Boston Bruins ‘22-‘23 Bruins roster and trade proposals discussions. IV

[RoccoF14]

Seems players and coaches talk about it quite a bit for it being a poor metric.

Yep. I believe it was you who said that +/- was a decent metric for evaluating players against each other on the same team, but not so much for evaluating players against players on a different team.

I agree with that 100%.

 

[LouJersey]

Shouldn't dismiss plus/minus so easily. Used with context it's a good stat.

I mean who here doesn't brag about the team's goal differential? It's basically a plus/minus that includes special teams.

My issue with the +/- in Gryz playoffs is so out of whack with the rest of the defensemen that hafe played for the bruins the past decade plus

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

My issue with the +/- in Gryz playoffs is so out of whack with the rest of the defensemen that hafe played for the bruins the past decade plus

His +/- is more out of whack with his xGF% than basically anyone ever. So out there it's a bizarre anomaly.

 

[WhalerTurnedBruin55]

I like +/- as a stat. I don't think it's worth the paper it's written on 15-20 games into the season but as the year goes on, its quite indicative to not only the player but the entire line/pairing.

My move is Toewes for a few reasons.

1. Left shot Center
2. Can move up 1C, 2C, 3C baring any major injuries to Bergy-Krejci-Coyle.
3. Guy is a winner
4. Can kill penalties and play shutdown minutes
5. Line 4 would be way more dangerous offensively with a combination of Foligno-Toewes-XXXX

To be clear, I'd only do this deal if the price was right.
Nosek + Reilly + 1st for Toewes (50% retained)

That sheds us of Reilly's contract in 2023, a first is tough to swallow but its Toewes we're getting plus ridding ourselves of Reilly. I think That's a win/win

From a pure hockey point of view, sure. I'm not against Toews but has a few parts would make me hesitant.
1. Cap, this group is tight knit it seems. Even Toews at 50% (5.25); Reilly and Nosek isn't enough space, add in, if we are looking at any other additions, we are pretty low on cap space as it is. We are likely throwing in Smith, too. Which means we need to bring back more depth, and not just Toews in subsequent deals. Could be more moving pieces than needed for the top team.
2. This is more speculation than anything, but given some of the things that have happened in the past few years, I know captain Toews is a winner, but kinda curious how our leadership looks at Captain Looks-Another-Way after the whole scandal came out. He's been a great hockey player, and our players are professional, but since that story was pretty public, have to think some of the guys have an opinion on it and the team involved. For me, not a deal breaker, given his (lack of?) direct involvement, but since the lockeroom and leadership has been a theme this year more than any, I'd have to think it should be brought up before making a big move like that.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

My issue with the +/- in Gryz playoffs is so out of whack with the rest of the defensemen that hafe played for the bruins the past decade plus

It may be because he hasn't played well in the playoffs.

 

[NDiesel]

Issue with him is that makes four righthanded centers, if that's where you're playing him. At 4RW? Sure. But they usually want a lefthanded center for the PK.

In my mind, the luxury, FU add is a high end 4C. Nosek does his job, but I'd rather go all out there than try to tinker with the top 9, now that Frederic is hitting his stride. Assuming no injuries, of course.

I get your point but at the same time they also have Zacha and Frederic who can and have played C, who are lefties. Both have played PK this season too, correct?

On the flip side they have only 2 right handed players on the wing. Wagner is their only right handed depth really, even guys like Lauko, Greer, Beecher, etc. are lefties.

Acciari would be a better depth piece for that right side but also gives you the option of another PKing center if Nosek goes down, or outright replaces him if they want him too.

 

[RoccoF14]

It may be because he hasn't played well in the playoffs.

I think last season's poor performance is a big factor. But the guy was basically playing with one arm for the last third of the season and the entire post season.....

Coyle had that same issue a couple years back when he was playing on one leg and everyone was calling him a JAG. Some with Foligno, last year. Also playing hurt.....

That's where metrics don't tell the whole story.

 

[NDiesel]

There's your Forbort upgrade, as referenced above. Going to be very costly though, and not sure the Bruins can win that battle.

