Zach Bogosian

[Huffer]

I just don't get the let's trade Bogo talk. After his first season in Winnipeg he looked destined to be a top pairing guy. He has struggled a bit over the last couple seasons mostly due to injuries so we are going to dump him. If you look around the league teams are searching for young defenseman like him. He is signed long term on a reasonable contract. Buff is likely gone this off season, if we then dump Bogo we might end up with a Clitsome/Postma 2nd pairing. Ouch. We need another 2nd pairing defenseman not get rid of the only one we have. One of my biggest fears for the Jets is Chevy gets happy feet and unloads a guy like Bogo and he reaches his potential in a new environment, and we are forever trying to find a large bodied minute eater for the 2nd pairing.

Agreed King. Although I don't worry that Chevy even thinks about trading him. As you said, the whole league looks for young D like him.

 

[Guerzy]

I have long been a Bogosian supporter, albeit not a blind one. In my opinion, he just needs to stay healthy, that aspect has really effected his game the last year or so and throughout his young career in general. Stay healthy and I think he returns to form.

You know a RW who once couldn't stay healthy? Justin Williams. Won the Cup in '06 as a young 23/24 year old and was fantastic. Signed a 5-year contract, again put in a great season in 2006-07. December 21 of the 2007-08 season he tore his ACL and missed pretty well the rest of the season (43 games) only to return in April the miss a couple more games with a back injury. The next season, 2008-09, he tore his Achilles Tendon in September at a charity run which caused him to miss the first 25 games. He returned only to break his hand in February, missing another 15 games. Carolina/ Jim Rutherford got scared of holding on to a player who appeared not able to stay healthy, so they traded him to LA in March of 2009, and the rest is history. His first season in LA however, he did break his leg in December 2009, missed 28 games. Since then, however, he's played 73, 82, 48 (lockout year), and 82 games. 285 games, 192 points, 2 Stanley Cups and a Conn Smythe. The thing about Justin Williams, he was always a reliable stud. He played with Rod Brind'Amour when Carolina won the Cup and he learned so much from Brind'Amour, you could just see the player he was and could be.

So he has rebounded, but man did he ever go through a period of time where it must have felt his career was crashing down on him and he just couldn't stay healthy, put it together and be the player everyone knew he could be.

I am confident if we can see a healthy Bogosian, it will pay huge dividends.

 

[Huffer]

Nice point about Williams Matt. For some lol's, you should check out the thread on the Kings board when they acquired Williams. Many thought it was terrible and lamented losing O'Sullivan.

 

[Guerzy]

Nice point about Williams Matt. For some lol's, you should check out the thread on the Kings board when they acquired Williams. Many thought it was terrible and lamented losing O'Sullivan.

Indeed, funny to look back on, but, that's how it goes. The thing at the time was, Justin Williams was 27 and could not stay healthy, and Patrick O'Sullivan was 24 years old, was touted as a player who would have been a 1st round pick in 2003 had it not been for his father, had a season of 22 goals and 53 points the year prior under his belt, and had a pretty respectable 14 goals and 37 points in 62 games at the time of the trade.

I can understand LA fans' frustration at the time, not to mention they gave up a 2nd round pick with O'Sullivan. But yes, looking back given how things have turned out... certainly worth a chuckle.

 

[ps241]

I have long been a Bogosian supporter, albeit not a blind one. In my opinion, he just needs to stay healthy, that aspect has really effected his game the last year or so and throughout his young career in general. Stay healthy and I think he returns to form.

You know a RW who once couldn't stay healthy? Justin Williams. Won the Cup in '06 as a young 23/24 year old and was fantastic. Signed a 5-year contract, again put in a great season in 2006-07. December 21 of the 2007-08 season he tore his ACL and missed pretty well the rest of the season (43 games) only to return in April the miss a couple more games with a back injury. The next season, 2008-09, he tore his Achilles Tendon in September at a charity run which caused him to miss the first 25 games. He returned only to break his hand in February, missing another 15 games. Carolina/ Jim Rutherford got scared of holding on to a player who appeared not able to stay healthy, so they traded him to LA in March of 2009, and the rest is history. His first season in LA however, he did break his leg in December 2009, missed 28 games. Since then, however, he's played 73, 82, 48 (lockout year), and 82 games. 285 games, 192 points, 2 Stanley Cups and a Conn Smythe. The thing about Justin Williams, he was always a reliable stud. He played with Rod Brind'Amour when Carolina won the Cup and he learned so much from Brind'Amour, you could just see the player he was and could be.

