Post-Game Talk: 10/8 - Preseason #7 BRUINS 1 Philadelphia 0 F/OT

[BruinDust]

It's deuchey comments like the nhl 17 crap that remind me why I try not post out here much any more.

If you want to add a rookie inexperienced kid to an already poor defense, that's fine go ahead. Just live with the all the mistakes that come with it and the added playing time for other bottom pairing guys, or just keep rolling Chara out for 23 minutes plus each game and see were that gets you.

As for Erhoff, he'll get chewed up here playing under a ton of pressure situations and physical board battling that's going to happen with other teams using an agressive forecheck against a bad d-corp.

As far as forgetting pairings???? I hate to break it to you, but most teams consist of lines based on skill experience and ability.... including the defensemen. And it also usually ties pretty close into salary (which is kind of important in a salary cap league) and playing time.

Why don't you check last years stats on average time on ice for bottom pairing d-men vs top pairing guys on play off teams and see how th as 5 plays out.


Edit: after looking up a couple of teams u our toi aren't that far off.

It is deuchy and I apologize for that.

 

[bb_fan]

It is deuchy and I apologize for that.

All your points are valid, as are Parks and other people that agree with them.

I just happen not see much of an upgrade or any real improvment in the overall team by subtracting all the 'intangibles' Mcquaid brings for a marginal upgrade.

Chara Krug

Lillies miller

Mcquaid Morrow/Miller

I'd love it if one of Morrow or C. Miller or both can step up and push someone out and be an actual upgrade.

 

[BruinDust]

Well Said and I cannot agree more. I loved McQuaid, Kelly, Seids and Paille's game in the past but I do plan on being a fan a lot longer then certain players short careers and try not to get blinded by emotion and past glories (fan since 1970). In saying that some may think we are anti-bruin but that could not be further from the truth. The here and now dictates he is not one of the best in camp and if management is honest he needs to move aside. Same way someone else did for him. The Hawks management has it right they are cut throat, calculating and cold. Sorry but its time to move on, especially after they extended Miller the choice was clearly made. McQuaid will not accept a rover role 6/7 guy, he should go to a team like the Oilers and play a bigger role. They are going to have to baby sit Chara this year, that is a sad fact. I do not believe they went and got Backes to be average again, gotta move forward and there will be pain.

Got to take emotion out of the decision for Sweeney. No discount's McQuaid's intangibles.

But like you said guys are ready to take his spot, just as he pushed Stuart out the door back in 2011. It happens, it's pro sports. Heck it happens in rec sports. Who knows maybe if he never got concussed were not talking about moving McQuaid, as he played quite good before it.

Guys like McQuaid (and Shawn Thornton before him) are why I became a Bruins fan. Love the blue-collar work ethic, take-no-BS attitude that came with wearing black and gold.

But I sadly know deep down the days of the Big, Bad, Bruins are over. The game has changed, and we won't see a Big, Bad, <Insert team name> any team any more.

And if let's be frank, if McQuaid was on a 1-year, south of 1 million contract, yeah keep him around as a spare D-man. But Sweeney has a small window of opportunity here to try and get Boston out of this commitment. It's about thinking long-term, and if McQuaid continues to play poorly or is a constant spare part, all of sudden he can't move that deal. He HAS to plan for the worst-case scenario. And Bruins fans will be screaming as Boston let's good young players go because 2.75 million of McQuaid's money is still on the books.

 

[BruinDust]

All your points are valid, as are Parks and other people that agree with them.

I just happen not see much of an upgrade or any real improvment in the overall team by subtracting all the 'intangibles' Mcquaid brings for a marginal upgrade.

Chara Krug

Lillies miller

Mcquaid Morrow/Miller

I'd love it if one of Morrow or C. Miller or both can step up and push someone out and be an actual upgrade.

See my previous post. A LOT of my desire to see McQuaid move has to do with his contract. Think Chris Kelly 2.0.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

I remember when that was posted: it was just after I had noticed O'Gara looking really slow (and this was not long after someone pointed out it was nice to have a D with #44 who had wheels, so it stood out more). Don't think it was at the end of a long shift or anything either, so I reacted. Can't say I noticed him being slow the rest of the game, though, and I was impressed with a lot of his decision-making.

ROG is not a PMD in the traditional sense. He's not the skater that Krug, Chiller, Morrow, Carlo are, but it's not a weakness either. He gets back to the puck quickly and his decision-making and first pass is very good. There's more than one way to move the puck out of the D zone.

Personally, I think ROG has been better than Carlo overall in a quiet way, but I can see Carlo getting better by the game. I think his upside is higher than O'Gara's, but there is obviously room for both on the team. I see ROG as a good 3rd pair and Carlo as a very good 2nd pair.

