2015-16 St. John's IceCaps & Brampton Beast Part II
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Whitesnake
If you rebuild, they will come.
- Jan 5, 2003
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Hey, they keep losing but I heard that winning is not important. And it's good for development.
**** this management.
**** this management.
Whitesnake
If you rebuild, they will come.
- Jan 5, 2003
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56,181 posts.....how the f**k do you do it
I just calculated it and if you're up 12hrs a day, it's a post every hr for 13yrs.....that's crazy, you're a real trooper Whitesnake.
Back to your statement, they definitely need to rethink their hiring process and criteria for eligibility when it comes to the coach because optically, it doesn't look good
Whitesnake
If you rebuild, they will come.
- Jan 5, 2003
- 89,508
- 36,916
56,181 posts.....how the f**k do you do it
I just calculated it and if you're up 12hrs a day, it's a post every hr for 13yrs.....that's crazy, you're a real trooper Whitesnake.
Back to your statement, they definitely need to rethink their hiring process and criteria for eligibility when it comes to the coach because optically, it doesn't look good
Funny thing is that I slowed down now so at one point...it had to be way more than this....Hey, what can I say....I'm a fan who loves talking about hockey. Thing is...I think I'M not top 30 in this board. And some entered this site after me.
bryan1966
Time for some fast & skilled hockey!
Well the coaching staff for the Icecaps is managing to take the offence out of everyones game and making them better people. They should all be ready to play under Therrien soon!
Jeffrey
Registered User
Can people please stop telling me that Lefebvre is developing NHL talent... He is not even developing properly AHL players.
WeThreeKings
Habs cup - its in the BAG
Are you kidding? He DEVELOPED Gallagher in 30 games!!
Gabriel Dumont (career AHLer)
Nathan Beaulieu (Offensive game hasn't progressed, MT keeps jerking him around)
Michael Bournival (from NHLer to barely productive AHLer)
Patrick Holland (bust)
Louis Leblanc (Epic bust)
Jared Tinordi (Traded for peanuts after not being developed)
Greg Pateryn (can't get ice time, is only in the NHL level because of contract)
Aaron Palushaj (Bust)
Steve Quailer (Bust)
Joonas Nattinen (Bust)
Morgan Ellis (last season of being AHL eligible, having a great season, have to see him in NHL)
Blake Geoffrion (Career ending injury)
Joe Stejskal (Bust)
Alexander Avtsin (Bust)
Brady Vail (Bust)
Charles Hudon (Doing well at AHL level, produced in 2 NHL games, was sent back down to MT)
Danny Kristo (Bust)
Olivier Archambault (Bust)
Olivier Fortier (Bust)
Cedrick Desjardins (Bust)
Robert Mayer (Bust)
Ian Schultz (Bust)
Sebastien Collberg (Busting)
Peter Delmas (Bust)
Dustin Tokarski (Bust)
Sven Andrighetto (Produces in NHL then sent down to AHL, clearly MT doesn't like something in his development).
Christian Thomas (Bust)
Magnus Nygren (Went back to Sweden to develop)
Stefan Fournier (Bust)
Erik Nystrom (Bust)
Darren Dietz (looked good in pre-season one year, has stagnated)
Connor Crisp (Bad pick/Bust)
Nick Sorkin (Bust)
Jack Nevins (Bust)
Mike Condon (NHL Back-Up)
Daniel Carr (Productive in his NHL stint, sent back down for some MT reason)
Mac Bennett (Busting)
DLR (Not showing offensive improvement)
Josiah Didier (Busting)
Tim Bozon (in ECHL)
Brett Lernout (Jury out)
So... yeah..
And his records?
2012-2013: 29-41-6 159 GF 228 GA
2013-2014: 33-35-8 182 GF 224 GA
2014-2015: 34-29-12 201 GF 208 GA
Currently? 19-17-9
The amount of players that he's developed on the team? Gallagher (who would've been in the NHL already if not for the lock out), Beaulieu (Who can't be sent through waivers and should be further along than he is), Mike Condon (Goalie coach not Lefebvre) and Pateryn (who barely plays).
Whitesnake
If you rebuild, they will come.
- Jan 5, 2003
- 89,508
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Perfect resume. But that's what a country club is. Keep the friends, forget the results.
Therrien said it himself...sometimes you have to look BEYOND THE RESULTS. Bergevin said it himself, in the AHL...you have to look BEYOND THE RESULTS.
****ing pathetic organization that clearly do well.....BEYOND THE RESULTS.
WeThreeKings
Habs cup - its in the BAG
There's nothing else to look at, they haven't won, they haven't developed, and they haven't graduated a prospect into a serious role into the organization since Lefebvre has taken over.
I think Lefebvre should be replaced. I think he is not up to the task. That being said, this post is totally dishonest like so many from this frenetic member. To call late rounders busts is a joke. To claim that Dany Kristo is a bust because of Lefebvre is just a joke. Same thing for Brady Vail and Collberg. They left the organization early and are not doing anything elsewhere. Again, Lefebvre should be replaced, but he is not that bad. Every teams are full of late picks that don't make it to the NHL and are not called bust. A bust is a player that does not meet high expectations.
WeThreeKings
Habs cup - its in the BAG
How is he not that bad? He has not, in 4 years, graduated a prospect into a top 6 or top 4 role on this team. That's horrendous.
