Olympics: 2014 - U.S. Roster Discussion (Part II)

[magic school bus]

I hope USA Hockey enjoyed saying "no" to Umberger as much as I did

 

[AmericanDream]

I really like seeing Kyle Palmieri on this list. I have very high hopes for the young man as being a consistent 30 plus goal scorer. Hopefully this is the start of big things for him.

 

[Xokkeu]

Russia has a freakish top six but will the team come together? A U.S. "C" team waxed a strong Russian side at the WC's this year.

The modern Russian team mentality is always so fragile. They have the talent, but it seems like it only takes a small crack to fracture the entire team's mentality.

Yea Martin's definitely in the top four.

Don't know why, but this made me laugh incessantly.

Talent wise I dont think we compare to Russia or Canada. I think they can blow us away with team chemistry or talent from head to toe. Even Sweden is comparable to us.

if we want to win, we have to do stick to the gameplan that Burke had in place. Should be eerily similar to what Poile wants, and its good that Burke is on staff.

We cant go with the top 4 talented lines. I dont think it works that way.

Canada sure, but Russia? In 2010 they ran out Denis Grebeshkov, Dmitri Kalinin, Fedor Tyutin and some KHL guys like Konstantin Kornayev and Ilya Nikulin who were decimated by Canada. Now granted, the international ice surface will suit Russian d-men better than Vancouver, probably bumping Anton Volchenkov off the team. Russia's defense pails in comparison to the US's depth and their goaltending is even weaker compared to the Americans. Yes they have higher quality scoring forwards, and yes their KHL depth forwards will be better on the international surface than small ice, but who would you rather have? Ryan Callahan and Joe Pavelski or Alexei Tereshenko and Alexander Popov?

Pominville is one of the highest-scoring USA-eligible players. He's competed for USA internationally in the past.

The fact that he wasn't even invited is bizarre to me.

Does Team USA have something against dual citizens?

For some reason I'm going to say no....

Paul Martin is getting criminally underrated here.

You all are including younger & sexier names to the lineups, but they are not really better than P.Martin right now. Good thing is that Bylsma is the coach and knows very well who Paul Martin is. He´ve had a phenomenal season and was rightfully considered Penguins´ best all around D-man (better than Letang). He´s also a good fit on the bigger ice. That said, he´s almost a mortal lock to making a team USA and it won´t be to play 3rd pairing minutes..

Orpik has zero chance, but it´s great to see Beau Bennett getting this kind of experience. That kid has a great talent and I wouldn´t be surprised to see him having a great 2013/2014 season.

Is Martin really underrated? He's in most lineups I've seen. The group after Suter and McDonaugh is all pretty tight and very good from 3-8. Martin was a big loss in 2010, so it's not like we don't know what he can do.

 

[Tasty Biscuits]

Another take away from the recent NHL.com article is Poile talking about the US's recent lack of success in Olympic tournaments on international ice, which was something they took into consideration selecting the camp invite roster and will do so for the final one.

I'd imagine they'd put a higher premium on puck possession players as opposed to those who play more of a grinding style, which is more effective on smaller ice where there's less space to evade a check.

 

[Xokkeu]

Another take away from the recent NHL.com article is Poile talking about the US's recent lack of success in Olympic tournaments on international ice, which was something they took into consideration selecting the camp invite roster and will do so for the final one.

I'd imagine they'd put a higher premium on puck possession players as opposed to those who play more of a grinding style, which is more effective on smaller ice where there's less space to evade a check.

Skating, skating, skating. It's been a US emphasis on this generation, and lets hope we can see the results this winter. Our 2010 Olympic team and World Junior entries have all made my good Canadian friends nervous, because while they usually have the higher skill quotient, our teams are always fast and dangerous.

There still seems to be something about home cooking though. Even with Salt Lake City being played on big ice, and many of the same players on the team in 1998 and 2006, we did well.

 

[Epic Neal Time]

Parise-Statsny-Kessel
Ryan-Kesler-Kane
Pacioretty-Backes-Oshie
Brown-Pavelski-Callahan

Suter-Shattenkirk
Byfuglien-McDonaugh
Orpik-Martin

Quick
Schneider
Miller

 

[FytinSioux]

actually very surprised to see Bjugstad getting an invite over Charlie Coyle and Jason Zucker..especially Coyle who can really step up and have a big year next year.

no real complaints on the roster but clearly some young kids just getting the chance at some experience to be with some of these vets.

