League News: 2014-15 Around the League Thread

[BobRouse]

You weren't talking about who is the superior player. You were talking about players who better than they are playing on a strong team with sheltered minutes.

I sincerely doubt we see Niskanen produce points in line with his last season and it remains to be seen how he is going to handle the switch from 17 ES minutes/game (4th on Pittsburgh's D) to 20+ ES minutes/game against what will likely be tougher matchups.

Niskanen wasn't playing sheltered minutes last year where as guys like Pothier, Leddy and Boychuk were in those situations.

He's playing on the 2nd pairing with Alzner here.

I imagine once Green/Orlov return there won't be a chance any of our dmen get those kind of ES minutes!

 

[Hivemind]

Jackets sign RyJo. 3 years.

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

Niskanen wasn't playing sheltered minutes last year where as guys like Pothier, Leddy and Boychuk were in those situations.

He's playing on the 2nd pairing with Alzner here.

I imagine once Green/Orlov return there won't be a chance any of our dmen get those kind of ES minutes!

Niskanen played just 17:35/game at ES last year and :42/game SH. Again, he was 4th in ESTOI/G in Pittsburgh.

Boychuk played 17:58 (2nd on Boston) at ES and 2:54 SH.

Who played the sheltered minutes?

I can see Niskanen playing a very large amount of ES this year because he's not going to get time on the PP and he's not going to get a lot of time SH.

 

[txpd]

BCF, sounds to me like you are arguing two different things with BR. A puck moving defenseman may not be sheltered while not being a primary pk player because that's not his job. Boychuk average 0:18 of PP. BTW..Boychuk was 3rd in average ES TOI behind Chara at 19:02 and Seidenberg at 18:59.

A quick check and Niskanen's "sheltered" 4th in es ice was 17:35 and the team leader was 18:46. Letang and Orpik averaged less then one minute more. so....Niskanen was closer to 2nd in es ice than Boychuk was.

Boychuk and Niskanen play different positions. Would you rather have Boychuk than Orpik? that's apples to apples

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

BCF, sounds to me like you are arguing two different things with BR. A puck moving defenseman may not be sheltered while not being a primary pk player because that's not his job. Boychuk average 0:18 of PP.

The entire point is that is Niskanen an effective puck moving dman or not? Is he the player who averaged 24 points/season for 6 years or the player who hit 42 in a 250 goal offense in a contract year? i.e. a product of his system getting the benefit of sheltered minutes and boucoup PP time.

Would you rather have Boychuk than Orpik? that's apples to apples

Absolutely.

 

[txpd]

I guess we will find out. Trotz and Bmac wanted Orpik as much for the man as for his game. Boychuk is not the same thing. So, what you want and what the caps want are two different things.

As for Niskanen, there is no way to know if he was a flash in the pan or a player that finally got his chance and took advantage of it and stepped up his game. This is where professional judgement comes into play.

 

[strungout]

Absolutely.

Really?

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

I guess we will find out. Trotz and Bmac wanted Orpik as much for the man as for his game. Boychuk is not the same thing. So, what you want and what the caps want are two different things.

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Boychuk is a very physical, very large defenseman. He is also a playoff warrior. He's basically 2009 Brooks Orpik.

 

[txpd]

if you are in the orpik is over the hill already club then I think its easy to think boychuk is a better player and all the rest is overrated

 

[Halpysback*]

Really?

Better offensively (passing + monster slapshot). Boychuk possesses an offensive game Orpik simply does not have and never had.

Better positionally

Hasn't been on a steady decline the last 3 years, has been a playoff monster in the meantime and in fact getting better every year.

It's not even a contest if you watch both players.

 

[txpd]

I'm not quite sure what you mean. Boychuk is a very physical, very large defenseman. He is also a playoff warrior. He's basically 2009 Brooks Orpik.

except he is not. Orpik was the lead defenseman. The lead hold the lead defenseman on that cup team. he was the leader. Boychuk was not even close.
Chara was

 

[BrooklynCapsFan]

except he is not. Orpik was the lead defenseman. The lead hold the lead defenseman on that cup team. he was the leader. Boychuk was not even close.
Chara was

Scuderi and Gonchar were much bigger parts of Pittsburgh's cup.

 

[txpd]

Better offensively (passing + monster slapshot). Boychuk possesses an offensive game Orpik simply does not have and never had.

Better positionally

Hasn't been on a steady decline the last 3 years, has been a playoff monster in the meantime and in fact getting better every year.

