2016 Draft Thread IV – Host: Buffalo – Pick: 8th

[Ace]

In all for trading up for Tkachuk.

But that offer is absurd.

 

[Moskau]

The value is insane. Toronto was willing to trade down from 4th to 8th last season in a better draft for two 2nds and a 3rd. You're seriously underrating how much teams value assets with years of development behind them if you think that Girgensons and Pysyk is the difference between 8th and 4th.

 

[signalIInoise]

Adding Yakupov *adds* value now?

 

[WeDislikeEich]

Or it could be a giant blunder. Buffalo could give up a steady 2nd pairing defenseman, a versatile 2nd/3rd liner that plays a game that'll translate well in the playoffs, and most importantly a potential 1st pairing defenseman. I see Tkachuk as a player like JVR. Solid player, 1st liner, ultimately not a franchise player. I wouldn't break the bank for him and I hope Murray won't either.

Well said. I agree.

Girgs, Pysyk and the player taken at 8th overall > Tkachuk

Way too much to give up for a guy rated not much higher than the player we will get at 8, especially considering the holes we have on the roster and the amount of assets that have already been traded away. There's just no way I can justify giving up that much for Tkachuk.

 

[EichHart]

Not sure if posted yet, but new mock draft from NHL.com were posted. Both of them have us bypassing Nylander who gets taken by Montreal in both mocks for a defenseman.

Kimelman:

8. Buffalo Sabres - Olli Juolevi, D, London (OHL)

Juolevi said he was best the defenseman in the draft during the NHL Scouting Combine and a number of scouts agreed with him. His skating and offensive ability are top-notch, as is his hockey IQ. He showed little problem adjusting to the smaller North American rinks and has room to add strength to his 6-2, 182-pound frame.

https://www.nhl.com/news/nhl-mock-draft-adam-kimelmans-2016-picks/c-280897636?tid=277764372

Morreale:

8. Buffalo Sabres - Jakob Chychrun, D, Sarnia (OHL)

Chychrun (6-2, 199) is a good skater with offensive instincts and defensive awareness. He enjoys playing physical, and had 11 goals, 49 points and a plus-23 rating in 62 games. He was second in the long jump at 118.5 inches; sixth in the vertical jump at 25.24 inches; and had the eighth-best peak power output on the Wingate test at 18.0 watts per kilogram at the combine.

https://www.nhl.com/news/nhl-mock-draft-mike-g-morreale-picks/c-280897656?tid=277764372

 

[stokes84]

Or it could be a giant blunder. Buffalo could give up a steady 2nd pairing defenseman, a versatile 2nd/3rd liner that plays a game that'll translate well in the playoffs, and most importantly a potential 1st pairing defenseman. I see Tkachuk as a player like JVR. Solid player, 1st liner, ultimately not a franchise player. I wouldn't break the bank for him and I hope Murray won't either.

Not likely. Giving up non-impact players never turns into a "giant blunder".

 

[Sabre the Win]

I don't see how that gets No.4.

That doesn't get you 4th

Really? Why are you over valuing an unproven draft pick? even Pysyk and Girgensons for a single draft pick in the first round is enough. Your giving up a potential top 4 RHD and a proven player who can play in your top 6 with intensity/grit and provide leadership for a player who is a giant ****ing question mark.

I get this is a prospect(s) site but c'mon when has unproven draft pick ever been more valuable than proven nhl players.

 

[sba]

You can file that one under 'Tales Told By Idiot'

"I see Girgensons as being a carbon copy of Oil forward Leon Draisaitl."

jesus...that is some embarrassing stuff there

 

[Fly Boy]

Really? Why are you over valuing an unproven draft pick? even Pysyk and Girgensons for a single draft pick in the first round is enough. Your giving up a potential top 4 RHD and a proven player who can play in your top 6 with intensity/grit and provide leadership for a player who is a giant ****ing question mark.

I get this is a prospect(s) site but c'mon when has unproven draft pick ever been more valuable than proven nhl players.

Because that doesn't get you 4th overall. How hard is that to understand?

In terms of the actual draft and purpose of this thread though, I'm happy the team is drafting at 8. There will be an abundance of good players available. I just hope they turn out/become part of the built core we have now.

