Blue Jays Discussion: Youth Movement (Pompey, Norris among Sept call-ups)

[Woodman19]

Well, you can trade them but still be successful winning team. Like when St.Louis lost Pujols for nothing. Did they tank? No.

St.Louis also had a replacement for Pujols waiting in the wings, we do not. It would hit us far harder because of it.

 

[lebdafor norris]

Well, you can trade them but still be successful winning team. Like when St.Louis lost Pujols for nothing. Did they tank? No.

2 different teams, the Cards were a world series winning team with Pujols, while the Jays right now would be lucky to end up with a .500 record.

Also, 4 top 50 prospects for an aging Bautista is way too much.

 

[canucksfan]

If you trade Bautista the Jays could be competitive in another two years. Next year would be an off year then they should be fine again.

 

[Woodman19]

If you trade Bautista the Jays could be competitive in another two years. Next year would be an off year then they should be fine again.

I don't know about that. If you can bring in at least 2 pieces who can contribute next year in a key area (say 2B), we could very well retool around that and weather the loss while counting on a young and improving rotation for years beyond. If we were to get say Wong + Miller + Piscotty from the Cards or a Walker + Bell + Kingham package from the Pirates we could very well still be a playoff contender.

 

[canucksfan]

I don't know about that. If you can bring in at least 2 pieces who can contribute next year in a key area (say 2B), we could very well retool around that and weather the loss while counting on a young and improving rotation for years beyond. If we were to get say Wong + Miller + Piscotty from the Cards or a Walker + Bell + Kingham package from the Pirates we could very well still be a playoff contender.

True. Depends on the package we would get.

 

[showtime8]

What did he say?

Also, agreed on Santos. Seems like every time Gibbons trots him out there, he completely ***** the bed.

In the pre-game interview with Arash Madani, he was asked something along the lines... earlier in the season you were happy with how things were going. Now what does it feel like? And he answered by laughing and saying the same as it always is with the team.

I'm sure Sportsnet has the interview on the site.

But it was really telling as to there is definitely something wrong in that clubhouse.

 

[Anthrax442]

Well, you can trade them but still be successful winning team. Like when St.Louis lost Pujols for nothing. Did they tank? No.

Yes, but they were a successful team, a perennial contender with a very good farm system. Wining organization. The Jays are none of these things.

 

[showtime8]

I don't know about that. If you can bring in at least 2 pieces who can contribute next year in a key area (say 2B), we could very well retool around that and weather the loss while counting on a young and improving rotation for years beyond. If we were to get say Wong + Miller + Piscotty from the Cards or a Walker + Bell + Kingham package from the Pirates we could very well still be a playoff contender.

Wouldn't you ask for a future ace of the staff and a position player that can contribute?

If you're the Jays, wouldn't you be pissed off at the fact the return on players that you had turn out to be next to nothing?

For example, they trade Doc Halladay for esentially Kyle Drabek and Travis D'Arnaud. Neither of those players have made an impact 5 years later. I understand that D'Arnaud was part of another deal, but the point I'm trying to make is that if the Jays are going to make a trade for any current position player, they need MLB talent or AAA talent that can be a call-up.

I would trade Bautista this off-season and listen to offers on everyone.

 

[dredeye]

I know AA is not going to, but I would like to see Jannsen and Rasmus on Revocable Waivers then Santos DFAed.

Pillar + Gose platoon > Rasmus and Jannsen should be sold while we can still get value for him.

I pretty much assume they'll be placed on waivers once AA feels the time is right that the proper team/teams are there that would want them. He'd be wise to try and find a return for either as they obviously aren't going to be qualified.

 

[topched]

I pretty much assume they'll be placed on waivers once AA feels the time is right that the proper team/teams are there that would want them. He'd be wise to try and find a return for either as they obviously aren't going to be qualified.

I assume Janssen will get us back a comp pick if he walk as as an FA?

What about Rasmus?

 

[Suntouchable13]

All I am asking for is that if you're going to trade Bautista and/or EE, please get some good players that can contribute right away. Boston has got the right idea when the traded Lester and Lackey. If we can be a better team next season by trading these guys, then I am all for it. I don't want to be in the basement again. Especially when I know that it has not really benefited us at all.

 

[calcal798]

I pretty much assume they'll be placed on waivers once AA feels the time is right that the proper team/teams are there that would want them. He'd be wise to try and find a return for either as they obviously aren't going to be qualified.

I hope he does, I'd be pretty disappointed if he doesn't.

I don't know about that. If you can bring in at least 2 pieces who can contribute next year in a key area (say 2B), we could very well retool around that and weather the loss while counting on a young and improving rotation for years beyond. If we were to get say Wong + Miller + Piscotty from the Cards or a Walker + Bell + Kingham package from the Pirates we could very well still be a playoff contender.

I'd be aiming for Polanco if I'm dealing with the Pirates, Polanco + Walker perhaps (we would likely have to add).

 

[Mach85]

I assume Janssen will get us back a comp pick if he walk as as an FA?

