Post-Game Talk: #10 - Flames @ Rangers

[aufheben]

I'm talking about last season.

 

[Mac n Gs]

How is this hard to understand. He is the highest paid position player. That's all the justification anyone needs. They're not paying him 4x kreiders salary to just try harder.

Kreider, as I've said, has been disappointing, but he's still young, cost controllable, and has proven in 3 consecutive postseasons that he is an X factor to the team's success.

Nash doesn't deserve the pay and doesn't show up in post season. That's where the criticism arises from. It is not hate. But justified critiques.

I don't give a **** about his salary at the moment. I care about how he's playing hockey, and for all intents and purposes, he's doing literally everything well except scoring, and there's no chance he sustains such a bad shooting percentage over the course of the regular season.

Kreider is coasting out there, whether it be not taking it to the net in the offensive zone or literally standing still in the defensive zone. I know Chris can play good defense, but as of right now he's just half-assing and going through the motions. Let's shift our focus to the forwards who actually aren't playing well: Kreider, Fast, Miller, Hayes. They're all young guys, who need to wake up and get their **** together.

 

[Beer League Sniper]

I don't give a **** about his salary at the moment. I care about how he's playing hockey, and for all intents and purposes, he's doing literally everything well except scoring, and there's no chance he sustains such a bad shooting percentage over the course of the regular season.

Kreider is coasting out there, whether it be not taking it to the net in the offensive zone or literally standing still in the defensive zone. I know Chris can play good defense, but as of right now he's just half-assing and going through the motions. Let's shift our focus to the forwards who actually aren't playing well: Kreider, Fast, Miller, Hayes. They're all young guys, who need to wake up and get their **** together.

There is if he keeps taking unscreened shots from the top of the circle.

 

[BarbaraAlphanse]

I don't give a **** about his salary at the moment. I care about how he's playing hockey, and for all intents and purposes, he's doing literally everything well except scoring, and there's no chance he sustains such a bad shooting percentage over the course of the regular season.

Kreider is coasting out there, whether it be not taking it to the net in the offensive zone or literally standing still in the defensive zone. I know Chris can play good defense, but as of right now he's just half-assing and going through the motions. Let's shift our focus to the forwards who actually aren't playing well: Kreider, Fast, Miller, Hayes. They're all young guys, who need to wake up and get their **** together.

What do you mean you don't give a **** about his salary???

That's like one of the most critical components in a capped sport. Production that jusifies cap hit. Results oriented compensation, ideally.

Successful teams have both players that earn their contracts and players that exceed the production that is average for their contract point. Dead weight results in lack of team specific results, usually.

You should give a lot of **** about contract. And also, you throwing out one of the main reasons to detract on his performance cause you just don't feel like it also isn't really justifiable. Sorry.

 

[BlueshirtBlitz]

What do you mean you don't give a **** about his salary???

That's like one of the most critical components in a capped sport. Production that jusifies cap hit. Results oriented compensation, ideally.

Successful teams have both players that earn their contracts and players that exceed the production that is average for their contract point. Dead weight results in lack of team specific results, usually.

You should give a lot of **** about contract. And also, you throwing out one of the main reasons to detract on his performance cause you just don't feel like it also isn't really justifiable. Sorry.

He said "at the moment."

This isn't 2009-2011 Chris Drury or Tanner Glass, guys who made more money than they should've who were clearly not helping the team. Nash is playing good hockey for the most part and has a history of putting up lots of regular season goals. The one season he's played more than 70 games, Nash scored 40 goals. 22 goals in the lockout year is pretty damn good, too. If we're at game 30 and he only has 5 goals or something, then we have a problem.

The goals will come. Unless he's cursed to only perform well every other year.

 

[Mac n Gs]

He said "at the moment."

This isn't 2009-2011 Chris Drury or Tanner Glass, guys who made more money than they should've who were clearly not helping the team. Nash is playing good hockey for the most part and has a history of putting up lots of regular season goals. The one season he's played more than 70 games, Nash scored 40 goals. 22 goals in the lockout year is pretty damn good, too. If we're at game 30 and he only has 5 goals or something, then we have a problem.