So he has rebounded, but man did he ever go through a period of time where it must have felt his career was crashing down on him and he just couldn't stay healthy, put it together and be the player everyone knew he could be.

I am confident if we can see a healthy Bogosian, it will pay huge dividends.

Happy fathers day Matt

Great post and this is why I love HFBoards. You learn something every day.

 

[Guerzy]

Happy fathers day Matt

Great post and this is why I love HFBoards. You learn something every day.

Thanks! And to you as well my friend!

 

[ihadtochangethename]

hmmmmm
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sports/hockey/jets/temper-your-expectations-on-bogosian-278498081.html

 

[Jet]

hmmmmm
http://www.winnipegfreepress.com/sports/hockey/jets/temper-your-expectations-on-bogosian-278498081.html

Great article (can't believe I'm saying that about Lawless, probably my Bogo bias ).

I'd like to know if Gary just lurks here or if he has an account. Is it Derfel?

Highlights for me:

- Jets were active in trying to adjust Bogosian's regimen this off-season to hopefully lessen injuries.
- Bogo putting in an extra 30 minutes on ice after everyone else left
- Bogosian only makes 4 MM this year. Honestly? That isn't a tonne for the minutes and situations he plays
- He still believes he can be a complete, 2 way defenseman. Hopefully we see a wee bit more of that guy this year

A key for Zach is to stay healthy and play >70 games. I think if he can do that, people will start to come back over to his side.

 

[Guerzy]

Great article (can't believe I'm saying that about Lawless, probably my Bogo bias ).

I'd like to know if Gary just lurks here or if he has an account. Is it Derfel?

Highlights for me:

- Jets were active in trying to adjust Bogosian's regimen this off-season to hopefully lessen injuries.
- Bogo putting in an extra 30 minutes on ice after everyone else left
- Bogosian only makes 4 MM this year. Honestly? That isn't a tonne for the minutes and situations he plays
- He still believes he can be a complete, 2 way defenseman. Hopefully we see a wee bit more of that guy this year

A key for Zach is to stay healthy and play >70 games. I think if he can do that, people will start to come back over to his side.

This stood out to me too, Jet. A few years back, might have been Bogosian's sophomore year (maybe Duke or another of our Atlanta friends can say), but Bogosian packed on a lot of muscle in the offseason, I think he got upwards of 225lbs (and this was a few years back, so he was around 19/20). It effected his skating and just his all around game. I like that we are being proactive here because it does appear as tip top shape as Zach is in, an adjustment within his training regimen may be a good thing for his durability.

I said it in June in this thread, but the key for Bogosian to me is simple (in theory); stay healthy. If he can do that I feel strongly everything else will fall smoothly into place for him. Especially now under Maurice and the fact that Bogosian is going to get opportunity on the top pair and in key situations, where as before that was pretty well Enstrom - Byfuglien.

One of the many things I am looking forward to seeing how it plays out this season.

 

[Jet]

This stood out to me too, Jet. A few years back, might have been Bogosian's sophomore year (maybe Duke or another of our Atlanta friends can say), but Bogosian packed on a lot of muscle in the offseason, I think he got upwards of 225lbs (and this was a few years back, so he was around 19/20). It effected his skating and just his all around game. I like that we are being proactive here.

I said it in June in this thread, but the key for Bogosian to me is simple (in theory); stay healthy. If he can do that I feel strongly everything else will fall smoothly into place for him. Especially now under Maurice and the fact that Bogosian is going to get opportunity on the top pair and in key situations, where as before that was pretty well Enstrom - Byfuglien.

One of the many things I am looking forward to seeing how it plays out this season.

