Value of: 1st Round Carolina Pick For A Center

[Pietrangelo]

Biggest myth ever.

The Sens contended in 03, 06, 07, and 2017 amongst other years, all Melnyk years.

They made the right move and traded Karlsson for which they received a shit ton, for an aging and often injured player.

A lot of players don't want to play in Ottawa. That doesn't equate to Melnyk being cheap. He was cheap with a declining asset.

You yourself even admitted that they do spend big money on players long term like Chabot, who is easily better than any defenseman on the Habs.

Even if Ottawa is doomed for years, at least when they tank and receive a valuable pick as a result they don't let it walk for a late first and a third.

There’s about 3 defenseman on the habs I’d take on any team over Chabot.

It’s funny on this forum how a few weeks ago Kotkaneimi wasn’t worth a high 2nd/late 1st. Now all of a sudden Montreal would be getting fleeced if they let him go for a 1st and a 3rd. It’s amazing how much the narrative changes when it’s attempted at making Montreal look bad.

As for Ottawa, they’ve had 1 half decent season in the last 15 years where they lost in the conference finals. Let me guess, you still riding Heatly for that 50 goal season? Lmao.

What’s the new name going to be when Tkachuk leaves in the next few seasons?

 

[TkachukNorrisFacts]

There’s about 3 defenseman on the habs I’d take on any team over Chabot.

It’s funny on this forum how a few weeks ago Kotkaneimi wasn’t worth a high 2nd/late 1st. Now all of a sudden Montreal would be getting fleeced if they let him go for a 1st and a 3rd. It’s amazing how much the narrative changes when it’s attempted at making Montreal look bad.

As for Ottawa, they’ve had 1 half decent season in the last 15 years where they lost in the conference finals. Let me guess, you still riding Heatly for that 50 goal season? Lmao.

What’s the new name going to be when Tkachuk leaves in the next few seasons?

Well nobody would have selected KK with that 3rd overall, that much is true, but you're also not supposed to be alright with letting a 3rd overall pick walk 4 years later for a late first.

People were only saying that because they knew Montreal made a bad pick with that selection and nobody really wanted him for more. They weren't actually saying that they'd be alright with drafting someone that high and losing him 4 years later.

 

[JoeMc]

Why are the Canes looking for a C anyway? They have Aho, Trocheck, Staal, look pretty good to me.

 

[ole ole]

Monahan probably

Deal. Habs will even throw in the Canes 3rd pick to boot.

 

[Captain97]

Crazy how Kotkaniemi can go from untradeable a few months ago to being a traitor and only worth a late first and a 3rd as a 3rd overall pick who “just turned 21”

I'm one of KK's biggest fans on the Habs boards so this narrative is certainly overblown. Most Habs fans have had him topping out as a 2C for a little while now.

That being said the 6.1 million dollar qualifying offer next year and the fact the Habs would lose another roster player to keep him this year are huge negatives. Then you have to consider what does Suzuki ask for next year.

Taking the compensation and adding to it trying to pick up another 2C may be the best decision given what has transpired.

 

[Captain97]

Why are the Canes looking for a C anyway? They have Aho, Trocheck, Staal, look pretty good to me.

KK and Trochek can play wing aswell, with Trochek being a UFA next year KK could be their long term 2C behind Aho.

To me this says they think Necas is a winger long term though.

 

[Tarmore]

Why are the Canes looking for a C anyway? They have Aho, Trocheck, Staal, look pretty good to me.

History, just history

 

[Akrapovince]

Is it just me that thinks Montreal finds themselves in a pretty good position here?

If they match & KK turns into a superstar, they look like geniuses.

If they don’t match & KK turns into a superstar, their hands were tied and got some capital back

If they don’t match & KK flops they look even better.

 

[Frank Drebin]

what the habs adding? He worth way more than that at TDL.

Carolinas third

 

[Michael HOMERUNing]

Is it just me that thinks Montreal finds themselves in a pretty good position here?

If they match & KK turns into a superstar, they look like geniuses.

If they don’t match & KK turns into a superstar, their hands were tied and got some capital back

If they don’t match & KK flops they look even better.

If Kotkaniemi turns into a superstar in Carolina, Montreal will be the laughingstock of the league. It's not like this guy is some unknown mid round pick. He's 3 years removed from being a top 3 draft pick

 

[kilowatt]

Adrian Kempe?

 

[Akrapovince]

If Kotkaniemi turns into a superstar in Carolina, Montreal will be the laughingstock of the league. It's not like this guy is some unknown mid round pick. He's 3 years removed from being a top 3 draft pick

Right or wrong, organizations move on from top prospects all the time before they emerge into superstars.

Atleast in this particular situation, Montreal have their hands tied with a predatory offer sheet, and a return that is probably valued at more than the current player.

 

[BatVader]

Copp for 1st + Joel Armia

 

[CraigsList]

I think Monahan could be available.

He and Toffoli are buddies. Habs would need to move either Byron or Drouin though.

 

[glenbuis]

Copp for 1st + Joel Armia

1 year of copp for four years of armia and a first ? not very likely

 

[glenbuis]

I think Monahan could be available.

He and Toffoli are buddies. Habs would need to move either Byron or Drouin though.

i don't see calgary having interest in byron or drouin . i think there was a story of anderson plus for monohan. a small plus mind you .

 

[Mats26]

Is it just me that thinks Montreal finds themselves in a pretty good position here?

If they match & KK turns into a superstar, they look like geniuses.

If they don’t match & KK turns into a superstar, their hands were tied and got some capital back

If they don’t match & KK flops they look even better.

If they match & KK turns into a superstar, they look like geniuses.
He will never be the star player on the Habs, that would be Suzuki. You give your 2C 6.1 what do you pay Suzuki next year 7+ million a year? What cap space will you have to pay that and Caulfield the year after?