Hopefully, they both turn out better

 

[bb_fan]

See my previous post. A LOT of my desire to see McQuaid move has to do with his contract. Think Chris Kelly 2.0.

For a vet free agent d-man (on a team with an estimated 5.8 mill in cap space) I have no issue at all with that contract.

I don't see much of any kelley comparisons here.

 

[BruinDust]

For a vet free agent d-man (on a team with an estimated 5.8 mill in cap space) I have no issue at all with that contract.

I don't see much of any kelley comparisons here.

Here today, no it's not an issue.

This team will have bigger cap issues next year with Spooner, Pastrnak, and possibly Czarnik needing new deals.

The year after, those cap issues will get even bigger.

Think Kelly's deal when Boston had to shed Boychuk for cap space. McQuaid's presents the same sort of problem.

And that is if Boston simply stays the course, let's their army of young forwards develop, and doesn't bring in any more medium-sized money deals.

Now you might say they can fix that problem next year. But as Sweeney found out with Seidenberg, moving out those contracts is easier said than done.

 

[Gee Wally]

This is a GDT.

We will not be discussing real or perceived issues with society.

 

[bb_fan]

Here today, no it's not an issue.

This team will have bigger cap issues next year with Spooner, Pastrnak, and possibly Czarnik needing new deals.

The year after, those cap issues will get even bigger.

Think Kelly's deal when Boston had to shed Boychuk for cap space. McQuaid's presents the same sort of problem.

And that is if Boston simply stays the course, let's their army of young forwards develop, and doesn't bring in any more medium-sized money deals.

Now you might say they can fix that problem next year. But as Sweeney found out with Seidenberg, moving out those contracts is easier said than done.

Cap management is a problem every year with every deal they sign.

If I remember correctly the problem with Kelley was he was injured and couldn't be traded?

Marchandd deal could suck the final years.

Everyone complains about Charas cap hit now.

If one of the kids can push him out next year, it shouldn't be a difficult contract to move.

 

[BruinDust]

Cap management is a problem every year with every deal they sign.

If I remember correctly the problem with Kelley was he was injured and couldn't be traded?

Marchandd deal could suck the final years.

Everyone complains about Charas cap hit now.

If one of the kids can push him out next year, it shouldn't be a difficult contract to move.

Kelly was healthy when the Boychuk trade was made. But who was taking on two years at 3.0 for a player coming off a pretty bad back injury.

Any deal can come back to bite a team in the cap era. There is always a risk.

The key is knowing when to cut ties before it gets to a point where you cannot move the contract out.

McQuaid's deal is at that tipping point right now where it becomes harder and harder to move. I can guarantee you teams like Florida or Arizona who are going all in on this analytics thing (rightly or wrongly) would have zero interest in McQuaid even today.

I just hope Sweeney learned his lesson having no takers for Seidenberg and moves McQuaid now before it's too late and he has to buy him out.

 

[KnightofBoston]

Have you watched any of preseason?

I hated the Kevan Miller extension, but right now I'd keep Kevan over McQuaid and it's not even close.

In my world both would be gone.

Miller is skating much better and from what I saw live last night, is making better decisions with the puck.

 

[BruinDust]

Miller is skating much better and from what I saw live last night, is making better decisions with the puck.

He has improved, I agree with that.

 

[pemulis]

Here's an article saying that Gudas was invited for an in person hearing for the Czarnik hit but he declined.

The NHL's department of player safety announced Sunday that Gudas was offered an in-person hearing Monday, usually reserved for suspensions of five games or more. Gudas, a repeat offender having been issued a three-game suspension last season, waived that right and will have a hearing by phone instead.

 

[DoubleAAAA]

He has improved, I agree with that.

Was hope by for better things from K Miller this year after hearing good reports from folks around here. I also don't think he's as bad as people make him out to be, that said I thought he looked pretty sub par yesterday, still couldn't make a play to save his life. I thought that combo of he and Erhoff were the most disappointing thing from that game.

 

[Fossy21]

ROG is not a PMD in the traditional sense. He's not the skater that Krug, Chiller, Morrow, Carlo are, but it's not a weakness either. He gets back to the puck quickly and his decision-making and first pass is very good. There's more than one way to move the puck out of the D zone.

Yeah. This instance was him trying to retreive the puck behind the net or in the corner, and he had a sizeable lead which he quickly lost, and thereby lost the puck to the opponent. Didn't lead to a particularly dangerous opportunity as I recall, but could have. Not sure if that's what whoever you first responded to reacted to, or it was a more general statement.

I liked what I saw from both of them, but Carlo impressed in a more flashy way so I get that he stands out more to most (even though ROG had a great pinch that led to a good scoring chance towards the end).

