2016-2017 Kings Roster Talk Part IV

[johnjm22]

Agreed, nowhere have Blake or Luc said the team is in rebuild mode. In fact they've said the opposite, that they'd like to make a big splash in free agency. New GM, new coach, let's blow it up and start over! This is a case of a fan believing something that has been made up in his head, the Kings are not re-building. A lot of the blame has been laid on the outgoing GM and coach, the feeling that Lombardi's Loyalty Program and the old coach throwing out Nick Shore as an extra attacker or Dwight King or Trevor Lewis as #1LW. Those days are dead. The question is who the hell is a big splash in free agency? It's gonna have to be like a Palffy type trade.

You're making things up. No one said they think new management is rebuilding or looking to move Carter.

Some of us are saying they should explore the market for Carter.

 

[rajuabju]

Trading Carter essentially signals a major rebuild, not a retool. We dont trade what is arguably one of the best #2C's in the league on a good contract if we plan to contend immediately.

I'm not opposed to moving Carter, so long as the plan is blowing it up, moving Doughty, Muzzin, Amart, etc etc and going young and full on into rebuild mode.

Moving Carter in and of itself though, isnt the answer. It has to be one of several moves made.

 

[johnjm22]

Trading Carter essentially signals a major rebuild, not a retool.

It depends on what you get in return. For example, the assets the Ducks got in return for Bobby Ryan started paying dividends very quickly. Both Silfverberg and Ritchie are playing in the Ducks top six right now. Silfverberg was already in the NHL when the Ducks acquired him.

Visnovsky was 31 years old when we traded him. In return we got a 25yo defenseman and 26yo center. Had the Kings not waited to move Visnovsky they would have got a better return.

If there's a great package out there that we can get for Carter, then the trigger should be pulled on it. If there's isn't an adequate package available then trading him isn't worth it.

 

[deaderhead28]

Trading Carter essentially signals a major rebuild, not a retool. We dont trade what is arguably one of the best #2C's in the league on a good contract if we plan to contend immediately.

I'm not opposed to moving Carter, so long as the plan is blowing it up, moving Doughty, Muzzin, Amart, etc etc and going young and full on into rebuild mode.

Moving Carter in and of itself though, isnt the answer. It has to be one of several moves made.

High Five!!!!!

 

[Reaper45]

It depends on what you get in return. For example, the assets the Ducks got in return for Bobby Ryan started paying dividends very quickly. Both Silfverberg and Ritchie are playing in the Ducks top six right now. Silfverberg was already in the NHL when the Ducks acquired him.

Visnovsky was 31 years old when we traded him. In return we got a 25yo defenseman and 26yo center. Had the Kings not waited to move Visnovsky they would have got a better return.

If there's a great package out there that we can get for Carter, then the trigger should be pulled on it. If there's isn't an adequate package available then trading him isn't worth it.

Exactly, I don't know why everyone automatically assumes that a Carter trade starts a rebuild?

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

If trading Carter gets you a prospect like Patrick O'Sullivan (high scoring junior/minor player) and a 1st round pick that turn could turn into another Lewis like player (if they are lucky enough to draft an NHL player with a mid-late 1st), do you do it?

 

[Legionnaire]

What chance do you guys think we have of signing Williams again?

 

[Reclamation Project]

If trading Carter gets you a prospect like Patrick O'Sullivan (high scoring junior/minor player) and a 1st round pick that turn could turn into another Lewis like player (if they are lucky enough to draft an NHL player with a mid-late 1st), do you do it?

30+G/65P top two center for a 15-25 goal prospect and a third liner? No way Ziggy!

 

[johnjm22]

If trading Carter gets you a prospect like Patrick O'Sullivan (high scoring junior/minor player) and a 1st round pick that turn could turn into another Lewis like player (if they are lucky enough to draft an NHL player with a mid-late 1st), do you do it?

When POS was acquired, he was widely regarded as one of the top prospects in the world. He didn't pan out. That's the risk you take. You could be getting the next Iginla, or you could be getting the next POS.

Carter is worth more than Demitra right now IMO.

If you could get the best prospect in the world who's on the cusp of playing in the NHL, plus a 1st, plus another decent prospect for Carter you wouldn't consider it?

 

[johnjm22]

What chance do you guys think we have of signing Williams again?

He could fill a bottom 6 role. Our bottom 6 was really weak last year.

If we have some cap space, I think there's some value UFA's that could be signed to one or two year deals that could help boost the bottom 9.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

When POS was acquired, he was widely regarded as one of the top prospects in the world. He didn't pan out. That's the risk you take. You could be getting the next Iginla, or you could be getting the next POS.

Carter is worth more than Demitra right now IMO.

If you could get the best prospect in the world who's on the cusp of playing in the NHL, plus a 1st, plus another decent prospect for Carter you wouldn't consider it?

Seems like whoever is really the best prospect in the NHL would already be in the NHL, as most teams aren't afraid of inserting young players in the lineup.

