2015 ReDraft as per HFBoards

[HyPnOtiK]

I seem to be the only one with this opinion but he legit only looks good in 2 of the 3 zones when I see him play. *shrug*

I can tell you as someone whos watched every NHL game he's played and a ton of Junior games, he's better defensively than offensively.

 

[toxic poster]

Well you're wrong. Provorov has been playing 1D minutes with AHL level partners every year until this year. Provorov also has been better this year than Chabot has been at any point in his career. You're looking at a 15-20 Goal 45-55 point defensemen who is better in his own end than he is offensively. Guy is ridiculously underrated. Chabot definitely makes a case though, Werenski isn't close.

HF - where opinions are now facts without any substantial proof other than hearsay.

Provorov spent ~760 minutes with the best version of Gostisbehere in 2017-2018.
Chabot split time with Karlsson and Ceci (399,270) minutes respectively.

2018-2019;

Player1	Player2	Mins
Prov	Sanheim	867
Chabot	Demelo	771
Prov	Hagg	275
Chabot	Ceci	247

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

So like, he hasn't played with AHL partners (excluding Hagg) for the majority of his minutes at any point in his career, really. Has he played tougher competition before this season? Absolutely. But they play roughly similar quality minutes this year and are fairing somewhat equally given team strength. I'd say Chabot has had a rougher time having to carry the carcass of Ceci around at portions of the previous two years - where Sanheim > Demelo by a fair margin too.

 

[Beerz]

Thankd for being objective. You can see yourself out.

It's like rain on your wedding day.

 

[inthewings]

Ilya Samsonov #30 is really bad.

 

[Lonewolfe2015]

4 CAR Aho 51% (+31) 2015 NHL redraft poll #4
5 COL Rantanen 68% (+5) 2015 reDraft #5

This one genuinely surprises me. I'm guessing there's a C/W or slight defensive preference here favoring Aho? Anyone that watches both regularly enough want to break them down in why? Rantanen's offensive abilities just seem that much higher, but I don't watch them closely enough to contend.

 

[Muffin]

Now imagine if Zboril and Senyshyn turn into regular NHL players.... that would be a solid 4 picks they hit on including all 3 first round picks (which isn't that common)

Pretty sure that was a joke since they managed to miss on 3 first rounders. Barzal, Chabot and Connor went right after their 3 picks. Funny thing is those 3 were the consensus BPA and Boston tried to outsmart everyone and ended up whiffing badly.

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

I don't care that Eichel would go 2nd, it makes sense why he would, but Eichel isn't even close to being as complete a player as Marner is.

Your post reads of ******** from previous arguments and half truths and misunderstandings about player situations and linemate quality. Fact is this is the only season since Marner joined the league Eichel looks like he will outscore him. Every previous season it was Mitch>, and that's Mitch with vastly less ice-time and PP minutes, that's also Mitch with less offensive zone starts.

He didn't make the NHL right out of the draft because unlike Eichel he was about 158lbs and built like a 12 year old (think Jack Hughes) he didn't look like he could handle the physicality, or maybe it was they didn't want him around a losing atmosphere and weren't hard up to sell seats like Buffalo. Regardless, when he did make the league his C was Tyler Bozak, the following season it was Bozak, Gauthier and finally Kadri. That's a 3rd, 4th and 2/3 C in which Marner helped each reach career highs while outscoring Eichel who was being baby fed minutes and opportunity with the likes of Ryan O'Reilly. Marner finished the year going over p/pg in the post season next to Bozak.

You see Babs didn't like to play Marner with Matthews or Nylander, not even on the PP. In their first 3 years they didn't see the ice together more than a handful of shifts.

Last season Mitch gets Tavares, ends up with 94pts and 14th in Selke votes, because unlike Eichel he actually has a complete game, kills penalties, blocks shots intentionally, and outside of Mark Stone is the best at stripping pucks in the league.

Eichel is good, but complete he is not.


Otherwise the only thing that's really out of whack is that Provorov should easily be well ahead of Werenski. Complete D > offensive D, last years Norris should of shown that.

LOL you think Marner is better than Eichel defensively? Eichel is absolutely relentless on the back check tenaciously and passionately. Always. & Eichel DOES kill penalties, the most willing shotblocker on the team, you didn't know? Eichel usually has at least one good hit every period. Posts like these I don't want to say anything to break the rules but I'm honestly wondering if [this post] is trolling or serious unless you actually watched them play? I don't think I've ever seen Marner hit someone (granted don't watch the leafs regularly).

I've paid very close attention to Marner the games he's played Buffalo (all games since he's entered NHL) he's not even close to the level of impact as Eichel. Like literally. INEC

Eichel is in a tier of his own already, get used to it, no matter how many times you say Winger Mitch Marner is better.