The goals will come. Unless he's cursed to only perform well every other year.

Thank you. Like I said, he's engaged in his play out there at both ends of the rink. If he keeps playing this way, the goals will come. And by the way, do you know who else only has one goal so far this year? Crosby and Toews.

 

[DanielBrassard]

There is if he keeps taking unscreened shots from the top of the circle.

Hes's top 5 in Scoring Chances.

 

[SA16]

Hes's top 5 in Scoring Chances.

Where do you find stats for scoring chances?

 

[Beer League Sniper]

Hes's top 5 in Scoring Chances.

Scoring chance does not mean it was a good shot, or that he even got a shot off.

I can handle him whiffing on a chance in front of the net. What bothers me is taking a low percentage shot with none of his linemates in position to get a rebound.

 

[CupWindow]

I can't find a shot chart this early in the season but I remember reading the same stuff about Nash in the playoffs, and he was actually shooting from better areas then than in the regular season. A little luck/bad luck changes how people perceive what a player is doing.

This is comical logic.

A few inches here or there helps goalies make more saves too.

A little luck/bad luck is what's separating Hank from other goalies with average numbers?

You need to create your own luck, it doesn't just randomly happen. If the puck isn't "luckily" going in, find another way to put it in the net.

According to your logic Rick Nash had a lucky season last year because he scored a lot of goals and is having an unlucky start to the season because he hasn't scored a lot of goals. That's gross, disgusting logic.

 

[DanielBrassard]

Where do you find stats for scoring chances?

War on Ice.

 

[aufheben]

This is comical logic.

A few inches here or there helps goalies make more saves too.

A little luck/bad luck is what's separating Hank from other goalies with average numbers?

You need to create your own luck, it doesn't just randomly happen. If the puck isn't "luckily" going in, find another way to put it in the net.

According to your logic Rick Nash had a lucky season last year because he scored a lot of goals and is having an unlucky start to the season because he hasn't scored a lot of goals. That's gross, disgusting logic.

I can't believe how foreign the concept of goal scoring streaks are.

 

[Infinitum Vitae*]

I can't believe how foreign the concept of goal scoring streaks are.

If goal scorers weren't streaky they'd all be Gretzky or glass.

 

[Whitehawk1186]

The doom and gloom of this board is comical.

Do we have some issues to work out? Sure we do, but you'd think we were the Columbus Blue Jackets listening to some people on this board. We looked WAY worse at the start last year, and the year before that, and look how that turned out. We are 6-2-2, on pace for 113 points, and that's with our two top scorer's scoring a combined 2 goals so far. Once our offense gets going, we will be a force, but I still expect people to complain that we aren't winning by 3 goals every game. Such is the internet

 

[KingP]

Down 1-0

This team sucks blah blah we need to make major changes

4-1


Wooooo love this team

 

[Levitate]

The doom and gloom of this board is comical.

Do we have some issues to work out? Sure we do, but you'd think we were the Columbus Blue Jackets listening to some people on this board. We looked WAY worse at the start last year, and the year before that, and look how that turned out. We are 6-2-2, on pace for 113 points, and that's with our two top scorer's scoring a combined 2 goals so far. Once our offense gets going, we will be a force, but I still expect people to complain that we aren't winning by 3 goals every game. Such is the internet

Well yeah I'd like to see the defense suppressing shots and moving the puck efficiently out of their own zone and the forwards attacking aggressively and creating shots and scoring opportunities and Hank doing his thing and the Rangers winning easily every game.

In the meantime I'll worry that the defense isn't looking that great (or at least consistent) and the top scorers on this team are not doing their job

 

[Pizza]

Down 1-0

This team sucks blah blah we need to make major changes

4-1


Wooooo love this team

Ha HA!! Pretty much this for the last 10 years.

 

[JHS]

Rangers continue to do just enough to win these types of games. I honestly like this kind of play. It's October mind you. The Rangers don't want to peak in October. The same guys crying lack of effort right now, will be the same ones crying "this team looks tired" come playoff time.

The Rangers are mastering how to win hockey games. They can get away with sub par efforts and still win. We should be happy about that- not blasting the team.