I don't expect them to land an Ehlers, Pastrnak or Marner, so I'm not sure exactly who or what the Kings would look at if they were to move Carter. Florida isn't going to move a Barkov or Huberdeau, so you they may not get that great of a return for the best goal scorer on the team.

 

[The Tikkanen]

It would be another move where the Kings are like, hey, great season, you've been great for us, we need to trade you now! Meanwhile there are quite a few forwards who have earned a damned trade out of town but they get to stick around cause they have no value-including to the Kings.

 

[Reclamation Project]

POS, heh.

 

[Ziggy Stardust]

POS, heh.

Got carried by Kopitar and Brown in one successful season, staged a hold out, failed to find his producution, and was promptly dealt for what was perceived to be an injury prone forward who ended up being an impact player on two Cup runs.

What a fortunate turn of events that came to be, all starting with the Demitra trade to Minnesota. The trade was almost nixed as well when Edmonton found out the Kings were getting Williams.

Lombardi had to include a 2nd round selection to appease that whiny dumbass Kevin Lowe. Carolina wound up reacquiring Erik Cole, Edmonton got O'Sullivan and a 2nd, and the Kings came out on top with Williams.

A shame that Lombardi ran out of assets to pull off deals like that in his last three years. He really put himself and the future of the team in a corner when he should've continued to accumulate assets to eventually replace the likes of Williams and Brown and Gaborik.

 

[Reclamation Project]

Dean was a pimp and then he lost it. That trade, Carter, Gaborik, etc. All brilliant moves.

 

[johnjm22]

Got carried by Kopitar and Brown in one successful season

I don't think that's entirely true. He had his moments during that season.

Crawford was actually good at developing the offensive side of young players. Murray came in the following season and O'Sullivan's game wasn't the same. TM is an excellent defensive coach, but he's terrible at recognizing and developing offensive players (see Simmonds).

O'Sullivan went to Edmonton which was a tire fire and terrible situation for any young player. In his book he said that different members of the Oilers staff and management were literally telling him different things about what they wanted from him.

 

[no name]

I'm pretty sure POS was a 30-40 overall prospect. Certainly not a top prospect.

 

[KingsHockey24]

I'd like to see Blake give Brett Connolly a chance, could be a decent bottom six player for us. 6th overall pick back in.. 2010?

 

[johnjm22]

I'm pretty sure POS was a 30-40 overall prospect. Certainly not a top prospect.

No, he was easily considered a top 10 prospect. One of the most highly regarded forward prospects in the game.

In his first professional season he scored 93 points (47g, 46a) in 78 games.

In HF's 2007 top prospects rankings he was 8th overall. http://www.hockeysfuture.com/articles/9513/hockeys_future_top50_prospects_spring2007110/

 

[KINGS17]

It would be another move where the Kings are like, hey, great season, you've been great for us, we need to trade you now! Meanwhile there are quite a few forwards who have earned a damned trade out of town but they get to stick around cause they have no value-including to the Kings.

Really, when have the Kings done this?

 

[BigKing]

POS was a highly-regarded prospect at the time and was the jewel of the trade in the first place: not the 17th overall pick.

I think he would of had a better career if he didn't get traded, or at least not to Edmonton.

Loved him on the Kings.

 

[AlphaBravo]

The problem with trading Carter is that he has more value on this team than in the open market. I know optically, all we see is that Carter is signed to a very good deal, is a consistent goal scorer, and legit 1 or 2 C, but with the way things are going in the NHL, teams will not be giving up top prospects and the number 1 or 2 in this year's draft for someone over 30. The best we can get in a Carter trade is two nickles for a dime, and I would rather keep a game changer like Carter than have two depth players on this team in his place.

 

[LAKings88]

The problem with trading Carter is that he has more value on this team than in the open market. I know optically, all we see is that Carter is signed to a very good deal, is a consistent goal scorer, and legit 1 or 2 C, but with the way things are going in the NHL, teams will not be giving up top prospects and the number 1 or 2 in this year's draft for someone over 30. The best we can get in a Carter trade is two nickles for a dime, and I would rather keep a game changer like Carter than have two depth players on this team in his place.

Well said.

 

[Sacha Baron Corbin]

I still don't see why Blake would trade Carter right now, you're never going to get fair value for a guy like 77 and just opening a huge hole down the middle. I mean do people want to see Dowd as our 2C? I sure don't

If the organization is still planning on contending then I see no reason to trade one of the core guys on the team.

 

[funky]

I have said this before and I will stick with it. You do not treat Carter. Carter provides size, speed, and still, all things at all NHL teams are looking for. Carter is on her team from the contract and as he ages you can easily slide to the wing Where he is Toffoli with more size and speed.

Some people on these boards worry way to Much with age. There is nothing in Carter's past, and nothing in his play to indicate that he will slow down anytime soon. He has been playing in Sutters system which has to be the hardest system is NHL to play and I think any type of new system will keep the players fresher for the end of the year.

For me Carter is a core player does is Kopitar, Doughty and quick