GDT: 2016-17 Training Camp and Preseason Thread
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cgf
FireBednarsSuccessor
I'm still rooting for Dunk the lunk to make it, but if you can make Guenin look like a skilled puck-handler, you're probably not going to play much in the NHL.
Cousin Eddie
You Serious Clark?
- Nov 3, 2006
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Anybody confused by the overreaction of fans on Dunk being waived? If you're not good enough to make the NHL team you get sent to the AHL. After a certain amount of pro experience waivers are required for that to happen. There's been around 100 people waived in the last week and they're in the same position as Duncan.
People need to get over the position of where he was drafted and realize what he is now. I'm rooting for Siemens but when you're not good enough you're not good enough.
People need to get over the position of where he was drafted and realize what he is now. I'm rooting for Siemens but when you're not good enough you're not good enough.
Got to say I'm not overly impressed right now by Bednar/Sakic's roster management abilities at the moment.
You go ahead and send down Bigras the other day leaving Siemens, which is fine if they were going to give Siemens the opportunity to play and maybe get a shot at bottom pairing.
Now a couple days later you just throw Siemens onto waivers without him even getting a shot to play, it makes little to no sense. Especially if some team claims him, which I'm doubting, but you never know. As people mentioned the last thing I want to see is another Boychuk situation, where the guy never got a fair shake here and goes on to be a productive player elsewhere.
Not to mention the whole Rantanen issue that is looming. The fact is right now the guy is easily one of our 5 best players. Had he had the opportunity to play in the preseason, he would have easily demonstrated that. Now they are talking about sending him down due to something that was completely out of his control. That makes no sense, the guy learns absolutely nothing at the AHL level at this point as he has already demonstrated he can dominate that league. I can live with a 3 game "conditioning" stint as long as they bring him back ASAP. We can't afford to not play him on the NHL roster if he is healthy, he is just too good of a player.
While I do like Bednar's earn your ice time approach, there has to be some give and take as there also has to be some merit to icing the best possible team. And when you are actually considering putting out players like Sislo, Smith, Vogelhuber, Martinsen, Bourque x2, etc. instead of Rantanen, you're just not icing your best possible team. It might work a few games but eventually you need the talent to succeed at the NHL level.
I hate to say this but I'm actually kind of hoping the Avs get creamed by LA tonight and some of Bednar's hard workers like Sislo, Smith, Vogelhuber etc have rough games so Bednar can see that they aren't exactly NHL caliber guys, so it's an easier decision to put Rantanen (assuming he is healthy) on the roster. I have nothing against the above mentioned players, but I will start having a problem with them and the coach if they are taking away time from a guy like Rantanen.
You go ahead and send down Bigras the other day leaving Siemens, which is fine if they were going to give Siemens the opportunity to play and maybe get a shot at bottom pairing.
Now a couple days later you just throw Siemens onto waivers without him even getting a shot to play, it makes little to no sense. Especially if some team claims him, which I'm doubting, but you never know. As people mentioned the last thing I want to see is another Boychuk situation, where the guy never got a fair shake here and goes on to be a productive player elsewhere.
Not to mention the whole Rantanen issue that is looming. The fact is right now the guy is easily one of our 5 best players. Had he had the opportunity to play in the preseason, he would have easily demonstrated that. Now they are talking about sending him down due to something that was completely out of his control. That makes no sense, the guy learns absolutely nothing at the AHL level at this point as he has already demonstrated he can dominate that league. I can live with a 3 game "conditioning" stint as long as they bring him back ASAP. We can't afford to not play him on the NHL roster if he is healthy, he is just too good of a player.
While I do like Bednar's earn your ice time approach, there has to be some give and take as there also has to be some merit to icing the best possible team. And when you are actually considering putting out players like Sislo, Smith, Vogelhuber, Martinsen, Bourque x2, etc. instead of Rantanen, you're just not icing your best possible team. It might work a few games but eventually you need the talent to succeed at the NHL level.
I hate to say this but I'm actually kind of hoping the Avs get creamed by LA tonight and some of Bednar's hard workers like Sislo, Smith, Vogelhuber etc have rough games so Bednar can see that they aren't exactly NHL caliber guys, so it's an easier decision to put Rantanen (assuming he is healthy) on the roster. I have nothing against the above mentioned players, but I will start having a problem with them and the coach if they are taking away time from a guy like Rantanen.