If they don’t match & KK turns into a superstar, their hands were tied and got some capital back
Hugh win for Carolina. If KK plays well and Canes go deep what does a 25-30 pick get you? Well see in 4+ years I guess.

If they don’t match & KK flops they look even better
Best case scenario but it also depends what they do with the 1st and 3rd. all 3 assets could bust...who knows.

 

[Vinny1983]

I'll second that Montreal could be the third team in a Eichel to Calgary deal sending Monahan to Montreal. What would Montreal add to Carolina's 1st for Monahan?

carolina’s third

 

[Vinny1983]

Biggest myth ever.

The Sens contended in 03, 06, 07, and 2017 amongst other years, all Melnyk years.

They made the right move and traded Karlsson for which they received a shit ton, for an aging and often injured player.

A lot of players don't want to play in Ottawa. That doesn't equate to Melnyk being cheap. He was cheap with a declining asset.

You yourself even admitted that they do spend big money on players long term like Chabot, who is easily better than any defenseman on the Habs.

Even if Ottawa is doomed for years, at least when they tank and receive a valuable pick as a result they don't let it walk for a late first and a third.

They maybe don’t “let them walk” but they don’t exactly manage their valuable picks any better..

Zibanejad (6th OA) + 2nd round pick for Derick Brassard

Your hard on for the habs is sad and hilarious at the same time. I guess when your team is so pathetic you need to take a dump on another team to feel better

 

[Tripod]

Is it just me that thinks Montreal finds themselves in a pretty good position here?

If they match & KK turns into a superstar, they look like geniuses.

If they don’t match & KK turns into a superstar, their hands were tied and got some capital back

If they don’t match & KK flops they look even better.

And what about option 4 that you ignored?

If they match, and KK flops.

None of these are a position the Habs width to have. They could have traded him for a mid to late first anytime....but now are forced to lose him for that, or overpay him. Not good options at all.

 

[untouchable21]

What a day to be alive! Haha first post so here goes….. let KK go for the picks. I would actually look at Wii open and offer both picks with Romanov for Dubois. 1 year left at 5M and RFA. His production has been around drouins production with only one year passing 50 pts with Panarin as his winger.

to then address the D, why not OS Quinn? Van is in Cap hell and can’t offer market value to both him and Pettersen…..

Thoughts?

Jets are competing now and Dubois is a big part of that. They don’t need more defensemen and that 1st and 3rd do nothing for them right now.

 

[Aurinko]

If they match & KK turns into a superstar, they look like geniuses.
He will never be the star player on the Habs, that would be Suzuki. You give your 2C 6.1 what do you pay Suzuki next year 7+ million a year? What cap space will you have to pay that and Caulfield the year after?

If they don’t match & KK turns into a superstar, their hands were tied and got some capital back
Hugh win for Carolina. If KK plays well and Canes go deep what does a 25-30 pick get you? Well see in 4+ years I guess.

If they don’t match & KK flops they look even better
Best case scenario but it also depends what they do with the 1st and 3rd. all 3 assets could bust...who knows.

And what about option 4 that you ignored?

If they match, and KK flops.

None of these are a position the Habs width to have. They could have traded him for a mid to late first anytime....but now are forced to lose him for that, or overpay him. Not good options at all.

If they match, it doesn't matter if KK flops or not, since they would still have cap tied for the next two years and possibly skyrocket Suzuki's contract value. Would be amazing offseason content, but I don't think matching the deal is worth the risk for Habs.

 

[AhosDatsyukian]

It sounds like he doesn't want to be in Montreal, to begin with. Signing a contract with such an obvious barb as the $20 signing bonus is just flipping the bird at the Habs. If he wanted to be able to come back, he should have insisted that clause be scratched.

Furthermore, what you trade is the contract as much as the player. Kotkaniemi on a favouralbe contract has more value. Kotkaniemi on an inflated contract has less value. The deal he signed makes him less valuable in a trade.

The deal he signed literally makes him impossible to trade. Neither the Canes or Canadiens can trade him on this deal. So the deal is actually irrelevant to any trade. The $6M this year has a built in acquisition cost (to make it so that MTL has to think long and hard about matching the offer), I'd be absolutely shocked if subsequent years are even close to $6M barring him completely breaking out this year for 60-70+ points on our top line or something. Yes he would have a QO of $6M after this season, but I think it's clear to everyone that neither the Canes or Habs will give him that (again assuming no breakout season). Then yes he's a UFA and theoretically can get more there than if he was a RFA but it still won't be that high and while he could try to play hardball I can also see him working with the Canes on a reasonable deal since they got him out of MTL.

 

[ManofSteel55]

what center are you gonna get for a late 1st LOL

I would imagine a lot of middle six centres could be available for a 1st.

 

[ManofSteel55]

The deal he signed literally makes him impossible to trade. Neither the Canes or Canadiens can trade him on this deal. So the deal is actually irrelevant to any trade. The $6M this year has a built in acquisition cost (to make it so that MTL has to think long and hard about matching the offer), I'd be absolutely shocked if subsequent years are even close to $6M barring him completely breaking out this year for 60-70+ points on our top line or something. Yes he would have a QO of $6M after this season, but I think it's clear to everyone that neither the Canes or Habs will give him that (again assuming no breakout season). Then yes he's a UFA and theoretically can get more there than if he was a RFA but it still won't be that high and while he could try to play hardball I can also see him working with the Canes on a reasonable deal since they got him out of MTL.

If he wants to be in Carolina, this is a smart signing to get him out. Plus, they could easily have a handshake aggreement for another deal immediately following this one that is for longer term with a smaller cap hit.