Not sure why Bjugstad got an invite either. It pays to be big I guess. What has he done to get an invite over others, including the ones you mentioned? I see only hype with Bjugstad so far, not much for results. I don't think he has met expectations anywhere, college, WJCs, development camps, etc. The guy is a monster and could be a force if he keeps developing, but it just seems like everybody is penciling him in as some big talented power forward in the NHL and future Olympics.

I get its only an invite and he won't make the team, but I don't see how he even gets an invite over others.

 

[Thesensation19*]

Poile just came out and said that the players not invited to camp are not restricted from making the 2014 roster. The camp is just a preliminary introduction, they might not even practice (both USA and Canada) due to high insurance costs.

Terribly high in fact. Its like a million or two million bucks to just have them practice. Per person I believe.

 

[Xokkeu]

Poile just came out and said that the players not invited to camp are not restricted from making the 2014 roster. The camp is just a preliminary introduction, they might not even practice (both USA and Canada) due to high insurance costs.

Terribly high in fact. Its like a million or two million bucks to just have them practice. Per person I believe.

Might not even practice, correction, they won't practice. They are basically just doing a bunch of off ice stuff. Working with kids, listening to a US veteran give a talk and stuff like that.

 

[Thesensation19*]

I truly believe in Burke's ideology for selecting this team. Ive said it many times and do not think people have really realized that its what led us to success in 2010.

Look at Canada's potential roster. From head to toe they are filled with overall great and really good players. We cannot stand toe to toe with them and expect to match up. I look at Russia's team and even there roster is probably better in many areas, but I overall like their style on the large rink and I like their chemistry (most Russian players play on the national team annually, unlike Canada or USA).

Same can be said for Sweden. Realistically I am putting us in terms of talent and skill with Finland and Slovakia, though we probably have a bit more depth.

With all of this said, we cannot expect to throw out our 12 best forwards and our 6 best defenceman and expect to go very far in this tournament. We have a list of talented and smart players, now from that list we have to make sure we dabble in the areas of specialists and role players.

For example, Callahan was brought into 2010 roster because of his intangibles. His ability to defend, block shots, forecheck, backcheck. He is a specialist. Drury too, faceoff winner, knows how to play in the crease. Kind of what Malone was brought in for, also to add size. A few things like this. There were "better" hockey players on the team, but none could bring to the table what we truly needed.

So expect a few crazy names to be thrown in there.
I can see Justin Abelkader making the cut. A guy who can play on both top 6 and bottom. Grinder, rough style. Athletic.

Same can be said for Brandon Saad.

Honestly, I dont see guys like JVR or Blake Wheeler making the team. They are better offensively than many of the guys on the list but what use could they be on the bottom 6 if they dont make the top 6. And frankly, i see a lot of good top 6 guys we have. There replaceable with guys who can be used on the PK or in final minutes of a game, or in the defensive zone usage.

 

[AmericanDream]

I truly believe in Burke's ideology for selecting this team. Ive said it many times and do not think people have really realized that its what led us to success in 2010.

Look at Canada's potential roster. From head to toe they are filled with overall great and really good players. We cannot stand toe to toe with them and expect to match up. I look at Russia's team and even there roster is probably better in many areas, but I overall like their style on the large rink and I like their chemistry (most Russian players play on the national team annually, unlike Canada or USA).

Same can be said for Sweden. Realistically I am putting us in terms of talent and skill with Finland and Slovakia, though we probably have a bit more depth.

With all of this said, we cannot expect to throw out our 12 best forwards and our 6 best defenceman and expect to go very far in this tournament. We have a list of talented and smart players, now from that list we have to make sure we dabble in the areas of specialists and role players.

For example, Callahan was brought into 2010 roster because of his intangibles. His ability to defend, block shots, forecheck, backcheck. He is a specialist. Drury too, faceoff winner, knows how to play in the crease. Kind of what Malone was brought in for, also to add size. A few things like this. There were "better" hockey players on the team, but none could bring to the table what we truly needed.

So expect a few crazy names to be thrown in there.
I can see Justin Abelkader making the cut. A guy who can play on both top 6 and bottom. Grinder, rough style. Athletic.

Same can be said for Brandon Saad.