 

[bb_fan]

Kelly was healthy when the Boychuk trade was made. But who was taking on two years at 3.0 for a player coming off a pretty bad back injury.

Any deal can come back to bite a team in the cap era. There is always a risk.

The key is knowing when to cut ties before it gets to a point where you cannot move the contract out.

McQuaid's deal is at that tipping point right now where it becomes harder and harder to move. I can guarantee you teams like Florida or Arizona who are going all in on this analytics thing (rightly or wrongly) would have zero interest in McQuaid even today.

I just hope Sweeney learned his lesson having no takers for Seidenberg and moves McQuaid now before it's too late and he has to buy him out.

Sorry but I thought I had read a comment from a b's poster on the main boards in a bashing Sweeney thread saying that Kelly couldn't have been traded at the time of the Boy chucks deal because he was still on IR.

And comparing Seidenbergs contract and play to McQuaida contract and playou are essentially apples and oranges with the differences.

 

[bbfan419]

I think they should try to move McQuaid, Morrow and Hayes now while they may still be able to and give more opportunities to the young guys, would much rather see Carlo, O'Gara and Arnesson this year over McQuaid and Morrow, even K Miller.

 

[PlayMakers]

I think they should try to move McQuaid, Morrow and Hayes now while they may still be able to and give more opportunities to the young guys, would much rather see Carlo, O'Gara and Arnesson this year over McQuaid and Morrow, even K Miller.

**Disclaimer: This is not necessarily directed at you. Just taking issues with the general idea...

People say that all the time. I'd rather play the KIDz than that OLD guy. Sobotka was SCREWED OVER for a washed up Yelle!!?!!

At the same time, people TRASH this team for missing the playoffs. Last year, we played the kids on the 4th line and they were something like minus 30. How many goals did we miss the playoffs by? The year Yelle screwed over Sobotka, the little SOB was -10 in 25 games, while Yelle was +6 in 77 games.

My point? Sometimes that low risk vet helps you win.


Don't get me wrong, the only thing I like as much as watching the B's win is watching young players develop. But 1) I think it has to be earned by the young player (I think fans consistently want guys in the lineup too early), 2) I think you have to do it in small bites, as in, 2 or 3 kids, sprinkled throughout the lineup. An entire line of rookies or 3 (out of 6) rookie defensemen brought in at the same time is going to give you Oiler-esque results. But drop a young player or two onto Bergeron or Krejci's wing where they're supported? Absolutely. Drop a rookie D onto a pair with a vet partner and I think that's also a proven recipe for success.

Apologies for the rant... Just my $.02

Edit: Fwiw, I agree they should trade McQuaid. Don't know if there's a market for him (I don't believe there is one for Hayes either), but I'd do it so that I could sign Ehrhoff more than create a spot for a kid. They'll get their shots and playing a lot in the minors won't hurt their development.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

**Disclaimer: This is not necessarily directed at you. Just taking issues with the general idea...

People say that all the time. I'd rather play the KIDz than that OLD guy. Sobotka was SCREWED OVER for a washed up Yelle!!?!!

At the same time, people TRASH this team for missing the playoffs. Last year, we played the kids on the 4th line and they were something like minus 30. How many goals did we miss the playoffs by? The year Yelle screwed over Sobotka, the little SOB was -10 in 25 games, while Yelle was +6 in 77 games.

My point? Sometimes that low risk vet helps you win.


Don't get me wrong, the only thing I like as much as watching the B's win is watching young players develop. But 1) I think it has to be earned by the young player (I think fans consistently want guys in the lineup too early), 2) I think you have to do it in small bites, as in, 2 or 3 kids, sprinkled throughout the lineup. An entire line of rookies or 3 (out of 6) rookie defensemen brought in at the same time is going to give you Oiler-esque results. But drop a young player or two onto Bergeron or Krejci's wing where they're supported? Absolutely. Drop a rookie D onto a pair with a vet partner and I think that's also a proven recipe for success.

Apologies for the rant... Just my $.02

Edit: Fwiw, I agree they should trade McQuaid. Don't know if there's a market for him (I don't believe there is one for Hayes either), but I'd do it so that I could sign Ehrhoff more than create a spot for a kid. They'll get their shots and playing a lot in the minors won't hurt their development.

Using your Sobotka v Yelle example, you might have some growing pains with a younger player, but by the end of the season, the idea is that the younger player gives you as much/more than the vet. In the case you are citing, Yelle was soundly outplayed by Sobotka, but was still given the job. Subsequently, Sobotka was yo-yo'd between PRO and BOS and was Clode's whipping boy. IMO, it was the beginning of the end for SOB in Boston, and the B's lost a valuable asset.