It's not even a contest if you watch both players.

he sounds great!!! 2nd round picks and a 3rd. on average no nhl players in those pics. He sure brought home a lot

 

[Halpysback*]

he sounds great!!! 2nd round picks and a 3rd. on average no nhl players in those pics. He sure brought home a lot

Seidenberg and Ehrhoff also went for scraps. But you make a valid point, we should run along and sign Scott Gomez for league max since OMG HE BROUGHT BACK RYAN MCDONAUGH!!!!

 

[Halpysback*]

Whitney looks like a great PMD in Pittsburgh, gets traded for king's ransom, promptly bombs.

Googleearthski looks like a great PMD in Pittsburgh, gets traded for king's ransom, promptly bombs.

Niskanen looks like waiver wire fodder in Dallas, gets sent to Pittsburgh, looks like an above average PMD for a total of one season, gets signed for king's ransom... I'm sure it'll work out.

 

[Halpysback*]

Scuderi and Gonchar were much bigger parts of Pittsburgh's cup.

But Orpik hit 3 guys in 10 seconds that one time 6 years ago!

 

[txpd]

Seidenberg and Ehrhoff also went for scraps. But you make a valid point, we should run along and sign Scott Gomez for league max since OMG HE BROUGHT BACK RYAN MCDONAUGH!!!!

I don't think Seidenberg was that well thought of when he was traded. Ehrhoff only asked for scraps. Not the same.

But as long as we are on the subject. Are you saying that Bmac should have held out and hoped to get Boychuk and passed on Orpik and Stralman and crossed his fingers?

 

[Ajax1995]

Niskanen played just 17:35/game at ES last year and :42/game SH. Again, he was 4th in ESTOI/G in Pittsburgh.

Sure but 2 of those guys with more ESTOI/G missed over half the season each. He played more ES minutes than anyone on that defense and more than anyone on the Caps' defense besides Carlson last season and he thrived.

Could that have been a contract year fluke? Sure but he certainly didn't get it done playing sheltered minutes.

 

[Halpysback*]

I don't think Seidenberg was that well thought of when he was traded. Ehrhoff only asked for scraps. Not the same.

But as long as we are on the subject. Are you saying that Bmac should have held out and hoped to get Boychuk and passed on Orpik and Stralman and crossed his fingers?

I was talking Ehrhoff to Vancouver for Patrick White. Another salary cap clearing deal. Seidenberg was thought of highly enough to be traded for by Boston and then resigned long term despite only playing a few games before going down with injuries. He played at a high all around level that was unmistakeable even in Florida.

Stralman would have at least been better than Niskanen. Orpik should have been passed on in favor of Mitchell who only took a 2 year contract and looked better last year on a cup winning team. I'd have taken Fayne over Niskanen as well for what he got.

 

[Ajax1995]

Scuderi and Gonchar were much bigger parts of Pittsburgh's cup.

Not that something that happened 5 seasons ago is incredibly relevant to today but Orpik played the most ES minutes total and per game that playoff season for the Pens and he did the same the season before when they went to the finals. He clearly was a key piece of their glory years.

 

[Ajax1995]

Googleearthski looks like a great PMD in Pittsburgh, gets traded for king's ransom, promptly bombs.

I'm going to assume you haven't watch many Stars games recently. Goligoski was pretty darn good in all situations last year while helping lead them back to the playoffs in a tough western conference. Sure his team hasn't been very good before last season but he has more then held his own. To say he has bombed is absurd.

 

[Hivemind]

I'm going to assume you haven't watch many Stars games recently. Goligoski was pretty darn good in all situations last year while helping lead them back to the playoffs in a tough western conference. Sure his team hasn't been very good before last season but he has more then held his own. To say he has bombed is absurd.

He was pretty awful leading up to last year, though. He turned it around at the same time as the rest of the team.

 

[Ajax1995]

He was pretty awful leading up to last year, though. He turned it around at the same time as the rest of the team.

He's lead the team in ice time since he got there and has never been a minus player. How awful could he have been? Yes the team hasn't been great but he's been ok. He didn't turn it around IMO, he's been the same guy, the team around him got better so everyone who has been there looks better as a result. i don't care who you are if your team is pretty darn bad you can only look so good.

 

[SimplySensational]

Adam Vingan @AdamVingan
The Rangers have acquired former #Caps first-line winger Joey Crabb from the Panthers. Long live "Crabby Patti."

I really do not miss Oates or Hunter.

 

[Carlzner]

Absolutely.

Would you rather have Boychuk or Orpik along with 3 draft picks that could be used to acquire a 2C if needed later in the season?