Honestly, I dont see guys like JVR or Blake Wheeler making the team. They are better offensively than many of the guys on the list but what use could they be on the bottom 6 if they dont make the top 6. And frankly, i see a lot of good top 6 guys we have. There replaceable with guys who can be used on the PK or in final minutes of a game, or in the defensive zone usage.

you lost me once you said we are on the same talent level as Finland and Slovakia

I simply do not get this massive underrating of the talent level the US can throw out there.

Overall best group of goalies

a defensive group right on par pound for pound with Canada

a top 12 rivaled only by Canada..

again, overall from top down, the only country better than us skill and talent wise is Canada.

Russia is nowhere near the US in overall skill...and by overall I mean 23 man roster not just the top 6 forwards.

Canada
USA
Russia
Sweden

that is how these teams should be ranked on OVERALL talent. We will see how things shake up on international ice, but that is a different argument altogether.

 

[BlueDream]

Ah good to see Pens fans have changed their tune on Martin. Last year he was apparently terrible and they tried trading him to every team in the league on this site.

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

Don't know why, but this made me laugh incessantly.

The whole video gets me more than it should. Ballard is also quite good in it.

 

[Rocket of Russia]

I simply do not get this massive underrating of the talent level the US can throw out there.

Overall best group of goalies

a defensive group right on par pound for pound with Canada

a top 12 rivaled only by Canada..

again, overall from top down, the only country better than us skill and talent wise is Canada.

Canada
USA
Russia
Sweden

that is how these teams should be ranked on OVERALL talent. We will see how things shake up on international ice, but that is a different argument altogether.

I’m with ya there. The “sexy†that comes with having Crosby, Giroux, Tavares, Stamkos is pretty undeniable. Without a doubt that’s talent that’s going to be unmatched. The same can be said for a defense that boasts Weber, Keith, Letang, Pietrangelo, Subban, and Doughty (that’s the list of who’s who franchise defensemen outside of Suter). But as has been shown in years past, throwing the talent together isn’t going to guarantee wins.

USA can “compete†in the sexy category with Kane, Ryan, Kessel, but players like Kesler, Callahan, Parise, Brown, Backes…all of them are hard as **** to play against, and will give any group of forwards or defensemen – regardless of talent level – extreme fits. Suter, McDonagh, Yandle, Martin, and any mixture of Shattenkirk, Bogosian, J. Johnson, E. Johnson, or Byfuglien will be pretty tough to play against as well.

Finally take into account arguably the most important position and the Americans are the clear favorites in this category, as Quick and Lundqvist are head and shoulders above the rest, and in my opinion Quick has been in a league of his own for 2 seasons now.

Team USA has just the right mix to present all kinds of problems for every team they face. A confident defensive core being backstopped by the best goalie in the league is just what the tight-checking and aggressive forecheckers need to get to their game and keep the puck away from Canada’s elite offensive talent.

Ah good to see Pens fans have changed their tune on Martin. Last year he was apparently terrible and they tried trading him to every team in the league on this site.

Wouldn’t you agree Paul Martin 2011-2012 is night and day of the Paul Martin you saw in 2012-2013?

 

[RussianRifle27]

Goligoski should have been considered for his puck moving ability.

 

[buddahsmoka1]

you lost me once you said we are on the same talent level as Finland and Slovakia

I simply do not get this massive underrating of the talent level the US can throw out there.

Overall best group of goalies

a defensive group right on par pound for pound with Canada

a top 12 rivaled only by Canada..

again, overall from top down, the only country better than us skill and talent wise is Canada.

Russia is nowhere near the US in overall skill...and by overall I mean 23 man roster not just the top 6 forwards.

Canada
USA
Russia
Sweden

that is how these teams should be ranked on OVERALL talent. We will see how things shake up on international ice, but that is a different argument altogether.

I don't really disagree with anything you said except the bold. USA's defensive depth is not on par with Canada.

 

[Engebretson]

I wouldn't be surprised to see one of Jones or Trouba makes it as an extra defensemen. I can see there will be a surprise or two for who makes the final roster.

The whole video gets me more than it should. Ballard is also quite good in it.

Love this video.

My favorite part is Ballard talking about how his dad wants a Nate Schmidt jersey for Christmas because it's his all-time favorite Gopher defensemen.