I think we just saw this happen with Morrissey, and it may well have prevented him from getting on the opening day roster this year.

Funny how a prospect/ young player adding strength and muscle could actually hinder them. I think you have to do it slower, and keep the on ice component. With Morrissey's heavy training and late finish to his long season, that all conspired IMO to slow him down enough to take him out of the equation. I hope that the Jets see this and are talking to Josh.

 

[Guerzy]

I think we just saw this happen with Morrissey, and it may well have prevented him from getting on the opening day roster this year.

Funny how a prospect/ young player adding strength and muscle could actually hinder them. I think you have to do it slower, and keep the on ice component. With Morrissey's heavy training and late finish to his long season, that all conspired IMO to slow him down enough to take him out of the equation. I hope that the Jets see this and are talking to Josh.

Exactly. Truth be told, these are just kids (Morrissey) and Bogosian back when he was 19/20. There are things they can do to enhance physical aspects of their body stature, but in my opinion a lot of it is a natural progression that will happen over a period of time as they mature. It is funny though how 10lbs or so can effect ones game.

 

[Aavco Cup]

With Morrissey's heavy training and late finish to his long season, that all conspired IMO to slow him down enough to take him out of the equation. I hope that the Jets see this and are talking to Josh.

The Jets have a player development department. I'm sure the Keane and Roy were involved in the exit interview and stay in contact with all the prospects. It was implied in that PA article the there was a belief from the Jets that Josh overtrained this summer.

 

[Mathmew Purrrr Oh]

The Jets have a player development department. I'm sure the Keane and Roy were involved in the exit interview and stay in contact with all the prospects. It was implied in that PA article the there was a belief from the Jets that Josh overtrained this summer.

was noticeable in Penticton

https://twitter.com/kevinmccart/status/510827833548345344

https://twitter.com/kevinmccart/status/511616487639883776

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

This stood out to me too, Jet. A few years back, might have been Bogosian's sophomore year (maybe Duke or another of our Atlanta friends can say), but Bogosian packed on a lot of muscle in the offseason, I think he got upwards of 225lbs (and this was a few years back, so he was around 19/20). It effected his skating and just his all around game. I like that we are being proactive here because it does appear as tip top shape as Zach is in, an adjustment within his training regimen may be a good thing for his durability.

I said it in June in this thread, but the key for Bogosian to me is simple (in theory); stay healthy. If he can do that I feel strongly everything else will fall smoothly into place for him. Especially now under Maurice and the fact that Bogosian is going to get opportunity on the top pair and in key situations, where as before that was pretty well Enstrom - Byfuglien.

One of the many things I am looking forward to seeing how it plays out this season.

Looking at the Jets roster there are quite a few whose weights have changed one way or another. Ladd has lost a few lbs, Hali is down 10, Scheif has packed on more. I was surprised that Wheeler is up to 225 and .... Bogo is back to that 225. Through the exhibitions he did not appear to be skating as well as he has in the past. I hope he has not overdone it.

 

[Bob E]

The thing with Bogo is he skates well, manages players on the rush well, and 'finishes' (as PoMo says) players hard, every time. This physical play can lead to injuries, but I like the change to his training regime and stretching - that's important.

But, when the Jets are in the dzone, Zach is a bit lost. He loses containment, runs around a bit, and rushes to engage a player, who can simply move the puck to a free teammate. If I was the opposition, I would try to isolate Bogo to get him running around a bit. Toby does that a bit as well. He'll leave his position, to cover for others, leaving an unmanned area or player. Either they don't communicate well, or simply refuse to play within a structure.

But I'm sure coaching staff sees this, and must in some ways be instructing them - but it just seems strange. Troubs does this far less, and must have been well coached as a younger player. His defensive zone awareness is very good for a young player.

I just wonder how long it will take for a Coyote forward to be left alone by Bogo (or Toby) or for them to lose containment, or have their back to a dangerous player or emerging play, or be caught 'puck watching'. I'm hopeful PoMo will correct some of these things. We'll see.