Let's peak in May and June, with a less worn down, less injured( although injuries are not as avoidable) team.

 

[FLYLine27*]

Not enough talk of Hayes' magical behind the back pass from behind the goal line directly onto Lindberg's stick which tied the game up..

 

[Whitehawk1186]

Well yeah I'd like to see the defense suppressing shots and moving the puck efficiently out of their own zone and the forwards attacking aggressively and creating shots and scoring opportunities and Hank doing his thing and the Rangers winning easily every game.

In the meantime I'll worry that the defense isn't looking that great (or at least consistent) and the top scorers on this team are not doing their job

I just honestly don't know what there really is to worry about so early in the season. Nash and Kreider will find their scoring touch. Getzlaf and Perry have 0 goals and 2 assists COMBINED; that's not gonna last either. Some players start a year slow. The defense will eventually find their game as well; they are too talented not too. Will we win the Cup? Nobody knows that, but I do know we will be in the playoffs (barring major injuries) and that's all that matters during the Regular Season.

 

[Revel]

I'm generally an optimistic guy, and still am. I think we'll easily make he playoffs - no doubt.

BUT...

What I'm concerned about is how we perform come Playoff time. That's when the cream needs to rise, and I'm not so sure the Rangers possess the required levity to go all the way.

We were fortunate enough to draw a half-assed Pitt team in the first round, barely won a war of attrition against the Caps (that included a late Kreider goal to stay alive), and then lost to Tampa by being shut out in both Games 5 & 7. Most of the games we won in the Playoffs were by a single goal.

Fast forward to the new season, and I'm not feeling like we've taken the next step, even though it may be too early to tell. Our number 1 goal scorer from last season pretty much has not scored. Kreider looks uninvolved. Hayes hasn't made the leap we'd hoped for. Brassard is out to lunch half the time. Two-thirds of our Defense is scrambling for a clue. Our Power Play still sucks.

The main bright spot is Goaltending, which is no different from last season. Our Goaltending continues to be great, and for that I'm thankful. Hank is actually better at the start of this season than he historically is. If it weren't for his uncustomary hot start, we'd be a bit worse off. The other bright spot is Lindberg. He is this season's equal to what Kevin Hayes surprisingly brought to the Rangers last season.

Where would we be without Lindberg's hot stick, our Goaltending, and the luck we've had thus far?

By luck, I'm talking about the dirty goals we've been scoring. Yes, they all count the same, but Good Lord! The majority of our goals are not exactly highlight reel goals. Look at last game for example. Lindberg fanned on his shot, which threw off Hiller - so we score. Girardi's goal deflected off Hiller' angled stick and into the net. Klein's goal needed a VERY fortuitous bounce. The only goal that showed any skill was Brassard's goal. Brassard and Zuuc are the only guys that can really snipe a corner on this team. I know J.T. has that kind of shot, too - but he has not been getting the looks to unleash it.

I'll watch the top 50 plays on NHL network and see goal after goal that show amazing agility and shot-making. Snipes and sick dekes abound. The Rangers are generally represented by Hank on Top-Play countdowns, lol.

As much as I love watching and following our team, I'm feeling we are missing that one element. Shot-making/sniping - whatever you want to call it. At this rate, I can see us going out the same way we did last year. Very painfully after fighting very hard.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I'm generally an optimistic guy, and still am. I think we'll easily make he playoffs - no doubt.

BUT...

What I'm concerned about is how we perform come Playoff time. That's when the cream needs to rise, and I'm not so sure the Rangers possess the required levity to go all the way.

We were fortunate enough to draw a half-assed Pitt team in the first round, barely won a war of attrition against the Caps (that included a late Kreider goal to stay alive), and then lost to Tampa by being shut out in both Games 5 & 7. Most of the games we won in the Playoffs were by a single goal.

Fast forward to the new season, and I'm not feeling like we've taken the next step, even though it may be too early to tell. Our number 1 goal scorer from last season pretty much has not scored. Kreider looks uninvolved. Hayes hasn't made the leap we'd hoped for. Brassard is out to lunch half the time. Two-thirds of our Defense is scrambling for a clue. Our Power Play still sucks.

