Post-Game Talk: #16 | Flyers at Hurricanes | November 15, 2023 | Win 3-1

[flyersnorth]

Only got to watch the first 2 periods again.

I thought the Canes carried most of the play and disrupted the Flyers entries quite a bit, but the Flyers cashed in on their chances and had their own stretches of really solid play.

Except Couturier's breakaway pass.

Belpedio, Seeler, and Walker making some good contributions on the back end tonight. TK, Tippett, Hart, Atkinson stood out to me.

Honest question - what's the consensus on York? I don't notice him most games - and I don't mean that as a negative, I just don't really hear his name or notice him on the ice very much. Is he playing well and just not generating much offense?

 

[Curufinwe]

Poehling's goal was really nice. Still not seeing anything from him that would make him a better top 9 option than Brink.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Only got to watch the first 2 periods again.

I thought the Canes carried most of the play and disrupted the Flyers entries quite a bit, but the Flyers cashed in on their chances and had their own stretches of really solid play.

Except Couturier's breakaway pass.

Belpedio, Seeler, and Walker making some good contributions on the back end tonight. TK, Tippett, Hart, Atkinson stood out to me.

Honest question - what's the consensus on York? I don't notice him most games - and I don't mean that as a negative, I just don't really hear his name or notice him on the ice very much. Is he playing well and just not generating much offense?

York has been underwhelming.

I thought he looked ready to take a big step up in camp & preseason, but he’s not doing much so far.

There’s more there, but he seems to play in 3rd gear, a bit like Nolan Patrick did.

 

[VladDrag]

I watched the game delayed…I felt like the flyers were lucky to win that game. At times the Hurricanes were just dominant. Almost doubled the flyers in pure shot attempts and tripled them in scoring chances. There were a couple of minutes where the Flyers played well, and they got a couple of quick goals.

A couple of quick positive thoughts:
-Tippett and Frost play well together. Just keep them together.
-First time I really thought Tippett had decent in-zone cycling. I didn’t see that a lot last year…only one game, but I liked it.
-That Frost assist is an exact example of his low-key, but dangerous, play-extending ability. The quick one touch passes move the goalie slightly and didn’t allow him to settle. Combined with Belpedio driving the net, it was an awesome team play.
-Poehling showed some offensive chops early. Made a nice pass and converted the chance he had.
-TK and Couts together was nice

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Nov 15, 23 @ CAR 32 1 .969

Again with the same reason as the start of the season.

Also facing Carolina's AHL goalie and 2 bad Orlov turnovers with TDA to back him up... LOL


But keep thinking this is sustainable.

Nobody claimed that consistently beating Cup contenders on the road is “sustainable.”

Your entire response is an effort to downplay the Flyers accomplishing something good.

Like most of this board, you can’t bring yourself to give the organization credit for ANYTHING.

 

[thedjpd]

I watched the game delayed…I felt like the flyers were lucky to win that game. At times the Hurricanes were just dominant. Almost doubled the flyers in pure shot attempts and tripled them in scoring chances. There were a couple of minutes where the Flyers played well, and they got a couple of quick goals.

A couple of quick positive thoughts:
-Tippett and Frost play well together. Just keep them together.
-First time I really thought Tippett had decent in-zone cycling. I didn’t see that a lot last year…only one game, but I liked it.
-That Frost assist is an exact example of his low-key, but dangerous, play-extending ability. The quick one touch passes move the goalie slightly and didn’t allow him to settle. Combined with Belpedio driving the net, it was an awesome team play.
-Poehling showed some offensive chops early. Made a nice pass and converted the chance he had.
-TK and Couts together was nice

I guess I didn’t see this. Flyers played simple road game, kept Carolina to the outside. I’m starting to feel like Carolina’s home numbers are a bit inflated relative to what I saw.

The stats didn’t match the eye test to me. This wasn’t Carter robbing the Canes - he played very well, but they were also behind the whole game.

 

[BringBackHakstol]

The idea that not controlling the puck and letting the other team have it while keeping them "to the outside and blocking shots" doesn't really hold water to me. Sure, it can work when your team is limited as a means to scrape out some wins, but that's not really a viable approach to being a winner. It's just treading water hockey. Basically Flyers hockey.

 

[dragonoffrost]

Nobody claimed that consistently beating Cup contenders on the road is “sustainable.”

Your entire response is an effort to downplay the Flyers accomplishing something good.

Like most of this board, you can’t bring yourself to give the organization credit for ANYTHING.