 

[DJN21]

I'm so confused by the premise here...we trade our established forward in Girgensons, and our semi-established albeit "shine worn off after one bad half season" former first round defender for a draft pick who may need a few years of development before becoming anything close to an NHL let alone impact player....and yet the general consensus of Sabres fans is that the rebuild is over and we need to start winning now...maybe its just me but this seems real backasswords.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Not likely. Giving up non-impact players never turns into a "giant blunder".

not sold that tkachuck is a cant miss impact player

chances that Tkachuck ends up significantly better than Nylander/Chychrun/Joulevi are not great enough in my mind to justify buying the increase with Girgs and Pysyk

I'm so confused by the premise here...we trade our established forward in Girgensons, and our semi-established albeit "shine worn off after one bad half season" former first round defender for a draft pick who may need a few years of development before becoming anything close to an NHL let alone impact player....and yet the general consensus of Sabres fans is that the rebuild is over and we need to start winning now...maybe its just me but this seems real backasswords.

this just misses the point of wanting to move up, the point being that you'd in theory get a player that will have a greater game to game impact over his career than the other 3 players, if you can trade 3 middle 6/middle pair players for a top line forward I think you do that almost every time, the debatable part is Tkachuck that much better than who we get at 8, I'm not sold on that

 

[DJN21]

not sold that tkachuck is a cant miss impact player

chances that Tkachuck ends up significantly better than Nylander/Chychrun/Joulevi are not great enough in my mind to justify buying the increase with Girgs and Pysyk

Couldn't agree more. If anything I see his consistent years being so similar to Girgs...a 20-20 ish guy who could on a good year touch 50 points, play solid defense, play physical and be a fan favorite...maybe Girgs finishes on the lower end of production point-wise but I think he also has better defensive chops...certainly not worth the added assets and lost years of development.

 

[Beerz]

Really? Why are you over valuing an unproven draft pick? even Pysyk and Girgensons for a single draft pick in the first round is enough. Your giving up a potential top 4 RHD and a proven player who can play in your top 6 with intensity/grit and provide leadership for a player who is a giant ****ing question mark.

I get this is a prospect(s) site but c'mon when has unproven draft pick ever been more valuable than proven nhl players.

Because a prospect being picked at 4 has the potential to be a bona-fide impact player in the NHL and that potential and the risk that goes along with it is more attractive than 2 older more proven players who are old enough for it to be determined that they are most likely not going to be impact NHL players and are much easier to find than a guy with his potential.

That's just the nature of the business.

That said... the idea that 8th + Pysyk + Girgensons for the 4th is equally absurd.

 

[Grinder44]

Re: Garth's ridiculous trade proposal of Girgs, Pysyk, #8 OVA, and a "2nd or 3rd rounder" for #4 OVA - two things. First, yes, it's a ridiculous over-payment of assets to move up 4 - FOUR! - spots in this draft. Second, even though it would be an over-payment in assets, I don't see why Edmonton would be interested in that particular package. That #4 pick is a very valuable chip -- so while Pysyk, Girgs, #8, and a 2nd or 3rd rounder seem certainly to be too many Sabres' assets to give up for it -- I would guess that the Oilers would rather use it to help bring in a true, top-pair D-man, not a collection of odds and ends that don't fill that particular need for them. If the Sabres were to trade Pysyk, Girgs, #8, and a 2nd or 3rd, I'd hope that the return would be a young, proven, top pair LHD or sniper F.

 

[CaptPantalones]

Re: Garth's ridiculous trade proposal of Girgs, Pysyk, #8 OVA, and a "2nd or 3rd rounder" for #4 OVA - two things. First, yes, it's a ridiculous over-payment of assets to move up 4 - FOUR! - spots in this draft. Second, even though it would be an over-payment in assets, I don't see why Edmonton would be interested in that particular package. That #4 pick is a very valuable chip -- so while Pysyk, Girgs, #8, and a 2nd or 3rd rounder seem certainly to be too many Sabres' assets to give up for it -- I would guess that the Oilers would rather use it to help bring in a true, top-pair D-man, not a collection of odds and ends that don't fill that particular need for them. If the Sabres were to trade Pysyk, Girgs, #8, and a 2nd or 3rd, I'd hope that the return would be a young, proven, top pair LHD or sniper F.

It's an overpayment for sure, but only as constructed.

The oilers need a gritty 3rd c so I could see some interest in this deal on their end. But I only see this having a chance to happen if the oil include one of their LHD. Hopefully that would be davidson

 

[AustonsNostrils]

I would trade Girgensons and 8th for 4th overall - for Tkachuk. I am a big Dubois fan but I don't feel he's as can't miss as far as his ceiling goes as Tkachuk - I think Tkachuk is going to be a 40 goal scorer.

I really doubt it happens so my only worry is Chychrun is gone by 8th - I think there's a 70% chance he's gone before 8th.

 

[TehDoak]

To move up to 4th, I would give up Pysyk and one of next year's 2nds. That's it

Not giving up Girgensons to move 4 spots.

