18/19 MGMT Thread X: This is the song that never ends, it just goes on and on my friends...

[Fire Benning]

Super pleased with the progression of this team, Benning has done an excellent job, they were supposed to be bottom 5 and now they've shocked the world and are only 7th last. They added a transcendent talent and are on pace for 6 more points. Parade down Robson or Georgia?

 

[MS]

Q: Does it matter to you that your D-man is absolute dog ****? And by dog **** I mean he could very well be the worst player in the NHL.

A: No because I’ve seen him punch a guy once.

Management and I strongly suspect ownership are delusional.

It’s stunning that an NHL GM could think that the easiest player in the NHL to play against is ‘hard to play against’ because he throws a hit every few games.

 

[me2]

Q: Does it matter to you that your D-man is absolute dog ****? And by dog **** I mean he could very well be the worst player in the NHL.

A: No because I’ve seen him punch a guy once.

Management and I strongly suspect ownership are delusional.

Q: "Dose it matter that he gets scored on constantly?"

A: "No, because he intimidates players as they skate around him on their way to scoring on us. It really helps our team."

 

[Jyrki21]

Intangibles is such a pointless argument, it really is:

 

[clunk]

This kinda quote gives me depression.

Speechless

 

[Michael Dal Swolle]

Intangibles is such a pointless argument, it really is:

To be fair, character and leadership matter in other cooperative enterprises and I think they are important in hockey to the point of being undervalued on here. They can also lead to tangible results in ways that aren't readily apparent or measurable.

Unfortunately, they're also the things dinosaur executives harp on because they're buzzwords that sound good that hide the fact that these people have no clue what makes a team good or bad in the modern NHL. Edmonton's management looking at their team with 3 top 6 forwards, no top pairing defencemen, and no goaltending and coming up with "hurr durr leadership" being a pretty good example.

 

[TruKnyte]

Intangibles are supposed to be used when comparing two or more people of about equal value/effectiveness. It won't turn a dog turd into a diamond.

 

[I in the Eye]

Intangibles is the value of residual sludge from Benning trades.

 

[Phenomenon13]

This kinda quote gives me depression.

is this guy reliable? what interview is this from? This quote just shows how out of touch Benning is with reality regarding Gudbranson

 

[PG Canuck]

This kinda quote gives me depression.

Not sure if that's a real answer or not, but the fact I have to even question it could be real is embarrassing.

 

[Jyrki21]

To be fair, character and leadership matter in other cooperative enterprises and I think they are important in hockey to the point of being undervalued on here. They can also lead to tangible results in ways that aren't readily apparent or measurable.

If they aren’t apparent/measurable they aren’t really tangible results, though... In my own non-sports world I would expect employee retention is the most relevant way these things matter, but in the NHL to the point this is important it is also tied to productivity for the most part (e.g. retaining UFAs, team cohesiveness leading to wins, etc.).

I just think something can’t be declared valuable on its own if its positive impact isn’t clear.

 

[tantalum]

Q: "Dose it matter that he gets scored on constantly?"

A: "No, because he intimidates players as they skate around him on their way to scoring on us. It really helps our team."

It's true. Against the Islanders that guy was so intimidated to go all the way around of Gudbranson he just passed the puck instead. Gudbranson...forcing players to take assists instead of goals!

 

[clunk]

I'm just so baffled that a fantastic offensive defenseman who relied on skilled play on the backend in Jim Benning can be so blinded by this stupid toughness narrative (of which Gudbranson doesn't have much) that seemingly covers up all the deficiencies of his game in Jim's eyes and is an excuse to overpay for the guy both in trade value and contract value. ****ing how?

 

[tantalum]

I'm just so baffled that a fantastic offensive defenseman who relied on skilled play on the backend in Jim Benning can be so blinded by this stupid toughness narrative (of which Gudbranson doesn't have much) that seemingly covers up all the deficiencies of his game in Jim's eyes and is an excuse to overpay for the guy both in trade value and contract value. ****ing how?

He's incompetent. I don't even think it's a dinosaur stuck in the past type of thing. Just that he is an idiot and living example of the Dilbert principle. That's it really.

 

[MikeK]

He's incompetent. I don't even think it's a dinosaur stuck in the past type of thing. Just that he is an idiot and living example of the Dilbert principle. That's it really.

