Player Discussion: 2016 round 4 #95 Anatoli Golyshev

TommytheCat

Registered User
Oct 23, 2010
2,808
305
Florida
Want to see who we add, and who we subtract? It isn't baseless. And please do throw in all the guys who are big who don't play that way. We all agree on Nelson, sure. Up until very recently Lee was even a big wuss (still can't fight for crap, but I don't expect the world overnight...) Our "power forward, lol" Okposo was Pussposo. Nielsen couldn't muscle a twinkie. Bailey, lol. Strome is a hobbit amongst the trees most nights. JT gets a pass for the obvious reason... 4th line was kinda it. The defense is trending upwards which is a good thing, but Hickey... I'd buy it on defense, but not offense. In fact we subtracted Martin and added what, Prince & Quine? Size went down and it wasn't great to begin with.
I like quines jump as a player ... he'll score a few more goals than Matty did and people will tell you I told you so ... Matty will continue to do his job ....what a effin fail to not sign him ... I will feel so distraught to see him in a rag jersey ... hope he gets signed somewhere in Cali
 

A Pointed Stick

No Idea About The Future
Dec 23, 2010
16,105
333
I like quines jump as a player ... he'll score a few more goals than Matty did and people will tell you I told you so ... Matty will continue to do his job ....what a effin fail to not sign him ... I will feel so distraught to see him in a rag jersey ... hope he gets signed somewhere in Cali

He will get signed closer to here but my money is not on the Rags.
 

TheWhiteWhale30

Registered User
Dec 3, 2007
3,876
230
Almost 6' tall. Plus he plays with Kane. Zero comps here. The guy we drafted is 5'8"... and is it really 5'8"? They have been known to fudge those numbers...

Just to clarify Hockeydb has Gloyshev at 5'9 172lbs and Panarin at 5'11 170lbs

At 21 Golyshev had 44 Pts in 56 games
At 21 Panarain had 18 Pts in 40 games

Biggest difference and advantage is KHL is a men's league compared to NA junior leagues and he is getting it done there.

Not saying he will pan out but there shouldn't be anyone saying he doesn't have a chance to be as good as Panarin. Right now he is projecting to be better. Excited to see how much he further improves this season.
 

JPIsles21

Registered User
Jul 9, 2006
1,517
25
If that's the case why aren't the highly skilled, mostly 1st round pick, smurfetts in Edmonton vying for the cup already? There's more than one reason, but soft and small has been readily identified as two of their problems, and that's despite aaaaaaaaaaaaallllllll of the fancy schmancy shiny & sparkly HF boards crack known as high end first round picks on their club.

Again, who in here would draft a guy who is 3' 5" tall? Answer: Not any one of you even if the guy was a half clone of Gretzky. There is a breaking point where a lack of size starts become cumbersome, particularly on defense where having a long reach is actually helpful in breaking up passes and plays, and physical size is helpful in front of the net.

This is the kind of lazy analysis that has doomed guys like Brian Burke. The kind of analysis that sees guys like Hugh Jessiman, Tom Wilson, Tyler Biggs, etc get drafted way too high. The Oilers are no good because they have ignored defense. They do a very poor job analyzing defensemen, and have not had a competent defense corps in years. They also don't have good goaltending. Their forwards are not the issue. Take those forwards and place them on the Predators, and you have a Stanley Cup contender.

And yes, if a 3'5 player can play, you take him. Skill and production are the only things that matter. Which is why a "smurf" like Kane is better than Hugh Jessiman.
 

seafoam

Soft Shock
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May 17, 2011
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Who cares how tall he is. The kid scored 25 goals in arguably the world's second best league.

Last time I checked, this team lacked guys who can finish.

Oh, and it was a 4th round pick LOL
 

PK Cronin

Bailey Fan Club Prez
Feb 11, 2013
34,264
23,656
So you would draft someone 3'4" tall because, you know, "Size doesn't matter?"

Can he play hockey? If so, then yes, I'd take him without hesitation.

If that's the case why aren't the highly skilled, mostly 1st round pick, smurfetts in Edmonton vying for the cup already? There's more than one reason, but soft and small has been readily identified as two of their problems, and that's despite aaaaaaaaaaaaallllllll of the fancy schmancy shiny & sparkly HF boards crack known as high end first round picks on their club.

Again, who in here would draft a guy who is 3' 5" tall? Answer: Not any one of you even if the guy was a half clone of Gretzky. There is a breaking point where a lack of size starts become cumbersome, particularly on defense where having a long reach is actually helpful in breaking up passes and plays, and physical size is helpful in front of the net.