 

[Jim Bob]

Not sure if posted yet, but new mock draft from NHL.com were posted. Both of them have us bypassing Nylander who gets taken by Montreal in both mocks for a defenseman.

Not only do they both have Nylander at 9, they both have Sergachev at 10, as well.

 

[CaseyMitts37]

If the Sabres were drafting at 4, I would be actively looking to trade down to 7 or 8

The talent drop off is minimal between 4-10

 

[UnleashRasmus]

If the Sabres were drafting at 4, I would be actively looking to trade down to 7 or 8

The talent drop off is minimal between 4-10

You can definitely argue about which you prefer between: Chychrun, Juolevi, Sergachev, Dubois, Tkachuk, Nylander, Jost, Keller, Brown, McLeod so on and so forth. I prefer Tkachuk, Nylander, Dubois, Keller, Jost, McLeod, Brown in that order for forwards and Chychrun, Juolevi, Sergachev, McAvoy, Fabbro, Bean, Niemelainen, Dineen, Cederholm in that order give or take.

 

[stokes84]

You can definitely argue about which you prefer between: Chychrun, Juolevi, Sergachev, Dubois, Tkachuk, Nylander, Jost, Keller, Brown, McLeod so on and so forth. I prefer Tkachuk, Nylander, Dubois, Keller, Jost, McLeod, Brown in that order for forwards and Chychrun, Juolevi, Sergachev, McAvoy, Fabbro, Bean, Niemelainen, Dineen, Cederholm in that order give or take.

Ehhhh, there was a pretty clear cut 4 and 5 before the Memorial Cup, and Tkachuk definitely seperated himself even further at the Memorial Cup. This reminds me of when people were saying you could debate Chychrun with the Finns. Well, you cetainly are entitled to do so, but it's not right.

 

[Jim Bob]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/juni...yer-sean-day-opens-up-about-life-off-the-ice/

Day is, in many ways, the enigma of next summer’s draft. Scouts and fans watch him play and gasp at the extraordinary skating ability for a rearguard built like a linebacker. But at the same time they wonder why Day’s performance hasn’t always lived up to his skill set.

His first season as a 15-year-old “exceptional†player in the OHL went reasonably well, and the second started off very well. But then came his brother’s arrest. Since, his play has been inconsistent, he’s occasionally left the Steelheads to go back home and his draft stock has dropped.

“I think that’s what the scouts … talk about me just not looking engaged. A lot of the time I wasn’t,†he said. “So, it’s been tough. I went home for a little bit of the season and re-gathered my thoughts.

“That’s why it’s hard with my brother going away. He’s the reason I play, and he’s the reason I love [hockey], and he doesn’t even get to see me play it anymore.â€

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/10-takeaways-2016-nhl-scouting-combine/

3. Sean Day. Sigh. Okay, he’s down 20 pounds at least from last summer. At 230 he still looks like a beer leaguer but it’s a start. It didn’t look like he bought into the idea that the combine was a chance to make a big impression.

He went from ordinary to very ordinary to below average at the stations, and seemed sort of nonchalant. You look at him and think: How does an unathletic kid possess plus-plus skating? This is one of life’s mysteries and the reason that someone will undertake Day as a challenge.

I wonder if Murray will roll the dice on him?

 

[Chainshot]

Re: Garth's ridiculous trade proposal of Girgs, Pysyk, #8 OVA, and a "2nd or 3rd rounder" for #4 OVA - two things. First, yes, it's a ridiculous over-payment of assets to move up 4 - FOUR! - spots in this draft. Second, even though it would be an over-payment in assets, I don't see why Edmonton would be interested in that particular package. That #4 pick is a very valuable chip -- so while Pysyk, Girgs, #8, and a 2nd or 3rd rounder seem certainly to be too many Sabres' assets to give up for it -- I would guess that the Oilers would rather use it to help bring in a true, top-pair D-man, not a collection of odds and ends that don't fill that particular need for them. If the Sabres were to trade Pysyk, Girgs, #8, and a 2nd or 3rd, I'd hope that the return would be a young, proven, top pair LHD or sniper F.

Ahh Garth. Must be hard to be an insider now that his GI drinking buddy McKee is no longer associated with the team. How a middle school softball coach gets to be an NHL insider remains one of the great "unsolved mysteries" of our time.

 

[Jame]

Sometimes I think people confuse Chychrun with Day... lol

 

[Zip15]

I still think there's a decent chance we're picking #4. If EDM can get Pysyk and Sergachev, that's 2/3 of the RD position they badly need to upgrade. May be too much to pass up for the Oilers. I fully expect Chia will wait till the draft, though, in an effort to extract max value.