I'm not disappointed by him being waived he clearly isn't NHL material right now, it's just the way they did it makes little to no sense. Their roster/asset management right now is somewhat questionable.
You know sending Bigras down made sense if they were going to give Duncan at shot at the team as he would have to clear waivers , but they put Duncan on waivers two days later without him even playing a game, it just makes no sense.
Duchene2MacKinnon
In the hands of Genius
- Aug 8, 2006
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Siemens right now is not an asset he's fat that needs to be trimmed. Sucks to see Bigras down but he'll be back as soon they figure Gelinas has rocks for brains and Weirdo is Gormely 2.0.
Cousin Eddie
You Serious Clark?
- Nov 3, 2006
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How does Bigras or Siemens being sent down have anything to do with one another. Their plan is to keep 7 defenseman up and neither of those were one of those 7. Siemens outlasted Bigras by a few days which is good for him but it was never a choice of Siemens vs Bigras. It's the choice of who's going to be the 7.
I think they hung on to him precisely because he had to go through waivers. Had they sent him down at the same time as Bigras, other teams would have had time to fly him over and see him in a few practices and a game. Now they do not...maybe one practice Monday (the 4 teams that play Monday would be able to get him in a game, but 4 is safer than 30). Teams are not going to want to gift a roster spot to a waived guy that has next to no NHL experience and that they have not seen in person. They may not be worried too much about losing Duncan himself. But they do not have the total personnel to lose a defenseman.
McMetal
Writer of Wrongs
- Sep 29, 2015
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What's the big deal? Siemens is not an NHL caliber player, and likely never will be. He won't be claimed, no team in the league has a bad enough defense to take one of our marginal castoffs and give him a roster spot. If he can't crack OUR defense, no one else will want him either.
linusandvarlamov
GO AVS GO !
Completely agree ! Really hope Rantanen is in the line-up come opening night. Just like you said, he has nothing left to do in the AHL.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
Some people think he's better right now than Bigras and that he had made the cut because Bigras was sent down, and that the Avs would never risk losing him on waivers, so no I'm not surprised by the reaction.
Its good Siemens got more of a shot this season and if he can be a legitimate callup option that would be a good next step for him. Its tough to go from zero callups to making the roster.
Its hilarious to go from the Duncan finally made it to the I knew he'd never amount to anything narrative in 24 hours.
Who is talking about sending Rantanen down? That's something we speculate here but has anyone actually said it? He practiced today and even spoke to the media.
They were never going to give him a shot, its not like they changed their minds. We go through this every single year about how they'd never waive XYZ because they don't want to lose them and then they go and do it anyway. What asset is there to manage? The timing of it makes more sense, they are trying to do it at the best time possible to get him through. And like I said the other day multiple times, there is a greater plan in place because of the organizational depth chart on D and there literally is none to the point where they can't afford to keep up 8D. The decision was on Bigras, when they decided to not keep him then the decision was made. Frei even said when he was cut that the decision was to go with 7D.
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Coach Nate
Angry Rampage Expat
Yeah, I haven't seen anyone advocating for sending Mikko to the AHL full time. Maybe for a couple of weeks to start the season to get into game shape, but I think he's firmly in the team's plans to play top 9 minutes.
forsbergavs32
Global Moderator
McMetal
Writer of Wrongs
- Sep 29, 2015
- 14,168
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If Rantanen is practicing now, it seems unlikely he'll be actually cut. Worst case he goes for a brief conditioning stint, but if he's on the ice with the rest of the squad he could very well make opening night. I see no indication that he starts in the AHL aside from guesses based on literal interpretations of Bednar's "earn your ice time" mantra.
The Kingslayer
Registered User
How has my fellow Norwegian, Martinsen done this pre season ? Any chance of him making opening night roster?
- Feb 24, 2012
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Siemens will clear and he wasn't going to be a factor in the roster. I know people got hope once Bigras was sent down, but Bigras > Siemens. With regards to it being today, it is about timing.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
Petty good, I think there is a good chance. There's a few injuries at forward too so he should slot in. He's right there at 12/13/14 forward but should make it.
BTW, I'm going to shut this thread down soon. I'll put up the GDT and then once that's over we can get straight into our first PGT.
Goodbye Training Camp, you were fun. See you next year.
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