Completely agree. It doesn't help that he's surrounded by equally incompetent people. It is unfortunate for fans but Vancouver right now has an amazing ensemble of talented buffoons.

 

[clunk]

He's incompetent. I don't even think it's a dinosaur stuck in the past type of thing. Just that he is an idiot and living example of the Dilbert principle. That's it really.

Then you ask yourself how the **** is someone like that running hockey ops for a 750 million dollar hockey organization?

Does he become an NHL GM if the team he was an assistant GM on doesn't win the cup against us? I honestly think that's the only reason he was so sought after.

Reminds me of the whole Kevin Lowe '7 rings' bragging to justify his incompetence.

 

[Peter10]

Not sure if that's a real answer or not, but the fact I have to even question it could be real is embarrassing.

It is a real answer. Happened last year at the press conference where the Gudbranson extension was announced (or very shortly after)

 

[PG Canuck]

It is a real answer. Happened last year at the press conference where the Gudbranson extension was announced (or very shortly after)

That is very scary.

 

[Peter10]

That is very scary.

Just so there are no more doubts:

Canucks banking on Gudbranson getting better; odds are, he won't

My brain hurts looking at quotes like this:

When Benning was asked whether Gudbranson’s analytics were a concern, he was dismissive.
“No, because I think we need, like, some pushback, some physicality on the backend,” said Benning. “We have to make it hard for… good players to get to the net. Sometimes, you know, the data, the things that don’t show up in the data are important, and I think what Erik brings us is important.”

“I don’t think we’ve seen Guddy at his best,” acknowledged Green once again. “I think in the games that he has played well, I’m guessing those numbers are better. I don’t want him to be a negative all the time, but I think that’s part of the games he has played well, he’s shown us what he can do.”

“I don’t think we’ve seen the absolute best in Guddy’s game,” said Travis Green. “I think he’s a guy that’s still improving and we need to continue to push him to be better. I think we’ve seen some of that this season.”
“I would agree with that,” said Jim Benning in a one-on-one interview with Farhan Lalji of TSN. “Injuries the last couple years, kind of he’d get going and he wasn’t really established in his role that we think he could develop into.”

Gudbranson certainly believes that he has more to give.
“I think [my game] is going to get better. If I shave this beard away, I look a little younger, I might look my age,” said Gudbranson. “I’m still a sponge, like I was when I was 19, 20 years old, trying to pick guy’s brains and use the [veterans] to my advantage. I don’t know what the ceiling is. I don’t think anybody really knows, but I’m just trying to get better every single day and that’s my motivation to be here. Any hockey players motivation is to constantly get better.”

 

[Hansen]

Erik Gudbranson is still only 27 he's a young player just wait until he has more games under his belt and wait for him to be the next Scott Stevens

 

[y2kcanucks]

Intangibles is such a pointless argument, it really is:

Saying you brought in a guy because of his intangibles is code for saying "he's not a good player but he's a good guy so we wanted to bring him in."

 

[Bubbles]

The Canucks are stuck in the biggest long con of the league. Every year for the last 7 years, we have either been crushed in the first round, or missed the playoffs completely. To a normal, rational person, this means we are a classic bubble team, that is not talented enough to compete deep into the playoffs.

So this means every year we are "competing" for a playoff spot, so we never do a proper fire sale or rebuild. Here we are again, at the trade deadline, not entirely sure what to do. With an idiot GM, we're doubly lost. Instead of tanking properly (that year when we were 29th in the league), we strive to be middling. The Canucks have sold us on hope and the masses buy it up every year. They distract you with shiny new toys like Boeser and Petterson but the result is the same.

Middling.

 

[Jyrki21]

Saying you brought in a guy because of his intangibles is code for saying "he's not a good player but he's a good guy so we wanted to bring him in."

100% this. "Our coach had him in junior", "He deflects criticism for a bit", "I haven't watched him play but he was a high draft pick" all somehow sound less convincing than "He's magic and you can't tell because it's invisible magic."

 

[Hockeyphysio]

I mean Intangible qualities may exists (just hard to quantify) but they absolutely needs to translate into some sort of metric of success.

Gudbranson, is the worse player on one of worse teams in the league. Melvin should estimate how many losses he causes us a year.

 

[Bubbles]

Ducks just got a 6th for MDZ...that is grounds for firing right there.