 

[M2Beezy]

This one genuinely surprises me. I'm guessing there's a C/W or slight defensive preference here favoring Aho? Anyone that watches both regularly enough want to break them down in why? Rantanen's offensive abilities just seem that much higher, but I don't watch them closely enough to contend.

I feel the 4 of them (Marner Rantanen Barzal Aho) are all pretty close and interchangable depending on the day lol. Some disagree and feel one is above the others or one is below the others but even that changes.

Barzals offense is the lowest of the 4 the last 1.25 seasons but hes been asked to take on a more defensive load so theres more than just the stats. I feel Rantanen brings the most offense, Aho and Barzal are the most complete each with qualities better than the other, Marner the best ability to elevate his game to another level

 

[Tage2Tuch]

LOL you think Marner is better than Eichel defensively? Eichel is absolutely relentless on the back check tenaciously and passionately. Always. & Eichel DOES kill penalties, the most willing shotblocker on the team, you didn't know? Eichel usually has at least one good hit every period. Posts like these I don't want to say anything to break the rules but I'm honestly wondering if [this post] is trolling or serious unless you actually watched them play? I don't think I've ever seen Marner hit someone (granted don't watch the leafs regularly).

I've paid very close attention to Marner the games he's played Buffalo (all games since he's entered NHL) he's not even close to the level of impact as Eichel. Like literally. INEC

Eichel is in a tier of his own already, get used to it, no matter how many times you say Winger Mitch Marner is better.

It’s not even worth debating with him.

And I actually watch the leafs. Marner is really impressive at times in the playoff she was blocking shot after shot the kid has a ton of passion. But in the games Mitchell has been in this year I haven’t been half as impressed as Eichel and that has nothing to do with bias. Marner had John TAVARES the guy who gave anders Lee two forty goal seasons and look at Lee now. Look at Marner before then look at Marner with JT.
Then look at Eichel....with anybody. Not even close. He said something about my wooden Pennies some none sense have no selling ability (some dumb line) he honestly thinks the only thing Eichels done to strong defensively this year is “put in more effort@ he completely ignored Eichels elite (is elite even strong enough a word when your the very best at it in the best league in the world?) puck possession, transition numbers, having the second best plus minus our of all top ten scorers, last year was the only guy in the top 25 who didn’t have a single player on the team but him get over 65 points. Yet he had 82. Now this year he’s in pace to have like 35 more points then the next highest guy if not 40. I can’t imagine how tough times right now would be to someone who doubts/hates Eichel. Does said person just not turn the tv on? Or?....


I also find it funny how analysts on tsn Re debating if Eichels better then Matthews this season. First of all if it was overall at least you could debate it but that shouldn’t be a question. I can’t think of one thing Matthews is better at this year (and he’s had a very productive season)!...faceoffs? Haven’t checked but I know jacks better at those too then he’s ever been. Every aspect
Of Eichels game has progressive linear production.

What I find funny is the guys on tsn (video is on YouTube) it’s a all the tsn Toronto analysts they said “if Eichel plays the way he has the last 17 games you could say he’s uo there with the Matthews as one of the best young players in the game”

Two things distinctly stand out with that foolish comment, one they’re pretending as if lhe wasn’t playing well before these 17 games and two, and they’re suggesting that Eichel “could be” as good as Matthews if he plays the rest of his career at the level of his last 17 games. Haha....So that means Eichel would score 75 goals and 65 assists every season, 140 pts, plus 40 on BUFFALO every year for he rest of his career and then and ONLY then is he as good as Matthews, stay classy Toronto. Never change.

 

[LeafsNation75]

It’s not even worth debating with him.

And I actually watch the leafs. Marner is really impressive at times in the playoff she was blocking shot after shot the kid has a ton of passion. But in the games Mitchell has been in this year I haven’t been half as impressed as Eichel and that has nothing to do with bias. Marner had John TAVARES the guy who gave anders Lee two forty goal seasons and look at Lee now. Look at Marner before then look at Marner with JT.
Then look at Eichel....with anybody. Not even close. He said something about my wooden Pennies some none sense have no selling ability (some dumb line) he honestly thinks the only thing Eichels done to strong defensively this year is “put in more effort@ he completely ignored Eichels elite (is elite even strong enough a word when your the very best at it in the best league in the world?) puck possession, transition numbers, having the second best plus minus our of all top ten scorers, last year was the only guy in the top 25 who didn’t have a single player on the team but him get over 65 points. Yet he had 82. Now this year he’s in pace to have like 35 more points then the next highest guy if not 40. I can’t imagine how tough times right now would be to someone who doubts/hates Eichel. Does said person just not turn the tv on? Or?....