What about Rasmus?

Janssen won't be extended a qualifying offer. 14-15 million is waay too much for a player of Casey's ilk. Remember, there's no Type A and Type B distinctions anymore.

 

[Suntouchable13]

I also don't understand when people say that Bautista is mailing it in since the trade deadline. If he truly is mailing it in, then I don't get it. They had a 3 game lead for the 2nd wild card spot at the time, why on earth would he mail it in then? Then he would possibly turn around and ask for a trade because this team can't make the playoffs? Makes no sense.

 

[ryno23]

Why not take the Boston model when they moved Lester they got an impact player back.

Bautista, Burhele and lower tier prospect

for

Jay Bruce, Robert Stephenson and Matt Latos

Good old fashion baseball deal.

The Reds get Jose and he would mash in that park. Burhele may be ok in Cincy but a back of the rotation guy with Cueto, Simon, Leake

Jays get Bruce while not on Jose's level still will put up power numbers to offset any loss . Latos goes to the top of the rotation and Stephenson is MLB ready along with Stroman, Sanchez could have a good core for the future.

You sign Asdrual Cabrera to play 2b or Chase Headley to play 3b allowing Lawrie to move to what ever opening you have and now you have a good lineup plus pitching.

 

[Woodman19]

I hope he does, I'd be pretty disappointed if he doesn't.



I'd be aiming for Polanco if I'm dealing with the Pirates, Polanco + Walker perhaps (we would likely have to add).

If you can pry Walker from them, you take the lesser (but still good) Bell back in a package, that would set us up with 2 guys who should be .800 OPS guys for the next 5 years.

 

[Cor]

I am starting to feel more and more open to dealing Jose Bautista.

Don't know, just feel like we need to do it

 

[Woodman19]

Why not take the Boston model when they moved Lester they got an impact player back.

Bautista, Burhele and lower tier prospect

for

Jay Bruce, Robert Stephenson and Matt Latos

Good old fashion baseball deal.

The Reds get Jose and he would mash in that park. Burhele may be ok in Cincy but a back of the rotation guy with Cueto, Simon, Leake

Jays get Bruce while not on Jose's level still will put up power numbers to offset any loss . Latos goes to the top of the rotation and Stephenson is MLB ready along with Stroman, Sanchez could have a good core for the future.

You sign Asdrual Cabrera to play 2b or Chase Headley to play 3b allowing Lawrie to move to what ever opening you have and now you have a good lineup plus pitching.

Latos is not that attractive in a deal, his velocity is declining as are his strikeouts while giving up more walks and hits. He also only has a year left on his deal and we would be getting to little back. Conversely, that's to much salary for Cinci to take on. They have to re-sign Cueto and its going to kill whatever budget they will have, let alone add on another $32 million.

 

[Eyedea]

Stephenson is not MLB ready and the Reds would not trade him especially since Cueto is likely leaving next offseason.

Also that Wong + Miller + Piscotty package sounds so underwhelming.

 

[darko]

Stephenson is not MLB ready and the Reds would not trade him especially since Cueto is likely leaving next offseason.

This.

 

[StuckOutHere]

2 different teams, the Cards were a world series winning team with Pujols, while the Jays right now would be lucky to end up with a .500 record.

Also, 4 top 50 prospects for an aging Bautista is way too much.

If you were referencing my post here, I wrote it would be 4 top 50 prospects between JB and EE. I figure they are both worth two high-end prospects+.

 

[calcal798]

Santos DFAed.

Now all we need is Jannsen and Rasmus on waivers.

 

[canucksfan]

If you trade Bautista I think you would want to get MLB ready prospects or very close to it.

A team trading for Bautista will want to win in the next two two years so weakening their roster doesn't make sense.

 

[theaub]

Wouldn't you ask for a future ace of the staff and a position player that can contribute?

If you're the Jays, wouldn't you be pissed off at the fact the return on players that you had turn out to be next to nothing?

For example, they trade Doc Halladay for esentially Kyle Drabek and Travis D'Arnaud. Neither of those players have made an impact 5 years later. I understand that D'Arnaud was part of another deal, but the point I'm trying to make is that if the Jays are going to make a trade for any current position player, they need MLB talent or AAA talent that can be a call-up.

I would trade Bautista this off-season and listen to offers on everyone.

If you're only trading JB/EE for MLB proven talent, then why exactly would you trade either of them considering they're both top 10 hitters in the league this year?

Drabek was supposed to be a high end #2 at a minimum and D'Arnaud was supposed to be a top-end catcher. It doesn't work out.

 

[canucksfan]

If you're only trading JB/EE for MLB proven talent, then why exactly would you trade either of them considering they're both top 10 hitters in the league this year?

Drabek was supposed to be a high end #2 at a minimum and D'Arnaud was supposed to be a top-end catcher. It doesn't work out.

TDA is still developing although I doubt he remains at the catching position which lowers his value.

Drabek had his 2nd TJ and is done.