Every situation is different, but I do generally agree with your youth in small doses idea. I have been hoping for years that the B's would use their 4th line as a training ground for young players, allowing them to gain valuable experience for later in the season when the inevitable injuries occur.

 

[BruinDust]

Sorry but I thought I had read a comment from a b's poster on the main boards in a bashing Sweeney thread saying that Kelly couldn't have been traded at the time of the Boy chucks deal because he was still on IR.

And comparing Seidenbergs contract and play to McQuaida contract and playou are essentially apples and oranges with the differences.

Are they?

Let's see.

Seidenberg

Injury prone - check

Declining performance - check

At best, 6th/7th D - check

Term left -2 years

AAV - 4.0 million

Total commitment - 8.0 million

McQuaid

Injury prone - check

Declining performance - check

At best 6th/7th D - check

Term left - 3 years

AAV - 2.75

Total Commitment - 8.25 million

About the only differences between Seidenberg and McQuaid are their ages.

 

[wintersej]

^^^ I think its a little early to declare McQuaid at Seidenberg level of being a 6/7. It may be the case, but he was playing at a high high #5 level before the injury last season. I think the plan, most likely, is to keep Kevan/McQuaid on the roster this season and then lose Kevan (the better of the two, but also the one signed to a longer contract) in expansion.

 

[Glove Malfunction]

I watch games differently in person than tv because you can't follow the player away from the puck - what's he do away from the puck, where's he go, when he gets what is the play. I thought he was going to be like Eriksson but he's closer to Bergeron. Claude must be ecstatic

Went to Grille before with Jess (an HF'er) and Andy and wife (Purple Shamrock) eating next booth and Jaci (WIckedbruinsgirl) our waitress....talk about HF Nation

OGara and Carlo going to make this tough on Claude

I also as did my group though Erhoff was excellent

Plus, Kovi and I enjoyed getting to talk to you briefly after the game. You're right, Heinen's got the right stuff.

 

[BigGoalBrad]

^^^ I think its a little early to declare McQuaid at Seidenberg level of being a 6/7. It may be the case, but he was playing at a high high #5 level before the injury last season. I think the plan, most likely, is to keep Kevan/McQuaid on the roster this season and then lose Kevan (the better of the two, but also the one signed to a longer contract) in expansion.

Agree. Hes on my roster this season no questions asked.


But at the end of camp when he hasn't been great and Liles/Ehrhoff are healthy if he starts as 7D then he so be it. He didn't have a great camp and he isn't a star player. You still want him around. Liles and Ehrhoff are older and might not hold up. The better of the kids are first year pros in Carlo and OGara. C Miller and Morrow aren't NHL players. I'm fine overpaying for 40-50 games this year with some press box duty mix in a couple scraps and see what happens after the year. And that is best case scenario because if McQuaid is in street clothes for an extended period of time it means we have a kid playing instead and playing well.

I'm not moving Quaider to accomodate Colin Miller though and neither is Claude.

I really hope Morrow and C Miller get snuck through waivers and can be our insurance with a lot of guys on the team pretty old and OGara and Carlo 1st year players. Both are high level AHL guys who will help the P B's. Boychuk was still an AHL player at their age.

 

[Glove Malfunction]

Got to take emotion out of the decision for Sweeney. No discount's McQuaid's intangibles.

But like you said guys are ready to take his spot, just as he pushed Stuart out the door back in 2011. It happens, it's pro sports. Heck it happens in rec sports. Who knows maybe if he never got concussed were not talking about moving McQuaid, as he played quite good before it.

Guys like McQuaid (and Shawn Thornton before him) are why I became a Bruins fan. Love the blue-collar work ethic, take-no-BS attitude that came with wearing black and gold.

But I sadly know deep down the days of the Big, Bad, Bruins are over. The game has changed, and we won't see a Big, Bad, <Insert team name> any team any more.

And if let's be frank, if McQuaid was on a 1-year, south of 1 million contract, yeah keep him around as a spare D-man. But Sweeney has a small window of opportunity here to try and get Boston out of this commitment. It's about thinking long-term, and if McQuaid continues to play poorly or is a constant spare part, all of sudden he can't move that deal. He HAS to plan for the worst-case scenario. And Bruins fans will be screaming as Boston let's good young players go because 2.75 million of McQuaid's money is still on the books.

Concussion or not, you're seriously undervaluing McQuaid with this suggestion.

 

[bearcountry17]

I love McQuaid for all he's done for the Bruins but I wouldn't mind if they parted ways with him. I'm really sick of seeing him just give up on moving the puck and just curling into the boards, letting forwards get in on him.

Chara-Carlo
Krug-K. Miller
Liles-O'Gara/C. Miller