Most of the results this season are based on Hart saving their bacon. I am giving Hart credit for playing well... But again you don't want to see it that way because that minimizes LORD TORTS.

Hart is 15th in the league in Goals saved above average when adjusted for score and venue.... and 14th when those factors are removed.

And reverse the situation if Peterson was in that game and gave up the goals that Kochetkov gave up you'd be saying 3rd string goalie hung out by bad turnovers.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Most of the results this season are based on Hart saving their bacon. I am giving Hart credit for playing well... But again you don't want to see it that way because that minimizes LORD TORTS.

Hart is 15th in the league in Goals saved above average when adjusted for score and venue.... and 14th when those factors are removed.

And reverse the situation if Peterson was in that game and gave up the goals that Kochetkov gave up you'd be saying 3rd string goalie hung out by bad turnovers.

Funny.

You diminish the Flyers’ road win vs the 2nd favorite to win the Cup because they had a backup in net.

You diminish the Flyers’ play by pretending Hart is stealing them undeserved wins. (And ironically quote a saves above expected stat that places him middle-of-the-pack for starting.)

And you completely ignore that the Flyers won their previous two games with Ersson & Cal F’ing Peterson in net.

But *I’m* the one refusing to see things because of an alleged Torts bias. Surely it isn’t you desperately trying to avoid giving credit to Torts for ANYTHING.

 

[Ghosts Beer]

The idea that not controlling the puck and letting the other team have it while keeping them "to the outside and blocking shots" doesn't really hold water to me. Sure, it can work when your team is limited as a means to scrape out some wins, but that's not really a viable approach to being a winner. It's just treading water hockey. Basically Flyers hockey.

Am I missing something?

Did you expect the Flyers to own the play on the last game of a 4-game road trip in the building of the 2nd favorite to win the Cup?

If so, please explain.

Am I mistaken that the Flyers entered the game as +1.5 puck underdogs?

 

[BobbyClarkeFan16]

Nobody claimed that consistently beating Cup contenders on the road is “sustainable.”

Your entire response is an effort to downplay the Flyers accomplishing something good.

Like most of this board, you can’t bring yourself to give the organization credit for ANYTHING.

Nah, it's just the same crap year in year out. We're going to 'rebuild' but consistently plays veterans over younger players. We're going to give our young players opportunities, but often scratches young guys because 'sometimes it's good to get a different viewpoint' and don't forget yesterday's pregame press conference where Tortorella nearly has an orgasm because Ristolainen and Staal are ready to return from injury, so we know that means York and Zamula sit so that those two scrubs can get into the lineup.

It's always the same shit, different pile with this club. Commit to what you plan on doing and don't half ass it. They do this all the time. They don't want to take their lumps and instead are content at just squeezing by with playing bottom barrel hockey and neutralizing any of the talent that's in the lineup because the priority is the 'system' and one that has been outdated for 20 years.

That's the problem.

 

[thedjpd]

Most of the results this season are based on Hart saving their bacon. I am giving Hart credit for playing well... But again you don't want to see it that way because that minimizes LORD TORTS.

Hart is 15th in the league in Goals saved above average when adjusted for score and venue.... and 14th when those factors are removed.

And reverse the situation if Peterson was in that game and gave up the goals that Kochetkov gave up you'd be saying 3rd string goalie hung out by bad turnovers.

This is actually flat out wrong. That was the rationale used by the board LAST season. And it was completely true - Hart stood on his head. This season, the Flyers have won the fancy stats battle most games. And lost several games this season (Petersson, for example) because of absolute crap goaltending when the other teams' goalie were robbing them.

 

[thedjpd]

The idea that not controlling the puck and letting the other team have it while keeping them "to the outside and blocking shots" doesn't really hold water to me. Sure, it can work when your team is limited as a means to scrape out some wins, but that's not really a viable approach to being a winner. It's just treading water hockey. Basically Flyers hockey.

Maybe, but that hasn't really been the case this year, has it? I'd probably say 2 or 3 out of 15 games did the Flyers not "control" the puck - even against the better teams, and still ended up losing completely.

The idea that you will dominate every team, every game is the measure of a contender is the real dream land.

Vegas and Dallas were largely outplayed, or at least matched, by these same Flyers earlier this year. But they were commended for "scraping out wins." The Flyers didn't have their best game against a similar and scraped out a win.

Ironically, games last night for this years' Flyers team are more regression to the mean relative to how they've played - will it last? Who knows. But they are actually deserving of a better record than they have.

