie completely hinges on how well Anderson plays this season, and how confident Dorion and Boucher are in him going forward. If he begins to show regression, this off season will be the greatest opportunity to replace him in net as a result of the expansion draft forcing teams to trade goalies they otherwise would have held on to.

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

Yea, don't want MAF, lol.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Would he really want to stay with the Pens if it becomes clear that they don't want/need him with the emergence of Murray and the expansion draft looming?

Also can't the Pens as a last resort simply buy him out. Obviously they'd prefer to trade him but if that doesn't happen...

His NTC isn't that burdening. He can name 12 of 29 teams according to generalfanager.

I think Fleury will try to make it as hard as possible for the Pens to trade him. Imagine how comfortable he must be in Pittsburgh. He has played his entire career there and was considered a core component of that team for a long time. If he gets bought out, he probably easily gets another contract that would offset the 1/3rd of his salary he'd lose in a buyout. So the threat of a buyout means little to him as he walks away the same or even better off financially and ends up in a different team anyways.

I don't think Pittsburgh trading MAF is 100 percent. It is the logical thing to do, but I wouldn't rule them trading out Murray. What if Calgary comes to them before the expansion draft and offers them one of their young studs or a 2017 top 5 pick in a package for Murray? At that point, they'd have to decide between either taking Murray+low return they'd get for Fleury or taking Fleury+top 5 level prospect (pick/Tkachuk/Bennett?).

Schneider went for a top 10 pick in a forced trade. Washington got one of the bottom 3 teams (COL) 1st round picks for the next season for Varlamov which ended up being 11th overall. If Murray has a strong regular season campaign and another good playoffs, I don't think it is unfair to imagine that as his value.

 

[FolignoQuantumLeap]

I'd actually be willing as Ottawa to give up some big assets for a guy like Murray. White and a first or something similar before the expansion draft.

 

[Hale The Villain]

I'd actually be willing as Ottawa to give up some big assets for a guy like Murray. White and a first or something similar before the expansion draft.

I could actually see this happening.

Pittsburgh fans don't want to admit it, but there's a good chance Murray will have to be traded come expansion time. Fleury has a NMC and seems pretty adamant on staying a Penguin. Is 2-0 right now with a .948SV%, having started both their games. Unless there's a drastic turnaround in Fleury's play and Murray becomes the clear-cut starting goalie for the Pens, have to think that it's in the best interest of the Pens to trade Murray for assets rather than trade Fleury for scraps/buy him out.

White, Hammond and a pick/prospect (not a 1st)

or

Chlapik, Hammond, 1st

 

[BonkTastic]

White and a first or something similar before the expansion draft.

When was the last time a goalie got essentially two 1st round picks in return on a trade?

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

When was the last time a goalie got essentially two 1st round picks in return on a trade?

Ya, Cory Schneider, a top 5 proven young goalie at that time, returned only a 9th overall pick.

Murray has had a great resume to date but isnt as proven in the NHL as Schneider though some of u may disagree. I wanna see another great season first.

 

[Hale The Villain]

When was the last time a goalie got essentially two 1st round picks in return on a trade?

Never, to my knowledge.

Most a goalie has returned in recent memory is a 9th overall pick, which was the price of Cory Schneider, a guy with 3 seasons of elite level goaltending, albeit in a backup role, under his belt.

Murray is a bit of a different case though. He's already backstopped his team to a cup and is only 22 years old. Although more proven, Schneider was 26 when he was traded to NJ. Murray's age will probably allow him to return more than Schneider, but probably not much more.

 

[Sens]

If Ottawa needs to move a 1st (or more) for a goalie then the organization has seriously screwed up asset management.

They have had plenty of time to groom a replacement for Anderson.

 

[Qward]

This place man....

End of last season "We have to protect Ceci, we are going to lose Methot."


2 games in, "Man Ceci is brutal. Trade him for a page of pucks!"