 

[Howard Chuck]

The thing with Bogo is he skates well, manages players on the rush well, and 'finishes' (as PoMo says) players hard, every time. This physical play can lead to injuries, but I like the change to his training regime and stretching - that's important.

But, when the Jets are in the dzone, Zach is a bit lost. He loses containment, runs around a bit, and rushes to engage a player, who can simply move the puck to a free teammate. If I was the opposition, I would try to isolate Bogo to get him running around a bit. Toby does that a bit as well. He'll leave his position, to cover for others, leaving an unmanned area or player. Either they don't communicate well, or simply refuse to play within a structure.

But I'm sure coaching staff sees this, and must in some ways be instructing them - but it just seems strange. Troubs does this far less, and must have been well coached as a younger player. His defensive zone awareness is very good for a young player.

I just wonder how long it will take for a Coyote forward to be left alone by Bogo (or Toby) or for them to lose containment, or have their back to a dangerous player or emerging play, or be caught 'puck watching'. I'm hopeful PoMo will correct some of these things. We'll see.

Bob, I agree with both sides of your perspective on Bogo (and Enstrom /Trouba). To my eyes, Bogo and Enstrom both take a more relaxed approach to gathering up the puck in the d zone. I almost want to yell at the tv for them to hurry up before the forechecker gets there, but alas, most of the time they can't hear me.

Trouba on the other hand, hustles to get there with lots of time to get in and get the puck out before the forecheckers get there or get set up.

YMMV

 

[ihadtochangethename]

I enjoyed the article as well Jet. It seems even Lawless has had to do some reflecting and re-evaluating of Bogo, I remember him always being really high on him. I think this was perhaps Garys most "balanced" article yet.

 

[King of Arcadia]

Bogosian

will this guy ever become a solid dman? I am souring on him more every game.

 

[pegjets]

Great skater, keeps making very poor decisions. I'm not sure if he is going to learn or change really.

 

[Analyst365]

It's almost like he isn't intelligent. Not that he comes across that way.

 

[fmrdh]

Its like he is trying to play an elusive game like Enstrom which in his case just ends up in bad decisions and turnovers.

 

[alchemyindex]

He needs his "Hainsey" who will tell him what to do on the ice, but someone better than Ron Hainsey.

 

[Blue Shakehead]

Chimp on rocket skates.

 

[Jet]

He's played very well most this season. He's had some pretty oh no bogo moments.

Alas, that is what people will pin on him. It's becoming his definition.

I for one hope won't mind if he has more of those moments if its in the name of making good things happen. Great forwards do bad stuff all the time trying to be offensive. When it works out, it's awesome, when it doesn't it's not thought about much.

What I want Bogo to stop doing is having his oh no moments just because he's lost concentration (which seems to get him from time to time).

I hope as he matures, the latter becomes less and less frequent. People will probably not realize that he's been slowly becoming the guy we want him to be until he's there. The progress is slow and steady.

 

[Blue Shakehead]

He's played very well most this season. He's had some pretty oh no bogo moments.

Alas, that is what people will pin on him. It's becoming his definition.

I for one hope won't mind if he has more of those moments if its in the name of making good things happen. Great forwards do bad stuff all the time trying to be offensive. When it works out, it's awesome, when it doesn't it's not thought about much.

What I want Bogo to stop doing is having his oh no moments just because he's lost concentration (which seems to get him from time to time).

I hope as he matures, the latter becomes less and less frequent. People will probably not realize that he's been slowly becoming the guy we want him to be until he's there. The progress is slow and steady.

I really don't know where you're seeing this progress to be honest. He's in his 6th year in the league, has almost 400 games and he's trending downwards IMO. He holds onto the puck a half second too long and gets in trouble a lot. He's playing with virtually zero confidence. His offensive instincts are well behind Trouba, Enstrom, Postma and Buff - no idea why he's on the power play. His positioning is bad and his decision making is somewhere near Clitsome at the bottom of the pack. His physical skills - speed, strength, acceleration are really the only thing he has above anyone else.

Unless he's fighting off some injury we don't know if, he could very well be as good now as he'll ever be, which-on his best days- is a #3 or #4 shutdown guy. At least that's my opinion.