Also, take a gander through the Carolina board game thread - they are lambasting their players for taking stupid, 50 foot wrist shots that are easily blocked away and unable to generate real chances - sounds like a lot of complaints we had about this team over the recent years. Like I said, I think the Flyers played a good road game. Nothing more, nothing less.

Hart played well, and robbed them a couple of times. Their goalie also robbed us several times. And we robbed ourselves a few. That happens for every team, every game. Because no teams can eliminate opposition chances. There's a reason the goaltender is also a part of the team.

 

[gertbfrobe16]

Same old same old lose when they should win, win when they should lose.

 

[mr4tno]

The idea that not controlling the puck and letting the other team have it while keeping them "to the outside and blocking shots" doesn't really hold water to me. Sure, it can work when your team is limited as a means to scrape out some wins, but that's not really a viable approach to being a winner. It's just treading water hockey. Basically Flyers hockey.

Agreed. Blocking a lot of shots means (1) you expose yourself to injury more than the average player and (2) you do not have the puck a lot

 

[Beef Invictus]

3 straight strong road Ws, the last two against legit Cup contenders.

The wins are starting to pile up.

But they're being outplayed. Getting bailed by goaltending isn't great.

 

[Beef Invictus]

I guess I didn’t see this. Flyers played simple road game, kept Carolina to the outside. I’m starting to feel like Carolina’s home numbers are a bit inflated relative to what I saw.

The stats didn’t match the eye test to me. This wasn’t Carter robbing the Canes - he played very well, but they were also behind the whole game.

Hart absolutely robbed them. But he has that Lundqvist/Price thing when he's on where he makes a lot of hard saves look easy. Which makes it feel like the other team isn't doing as much as they are.

 

[Curufinwe]

1st Star: Hart
2nd: Poehling
3rd: woman in red

 

[VladDrag]

I guess I didn’t see this. Flyers played simple road game, kept Carolina to the outside. I’m starting to feel like Carolina’s home numbers are a bit inflated relative to what I saw.

The stats didn’t match the eye test to me. This wasn’t Carter robbing the Canes - he played very well, but they were also behind the whole game.

You are allowed to have that opinion!

 

[flyersnorth]

The idea that you will dominate every team, every game is the measure of a contender is the real dream land.

Unless you're on a historical regular season run, playoff-bound teams lose somewhere between 20-40 games during the regular season (I'm including OTLs in there because, well, they lost).

Vegas lost 31 games last year, Panthers lost 40.

 

[Flyerfan4life]

The idea that not controlling the puck and letting the other team have it while keeping them "to the outside and blocking shots" doesn't really hold water to me. Sure, it can work when your team is limited as a means to scrape out some wins, but that's not really a viable approach to being a winner. It's just treading water hockey. Basically Flyers hockey.

#safeisdeath..

oh wait...Torts only meant that when he wasnt coaching.

its hilarous now that hes back to coaching that idea is out the window..

 

[thedjpd]

Unless you're on a historical regular season run, playoff-bound teams lose somewhere between 20-40 games during the regular season (I'm including OTLs in there because, well, they lost).

Vegas lost 31 games last year, Panthers lost 40.

And of those, they won many they shouldn't have, and lost many they shouldn't have. The other consistent stat is that if you notice most of these contenders, regardless of the actual capability of their goaltender, their goals save above expected is usually near the top of the league as well.

 

[Flyerfan18]

The idea that not controlling the puck and letting the other team have it while keeping them "to the outside and blocking shots" doesn't really hold water to me. Sure, it can work when your team is limited as a means to scrape out some wins, but that's not really a viable approach to being a winner. It's just treading water hockey. Basically Flyers hockey.

It’s how you play when you’re playing a team like the Canes. Won’t work every night but Torts out coached Brindamour last night. Carolina had no answer to the Flyers style of play.

 

[Beef Invictus]

It’s how you play when you’re playing a team like the Canes. Won’t work every night but Torts out coached Brindamour last night. Carolina had no answer to the Flyers style of play.

Carolina outplayed the Flyers. They had no answer for Hart.

 

[Flyerfan18]

Carolina outplayed the Flyers. They had no answer for Hart.

No. Hart was good but didn’t have to be great. If skating around the outside with the puck all night without creating many scoring chances is outplaying the other team is we can agree to disagree. Couts, Forester and someone else all tried fancy passes when they should have shot. It shouldn’t have been as close as it was. Carolinas defense was brutal.

Sure they moved the puck up the ice but who cares if they cant defend at all. The average fan today has no clue how a defenseman is supposed to play. You can create offense but you better still be able to block shots, hit, defend and just be a plain “mean bastard” when you need to be.