The Penguins just won the cup with 10 forwards on their roster under 6', with one of the least physical teams in the NHL. Malkin, for being the largest forward on their team, isn't very physical at all and is more of a finesse player. Letang is their best defenseman, he isn't big or physical either. I'm confused as to how they won the cup without being the Goon Squad. Same with Chicago, who is another one of the least physical teams in the NHL, but yet they've managed to win 3 cups recently.

There are so many shorter/smaller guys in the NHL that it's ridiculous to criticize these guys based purely on size. You're confusing small with soft or talentless.

Atkinson, Gionta, Zuccarello, Tyler Johnson, Conor Sheary, Cammelleri, Gaudreau, Gallagher, Krug, Marchand, Spurgeon, Barrie, Callahand, Campbell, Domi, Ellis, Fabbri, Granlund, Hudler, Letestu, Pageau, Palmieri, Perreault, Read, Rinaldo, Russell, Schwartz, Spooner, Tatar, Trocheck, Vatanen, and I'm sure there's plenty I've missed.

All of these guys are doing pretty well for themselves even though they'd likely fall into your "smurfs" category. Johnny Gaudreau is short and weighs less than guys on high school hockey teams. He tears up the NHL. Why? Because he can play.

I'm not trying to suggest that every small player is good, but your assumption and degradation of any player who isn't the hulk is off-base, helping to push a childish stereotype forward. Just as many large players (probably more statistically speaking) miss having significant NHL careers because they can't play. Having an NHL career comes down to one thing and one thing only, can you play?
 

A Pointed Stick

No Idea About The Future
Dec 23, 2010
16,105
333
This is the kind of lazy analysis that has doomed guys like Brian Burke. The kind of analysis that sees guys like Hugh Jessiman, Tom Wilson, Tyler Biggs, etc get drafted way too high. The Oilers are no good because they have ignored defense. They do a very poor job analyzing defensemen, and have not had a competent defense corps in years. They also don't have good goaltending. Their forwards are not the issue. Take those forwards and place them on the Predators, and you have a Stanley Cup contender.

And yes, if a 3'5 player can play, you take him. Skill and production are the only things that matter. Which is why a "smurf" like Kane is better than Hugh Jessiman.

I disagree, greatly. Not about defense alone, because their defense is awful, but on taking their forwards and playing them with better defensemen. Another club in Pittsburgh won a cup with high end forward talent prior to this last one, with a really questionable defense. The Oilers are held back in part by softies who fail miserably at holding the forward zone when they get in there. Between Yak, Eberle, and RNH they lose the puck pretty quickly from the games I've watched, and due to a physical disparity or an unwillingness to get hurt in the dirty areas. They aren't a a bunch of Paraise's, which is an example of a guy who plays above his size. I'd take him on my team anyday. Theo was another small fry who played bigger than his body. And Kane is on another level so lol. Are you going to compare them to Gretzky next? Small automatically = Gretzky? Kane? Fleury? No, now that's lazy, and yes you did do that.
 
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PWJunior

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Apr 11, 2010
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Long Island, NY
Who cares how tall he is. The kid scored 25 goals in arguably the world's second best league.

Last time I checked, this team lacked guys who can finish.

Oh, and it was a 4th round pick LOL

EXACTLY. It was a swing for the fences. If we hit, that would be ****ing sweet. If we miss, big ****ing deal.
 

A Pointed Stick

No Idea About The Future
Dec 23, 2010
16,105
333
Just to clarify Hockeydb has Gloyshev at 5'9 172lbs and Panarin at 5'11 170lbs

At 21 Golyshev had 44 Pts in 56 games
At 21 Panarain had 18 Pts in 40 games

Biggest difference and advantage is KHL is a men's league compared to NA junior leagues and he is getting it done there.

Not saying he will pan out but there shouldn't be anyone saying he doesn't have a chance to be as good as Panarin. Right now he is projecting to be better. Excited to see how much he further improves this season.

Hockey db which is a good quick reference isn't the same as getting your numbers from say, the combine. Did he report to the combine? I don't think he did as he was already playing in Russia as a 21 year old. My number came from elite hockey prospects... they could be off as well. At the KHL website his stats list him at 172cm. 172cm = 67in. 67in = 5' 7".

Congrats, you helped to show me he is even smaller than I thought. Did someone leave him in the dryer too long? (that's meant to be a lighthearted joke).