He would be my ideal upgrade...but yeah that'll be a steep price.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

I think last season's poor performance is a big factor. But the guy was basically playing with one arm for the last third of the season and the entire post season.....

Coyle had that same issue a couple years back when he was playing on one leg and everyone was calling him a JAG. Some with Foligno, last year. Also playing hurt.....

That's where metrics don't tell the whole story.

Good point.

But Grz has been a minus player every year of his career in Boston in the playoff, while also never being a minus player in the regular season.

 

[Hookslide]

I like +/- as a stat. I don't think it's worth the paper it's written on 15-20 games into the season but as the year goes on, its quite indicative to not only the player but the entire line/pairing.

My move is Toewes for a few reasons.

1. Left shot Center
2. Can move up 1C, 2C, 3C baring any major injuries to Bergy-Krejci-Coyle.
3. Guy is a winner
4. Can kill penalties and play shutdown minutes
5. Line 4 would be way more dangerous offensively with a combination of Foligno-Toewes-XXXX

To be clear, I'd only do this deal if the price was right.
Nosek + Reilly + 1st for Toewes (50% retained)

That sheds us of Reilly's contract in 2023, a first is tough to swallow but its Toewes we're getting plus ridding ourselves of Reilly. I think That's a win/win

So is Toews going to play 4th line because we have 3 centers and they seem to be doing well , but with retainment 5 mil for a 4th liner something I am sure many poster's will endorse.........

 

[DKH]

I think you are going to see less injuries for the D this season/playoffs. Monty's gaps aren't as suicidal as Cassidy's, so they have time to play the puck. Cassidy wanted the gaps so small, as soon as they turned into the corner the forwards were right on them and they had no time to avoid the hit.

Yup - great observation

I was wondering if this was by design and someone (playmaker?) told me no this is how Monty plays and you won’t see the defense getting trucked as much

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

So is Toews going to play 4th line because we have 3 centers and they seem to be doing well , but with retainment 5 mil for a 4th liner something I am sure many poster's will endorse.........

I would absolutely endorse it if the room is ok with him (per the above). Even more so, I'd pay out the ass for Ryan O'Reilly for that role for one year. Absolutely. I don't think we need to tinker with the top 9 or top 4/5 and so this is a TB Coleman/Goodrow kind of luxury add year.

 

[RoccoF14]

Good point.

But Grz has been a minus player every year of his career in Boston in the playoff, while also never being a minus player in the regular season.

You piqued my curiosity so I went back and checked the numbers and you're right. Here's a little context behind them that I think is important to point out.

2019 Post Season: Grizz was -3 for the post season and got injured in the Final. He was on our bottom pair, with Connor Clifton as his line mate. Top 2 pairs were Chara-McAvoy, Krug-Carlo

2020 Post Season: -5 in the post season. That was the COVID season, and I'm throwing it out entirely. Post season started after a 5 month layoff.

2021 Post Season: -2 in the post season. Mostly played top pairing with McAvoy but got shuffled after Carlo got hurt. No excuses here.

2022 Post Season: Played with one arm

 

[jgatie]

Yup - great observation

I was wondering if this was by design and someone (playmaker?) told me no this is how Monty plays and you won’t see the defense getting trucked as much

Cassidy set his guys up for injuries. The Blues knew they could dump the puck in the corner and the Bruin D were sitting ducks. Yet another way Cassidy was outcoached in the Final, because he never wavered from it, even after it was not working and even worse, getting guys killed.

 

[LouJersey]

Cassidy set his guys up for injuries. The Blues knew they could dump the puck in the corner and the Bruin D were sitting ducks. Yet another way Cassidy was outcoached in the Final, because he never wavered from it, even after it was not working and even worse, getting guys killed.

that was the worst coached series I can remember. He was so inflexible. Cement head Berube switched up the lines and it actually worked winning 3 of the final 4 games.

 

[Gee Wally]

Please continue here:

https://forums.hfboards.com/threads/‘22-‘23-bruins-roster-and-trade-proposals-discussions-v.2912695/