If that's your criteria,why don't we list the players you expected to
have a top six/top four role in the NHL. That is Before they played
in the AHL.,
Mine are Beaulieu, Nygren, Scherbak, Lablanc, Collberg, and maybe McCarron,
Hudon, Galagher,and Avtsin. Of those ,at about 23 Galagher is there, and Beaulieu
is still on track to get there. McCarron,Scherbak,and Hudon havn't shown any
signs of busting yet. They could all three be playing thier expected roles in
the Nhl in a few years. That leaves me with Collberg, Avtsin Lablanc, as busts.
And Nygren as a disappointment, somewhat similar to a bust.
In return one player not on my list,was playing top six at times,
when he got hurt. Carr of course. And he certainly developed better
than expected. Then there is 'Ghetto. If he plays top six somewhere
next season that's pretty good development for a 3rd round pick.
I don't like Lefebvre either. But it's your list that's horreddous.
Gallagher, like it or not played under Lefebvre and is in the top-6. If you say he has not been developped by SL, than he was by MT that you hate just as much. Why Gallagher made it quick under these two coaches and not the other ones? Leblanc did not make it elswhere in the AHL, even in the KHL. Often the responsability is on the player.
Beaulieu is a top-4 D developped under SL.
Hudon will make it, it's just a matter of time.
Same thing for Andrighetto, in Montréal or elsewhere.
Who else was SL supposed to developp into a top-6 forward at this point?
Kristo tutned into Thomas? No. Both did nothing elsewhere.
Leblanc is a draft bust, not related to developpment. It is on Timmins.
Collberg, traded very early. Draft bust. On Timmins again.
From 2013 on is still too early.
All the late rounds picks are loterry tickets. We won once with Gallagher, and are likely to win with Hudon.
I think Lefebvre should be replaced because the coach in the minors should be a potential replacement for the NHL team, which SL is not. I think our team this year is underperforming as a whole, even though it's a very young team. Holloway is the only veteran, and since Barberio has been called up it is harder for them. Still I think they have the roster to make the playoffs. That being said, I don't think our top prospects are at risk under SL. McCarron and Scherbak are going to make it.
Also any fair discussion should include Carr.Two years or less from
undrafted free-agent, to contributing in the NHL.
LaP
Registered User
Doc McKenna
A new era 2021
- Jan 5, 2009
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In which ways, that he keeps getting sent back down because the coach doesn't like the way he plays? So if the NHL coach doesn't like dev of AHL coach..what then?
Don't forget David Fisher being a bust, never playing a single NHL game we got a 2nd as compensation for super bad 1st round bust
montreal
Go Habs Go
Gallagher played 36 games, how much did he really develop in that short of time? He had back to back to back 40+ goal seasons in the WHL, so it's not like he wasn't a very good player at the time he turned pro. He looks the same as he did in juniors. But that said, he's the best that we have to show from 3 1/2 years of Lefebvre in the AHL.
Beaulieu is not a top 4 D yet. He was used in the top 4 and in the top 2 and every time it didn't last that long and he ended up back on the bottom pairing where he is now. Granted he's having his best season to date for sure, and there's no telling how much better he will get but he was a 17th overall pick from one of the best scouts in the NHL so at least to me I expected a lot more from him then he's shown. Also he didn't turn things around until he started playing with Gonchar, since then he's cut down on those costly turnovers that kept getting him sent down. To me that shows our AHL coaching staff weren't able to work with him to help him improve his defensive game. When Doug Jarvis was our AHL head coach, he took Andrei Kostitsyn a side in practice to work with him on improving his defensive game as he was so raw it wasn't funny how out of place he looked that year coming over from Russia. The next season you could see the difference. Can we say the same things under Lefebvre?
I think Hudon will make it and be a solid NHLer, we won't know until we see it but he's so smart and imo you can't teach those smarts to go with his high skill level and something else that you don't always see from skilled players, he has some sandpaper to his game as even though he's undersized he doesn't back down and sticks in nose in the dirty areas. Things are things that imo will lead to a good NHLer and while Lefebvre will get credit, it's not like Hudon wasn't known for all of this before. But even then when you have one of the best scouts in the NHL, who clearly has been able to find NHL talent, you should expect several NHLers not one here and there over 4 years.
Ghetto it remains to be seen if he will be an NHLer or not. If the league expands at some point that's only going to open up more spots that aren't currently there. If it doesn't to be on a top team in the NHL he's going to need to show a good bit more then he has imo. So will he be a solid NHLer, we'll have to wait and see.
Thomas was a big sniper in the OHL and was a 2nd round pick. He showed very little in the AHL under Lefebvre until this year after he went through waivers. It's a shame that it took him several years under Lefebvre to step up his game. I don't know what his NHL future holds as he certainly has the shot and speed but needs to do more.
I don't get how anyone blames just Timmins for Leblanc. I know some really hate him but it boggles the mind that it's just Timmins fault. Leblanc was a top scorer on every team he played on up until he was a 20 year old in the NHL. The mere fact that people can't see that Leblanc was playing well in the AHL and was at one point one of our best players as a 20 year old rookie and then the next season under Lefebvre his game does a complete 180 and somehow no one wants to blame Lefebvre for a 1st round pick that was decent imo in his limited NHL showing and was certainly doing fine in his first pro season before being called up to the next few years under Lefebvre his game totally fell apart. To me there's a lot of blame to go around. He was called up too soon, not the best pick as he was so skinny and weak lower body, perhaps he had other things impacting him off the ice. Either way he was doing fine until he started playing under Lefebvre. Not saying by any means it's all on Lefebvre but when Leblanc, Tinordi and Beaulieu all struggle under Lefebvre as 1st rounders imo it's worth being concerned and asking if we can't do better.
agreed on Collberg, Vail, Kristo as nothing to do with Lefebvre.
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