Oh, and it was a 4th round pick LOL
Fair statement, but how many swings for the fences have we made that panned out when talking small fries or euro's in or wanting into the KHL? ANess? Wasted pick. The Waterloo thing? Wasted picks. Bonzo's buddy? lol. Ho Sang? TBD. This is actually a good/different topic for another thread. How many of our swings for the fence ever connected, and how many draft picks did we get something back from on them? I don't have a number in my head, btw. It is a good question.
 
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PROMputt

I promise to never forget.
Jan 4, 2008
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As usual big guys have to prove they can't play and small guys have to prove they can play. I like the pick.
 

DoubleA45

Registered User
Feb 4, 2007
105
1
New Jersey
How many of our swings for the fence ever connected, and how many draft picks did we get something back from on them? I don't have a number in my head, btw. It is a good question.

I could be wrong but i'm pretty sure Cizikas was kind of a swing for the fences, dropped in the draft because of legal troubles regarding the manslaughter charge. Also Anders Lee was a swing for the fences because NHL teams weren't sure if he was going to choose football over hockey.those guys may not be superstars but they took a shot and got 2 productive players
 

IslesNorway

Registered User
Apr 9, 2007
9,274
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Nittedal, Norway
He doesn't look particularly small in the video posted but of he is smart he can still succeed. The KHL and NHL are quite different in physicality but if he is coming over at some point we'll just have to see what he brings. Nice pick that's a true boom or bust
 

Caser

@RUSProspects
May 21, 2013
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Hockey db which is a good quick reference isn't the same as getting your numbers from say, the combine. Did he report to the combine? I don't think he did as he was already playing in Russia as a 21 year old. My number came from elite hockey prospects... they could be off as well. At the KHL website his stats list him at 172cm. 172cm = 67in. 67in = 5' 7".

Congrats, you helped to show me he is even smaller than I thought. Did someone leave him in the dryer too long? (that's meant to be a lighthearted joke).

172 cm is 5'7.72", which is closer to 5'8" though.
 

scott99

Registered User
May 13, 2005
11,008
1,542
I like the pick, I don't care how tall he is, he scored 25 goals as a 20 year old in the KHL. That's pretty damned good. He scored more than Kovalchuck and Radulov. He was in the Allstar game. How many 20 year olds made the Allstar game and scored 25 goals in the KHL this season ? It was a gutsy pick by Garth and crew. Unlike Cammarata, who was picked in the 3rd round, Golyshev was pick in the 4th round and has proven himself against men, regardless of how tall he is.

He's got a great shot and is a sniper. Supposedly his contract can be bought out after next season too. Definitely worth the risk. Several draft gurus had him in their top 50, I saw one guy had him at 29. Like the pick.
 

IslandersFan17

Registered User
Jun 8, 2011
5,799
1,332
Long Island
A lot of players in the NHL are "undersized."

Skill is skill is skill. While I would love the kid to be built like Ovechkin or Malkin, if he was, I don't think he makes it to the fourth round.

The odds of a late rounder making the NHL are slim to begin with. Might as well gamble with a guy like AG who could be like Panarin.
 

periferal

Registered User
Jul 5, 2007
28,864
16,209
Who cares how tall he is. The kid scored 25 goals in arguably the world's second best league.

Last time I checked, this team lacked guys who can finish.

Oh, and it was a 4th round pick LOL


I mean honestly...If you get a successful NHLer outside the top-10 in any draft I call that a "win." You could make a slight beef that Snow gave up 2017 picks to roll the dice on Golyshev, but basically very little assets were given up to roll the dice on what could be a home-run pick.

The funny thing is at this point you can almost predict these Petrov//Kabanov "upside" picks from Snow, and Golyshev falls into that category for sure. Issue is that none have worked out yet. In fact he's done much better when he just takes the solid guys later like Martin, Cizikas, Lee, etc.
 

periferal

Registered User
Jul 5, 2007
28,864
16,209
Golyshev has two issues:


1. Will he ever come to the US
2. If he comes, size.


If he pans out he's probably going to be in the Tyler Johnson zip code or a total bust.
 

IslesNorway

Registered User
Apr 9, 2007
9,274
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Nittedal, Norway
If the Islanders had drafted DeBrincat, who scored 50 goals in junior, would we even be having this discussion or would people be generally happy we got such a great goalscorer?

We've now got someone who's achieved much more than DeBrincat in the 4th round, and folks are complaining?? Beyond me...
 

danteipp

Registered User
Aug 3, 2005
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If the Islanders had drafted DeBrincat, who scored 50 goals in junior, would we even be having this discussion or would people be generally happy we got such a great goalscorer?