Martin: Makes sense.

 

[Var]

Parise-Kesler-Kane
Ryan-Pavelski-Kessel
Pacioretty-Backes-Brown
TJ Oshie-Stepan-Wheeler
Callahan+Stastny

Suter-Shattenkirk
McDonagh-Carlson
J Johnson-The Buff
Yandle

Anderson
Quick
Schneider

 

[xxxx]

you lost me once you said we are on the same talent level as Finland and Slovakia

I simply do not get this massive underrating of the talent level the US can throw out there.

Overall best group of goalies

a defensive group right on par pound for pound with Canada

a top 12 rivaled only by Canada..

again, overall from top down, the only country better than us skill and talent wise is Canada.

Russia is nowhere near the US in overall skill...and by overall I mean 23 man roster not just the top 6 forwards.

Canada
USA
Russia
Sweden

that is how these teams should be ranked on OVERALL talent. We will see how things shake up on international ice, but that is a different argument altogether.

I totally agree with you.

TOP teams at goaltending:

1. Finland
2. USA
3. Sweden
4. Canada
5. Russia
6. Slovakia, Switzerland, Czech republic

TOP teams at D:

1. Canada
2. USA
3. Sweden
4. Russia
5. Slovakia (Chara, Sekera and Visnovsky are the difference for me)
6. Switzerland (Streit, Vauclair, Josi, Y.Weber..)
7. Czech republic and Finland

TOP teams at TOP 6 forwards

1. Canada
2. Russia
3. USA
4. Sweden
5. Czech republic
6. Slovakia
7. Finland
8. Switzerland

TOP teams at bottom 6

1. Canada
2. USA
3. Sweden
4. Russia
5. Czech republic
6. Finland / Slovakia
7. Switzerland


OVERALL:

1. Canada
2. USA
3. Sweden
4. Russia
5. Finland / Czech rep. / Slovakia
6. Switzerland

This is not 2006 anymore. If at least one NA team doesn't make the semis, I will admit that the big ice is a different universe and we can't play on it. But believe me, I bet all my money one NA team will battle for a gold.

 

[WilliamNylander]

Parise-Statsny-Kane
Ryan-Kesler-Kessel
Pacioretty-Pavelski-JVR
Brown-backes-Callahan

Suter-Shattenkirk
Gardiner-McDonaugh
Orpik-Martin

Quick
Schneider
Miller


Really hope gardiner makes the team. He would really shine on that big ice

 

[Thesensation19*]

Parise-Statsny-Kane
Ryan-Kesler-Kessel
Pacioretty-Pavelski-JVR
Brown-backes-Callahan

Suter-Shattenkirk
Gardiner-McDonaugh
Orpik-Martin

Quick
Schneider
Miller


Really hope gardiner makes the team. He would really shine on that big ice

Was it tough leaving out Stepan who scored more points than any US center, and I believe #2 or #3 player this year

 

[AmericanDream]

I don't really disagree with anything you said except the bold. USA's defensive depth is not on par with Canada.

on international ice, I really do believe it will be.

 

[Thesensation19*]

Parise-Kesler-Kane
Ryan-Pavelski-Kessel
Pacioretty-Backes-Brown
TJ Oshie-Stepan-Wheeler
Callahan+Stastny

Suter-Shattenkirk
McDonagh-Carlson
J Johnson-The Buff
Yandle

Anderson
Quick
Schneider

This is exactly what I am talking about... Why have Wheeler and Oshie on the 4th line. Those bottom lines, at least the 4th line, will be expected to do more than just attack attack and attack. Wheeler and TJ Oshie are not the most notable guys when it comes to doing other things than play offense.

And your leaving Cally off?
The guy is probably the best Penalty Killer on this roster. I guess your hoping to use a lot of Brown, kesler, Stepan and Backes then on the defensive side of the things. It be a shame to not have more defensive wingers. Tisk tisk.

Do you really think Byf is going to make the team on olympic ice. His big body suits him well in small rink, but bigger ice will be a huge thing not ti overlook

 

[nwaZ*]

How do you guys feel about Bylsma coaching the team? He's been awful in the playoffs lately.

 

[magic school bus]

How do you guys feel about Bylsma coaching the team? He's been awful in the playoffs lately.

Not worried at all. Swap Fleury for Quick and the Penguins win the Cup.