The main bright spot is Goaltending, which is no different from last season. Our Goaltending continues to be great, and for that I'm thankful. Hank is actually better at the start of this season than he historically is. If it weren't for his uncustomary hot start, we'd be a bit worse off. The other bright spot is Lindberg. He is this season's equal to what Kevin Hayes surprisingly brought to the Rangers last season.

Where would we be without Lindberg's hot stick, our Goaltending, and the luck we've had thus far?

By luck, I'm talking about the dirty goals we've been scoring. Yes, they all count the same, but Good Lord! The majority of our goals are not exactly highlight reel goals. Look at last game for example. Lindberg fanned on his shot, which threw off Hiller - so we score. Girardi's goal deflected off Hiller' angled stick and into the net. Klein's goal needed a VERY fortuitous bounce. The only goal that showed any skill was Brassard's goal. Brassard and Zuuc are the only guys that can really snipe a corner on this team. I know J.T. has that kind of shot, too - but he has not been getting the looks to unleash it.

I'll watch the top 50 plays on NHL network and see goal after goal that show amazing agility and shot-making. Snipes and sick dekes abound. The Rangers are generally represented by Hank on Top-Play countdowns, lol.

As much as I love watching and following our team, I'm feeling we are missing that one element. Shot-making/sniping - whatever you want to call it. At this rate, I can see us going out the same way we did last year. Very painfully after fighting very hard.

This line of thinking is crazy flawed.

This team got to game 7 of the conference finals with out a single healthy defenseman (remember Boyle got his bell rung pretty good on a dirty hit by Orpik the previous round) and with out arguably their 2nd most valuable forward for 2 full rounds. If there is one thing that I do not question about this group, its their ability to rise to the occasion. Washington is/was a very good team, one who would have wiped the floor with Tampa had they gotten by us. To take them out with out Zuccarello is no small feat, that took a ton of moxie.


You may eventually be right about this team not taking the "next step" this season but honestly, its way too early to tell. If we're going to make generalizations before we're even 10 games into the season, we might as well hand Montreal the cup right now and point fingers and laugh at how off everyone was about Anaheim. Nash and Kreider aren't going to be this cold for the entire season and I'd bet a whole lot of money on the entire group collectively playing better hockey by the time December rolls around.

I do find it a bit ironic that you're complaining about the "dirty" goals scored by this team yesterday when those are the exact type of goals you see decide playoff games year in and year out.

 

[Ail]

That's the best pass he's made in years.

rofl, dude what a post. Sniped it top-shelf.

 

[Ail]

im going to wholeheartedly disagree with peoples assessment of Miller.

I think hes a high risk player...yes...but his good FAR outweighs his bad.

if you had nothing but low risk vanilla players youd have a team full of Fasths.


guys who almost never make the wrong play, but rarely do anything to create dynamic offense.

I like Fasth. I like Miller.

But i'll take the riskier player to compliment the vanilla player every day of the week.

Agree with this. I know I'm a biased Miller fan boy, but I think although he does make some questionable, and very careless mistakes on an almost game to game basis, he makes up for it in his ability to consistently make things happen in the offensive zone when he is on the ice. He's very good in deep and along the boards, and his game sense is above average imo. He's just often too quick to move the puck without fully reading the play or acknowledging his surroundings and ends up with a horrific giveaway.

Hopefully that goes away, if not, as long as he makes up for it in other areas it can be overlooked occasionally.

 

[lucky13]

A shot chart just represents a distance that a shot came from.

In the regular season Nash finds clear lanes to the net with the puck on his stick, something that disappears PO time.

If what you're saying is true, Nash truly is a 'playoff choker' then, considering how frequently he capitalizes on these chances in the RS versus the PO including a SC run which he had q mere 3 goals. He's had 3 long PO runs now to capitalize on, including 2 ECF and 1 SCF run.

Nash apologists seem to want to have their cake and eat it too. I like the guy but it's really hard to defend what he's done come PO time.

Not to nitpick too much but Nash wasn't here for the 12 run to the ECF.... Only the last 2