We've now got someone who's achieved much more than DeBrincat in the 4th round, and folks are complaining?? Beyond me...

Anyone who wants to complain about this pick just wants to complain. They presumably realize they can't complain about not making any trades, because no material moves were made at the draft by any teams, so this is their best target now.

That said, if the Isles passed on Bellows to select DeBrincat, I might have complained, lol. But because he was ultimately taken by Chicago, no one will say a peep about them selecting a small player either. Meanwhile the Isles select a player who projects to mirror the NHL RoY, in the fourth round, and here we go.
 

A Pointed Stick

No Idea About The Future
Dec 23, 2010
16,105
333
Low blow Dan. I have been consistently against drafting small fries or bringing them in through free agency or what have you. Disagree with my thinking is cool, but don't assign it to sour grapes. That's a flat out lie and is not appreciated.
 

Richie Daggers Crime

Boosted 9 times double masked they/them
Mar 8, 2004
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Yeah, Dan. He's been obsessively, one-note posting about this size thing for a while now. :)

Actually, the size obsession makes you wonder... :)
 

First Blood

The Greiss Is Right!
Feb 17, 2014
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Low blow Dan. I have been consistently against drafting small fries or bringing them in through free agency or what have you. Disagree with my thinking is cool, but don't assign it to sour grapes. That's a flat out lie and is not appreciated.

What did Anatoli ever do to you :(

It's not his fault he was born a midget hockey player :naughty:
 

A Pointed Stick

No Idea About The Future
Dec 23, 2010
16,105
333
What did Anatoli ever do to you :(

It's not his fault he was born a midget hockey player :naughty:

LOL. Pie on my face if he does a Theo Fleury, but most don't.

I dunno, sometimes it feels like half this board would swap teams with the Oilers in a heartbeat. Something along the lines of AC-DC, we've got the smallest...
 

danteipp

Registered User
Aug 3, 2005
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Low blow Dan. I have been consistently against drafting small fries or bringing them in through free agency or what have you. Disagree with my thinking is cool, but don't assign it to sour grapes. That's a flat out lie and is not appreciated.

Sorry you feel offended but I call them like I see them. I respect you opinion and the desire to see the Isles improve, I believe we are all in that camp, and I also agree with a lot of what you say about hockey and what happens on the ice, but I just cannot get worked up about this draft or pick in particular, or the lack of moves so far.

The Isles first round pick, Bellows, is a solidly-built kid who is aggressive and will go into the dirty areas. It was a smart pick.

They took Golyshev, who has done it at the KHL level, which is regarded as the second best league in the world and he had been tabbed by some as the best non-drafted player in hockey. Will he come over? I don't know but the Isles head scout seems to believe the Isles can buy out the contract as soon as next year and he is close to ready for the NHL.

They followed that pick up with a huge kid who is very young but already has a scoring touch and primarily needs to work on his skating, like most big players need to do. He just likely needs to grow into his frame. That takes some time so getting a more developed player like Golyshev makes some sense. There is some symmetry to the two picks.

The rest of the picks are reasonable gambles. Players who will either go off to college and go through a proper strength and conditioning program like Pastujov who is already 6' and 200 lbs or, in the case of Quenneville, could be a PP specialist and niche player. That is typically what you get in the 7th round. I just can't get worked up about the sixth rounder, Collin Adams, who is short at 5'9", but if he is a true 180 lbs, and from the pics I have seen that appears to be the case since he appears to be relatively thick.

Besides complaining about the size of a fourth round pick, just one of two with the other being a monster, you are already throwing around lines like:

"Well, I did preach giving them till thru the draft before declaring a fiasco about to unfold.

Hope everyone brought their fiasco glasses and Hawaiian shirts because in a few more hours... things be looking like 100% fiasco, Wang style."​

Come on man, NOBODY made any material moves other than the Red Wings unloading a contract that the Coyotes will use to circumvent the cap floor.

The Isles have sufficient cap space to make a couple moves if the right deals are there AND, hopefully, the new owners have green-lit spending some money. However, we still have to wait to see what happens, just like everyone else.

If the Isles manage to land a couple good players, be it via free agency and/or trade, they should be able to then clear out a contract or two to get under the cap. If the new owners are willing to spend up to the cap, it shouldn't be a problem. Especially if Grabo is, unfortunately, sidelined due to all of the concussions.
 

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