I also find it funny how analysts on tsn Re debating if Eichels better then Matthews this season. First of all if it was overall at least you could debate it but that shouldn’t be a question. I can’t think of one thing Matthews is better at this year (and he’s had a very productive season)!...faceoffs? Haven’t checked but I know jacks better at those too then he’s ever been. Every aspect
Of Eichels game has progressive linear production.

What I find funny is the guys on tsn (video is on YouTube) it’s a all the tsn Toronto analysts they said “if Eichel plays the way he has the last 17 games you could say he’s uo there with the Matthews as one of the best young players in the game”

Two things distinctly stand out with that foolish comment, one they’re pretending as if lhe wasn’t playing well before these 17 games and two, and they’re suggesting that Eichel “could be” as good as Matthews if he plays the rest of his career at the level of his last 17 games. Haha....So that means Eichel would score 75 goals and 65 assists every season, 140 pts, plus 40 on BUFFALO every year for he rest of his career and then and ONLY then is he as good as Matthews, stay classy Toronto. Never change.

In the past I have said that Marner could possibly be the second best player among those selected in the 2015 draft after McDavid. Now that was when Eichel was putting up 56, 57 and 64 points in his first 3 seasons, where as Marner had 61, 69 and 94 points in his first 3 seasons.

If you wanted to say Eichel is the second best player selected after McDavid that’s your opinion and his stats this season back that up.

However Marner belongs in the same tier with McDavid and Eichel among those drafted in 2015.

 

[Tripod]

Quite happy with the Flyers getting a #1Dman in Provy and this year, a PPG player in Konecny in the 1st round.

Then picked up Myers as an undrafted UFA

Sandstrom, Vorobyev, Kase, Fedotov, Tomek still have NHL upside.

Cooper Marody, a 6th rd pick, traded to Oilers for 3rd rd pick in 2019. The Flyers then used that pick + #45 pick, to move up in the draft and select Bobby Brink at #34. That was very good use of the Marody selection.

 

[Tage2Tuch]

In the past I have said that Marner could possibly be the second best player among those selected in the 2015 draft after McDavid. Now that was when Eichel was putting up 56, 57 and 64 points in his first 3 seasons, where as Marner had 61, 69 and 94 points in his first 3 seasons.

If you wanted to say Eichel is the second best player selected after McDavid that’s your opinion and his stats this season back that up.

However Marner belongs in the same tier with McDavid and Eichel among those drafted in 2015.

Cringe.

You’re still going to use the point total (wthout the context shown right below) to try and make your argument back then mean something? I wasn’t even talking about you by the way. So I don’t know why you’re responding to this ....

But I told you even back Eichel was putting up 57 in 61 and 64 in 67. That is worlds different the. Just putting up 56, 57 and 64.

Then factor in Playing with one leg in two of those seasons (a huge part of them anyway those high ankle sprains can linger) on league worst offenses his pace was not only 78. 80 and 89 in those three years but he could of pushed 90 and 100 in a different system where teams could score snd easier match ups without a high scoring team to help like Marner. I told you from the beginning I watched both players. And I told you from the beginning Marner bad tavares. Eichel has always been a one man show.

It’s worlds different for Eichel because Marner and Matthews both have the other line to
Hep then get tougher match ups while they can score on easier ones whilst Eichel always gets the touchest ones.

But not sure why you’re taking this personal, this wasn’t about you?

 

[Quiet Jack]

In the past I have said that Marner could possibly be the second best player among those selected in the 2015 draft after McDavid. Now that was when Eichel was putting up 56, 57 and 64 points in his first 3 seasons, where as Marner had 61, 69 and 94 points in his first 3 seasons.

If you wanted to say Eichel is the second best player selected after McDavid that’s your opinion and his stats this season back that up.

However Marner belongs in the same tier with McDavid and Eichel among those drafted in 2015.

Saying Eichel is in the same tier with McDavid is a stretch. Saying that Marner belongs in the same tier as McDavid is lunacy.

 

[GOilers88]

These are always fun to read.

"My guy is OBVIOUSLY better than yours".

"Yeah right buds you clearly don't even watch the games cause my guy is better, hands down!"

"You guys are both wrong cause my guy is definitely better than both of yours AINEC".

"Hey guys relax, it's pretty subjective, there is no right answer".

"Lol this guy doesn't have a clue go watch baseball."

 

[Incubajerks]

Barzal is a much, much better player than Aho. I don't even think it's close, Barzal has a ceiling as a top 5 player in this league, Aho's ceiling is nowhere near that.

Hmmm not looking good