Your opinion: Are Capuano and Snow still with us next year?

[Seph]

There is nothing power mad about having your guy who offers zero resistance to you under you in a business setting. It is normal. The issue is if doing so at the expense of better candidates hurts the product more than keeping your guy in place. At least that's my take,and where I see Snow making a mistake. I'be yet to see anyone say Jack is at the top of the coaching scale. I see the defense of him here almost every time say he isn't in the upper echelon of coaches, but that he isn't the worst, or is good enough,etc. We can do better. Why Don't we?

Under Wang, the only coaches the Islanders have had have been guys during their first stint as an NHL head coach. The only exception to that was Nolan, who was generally considered blackballed by the league. There has never been an in demand proven NHL coach though. Blaming this trend on Snow seems to ignore that the trend started long before him. The most likely answer is that the owner hasn't been willing to pay the salary that an in demand proven NHL coach would demand. But we'll see when the new owners take over.

 

[Frankie41987]

There is nothing power mad about having your guy who offers zero resistance to you under you in a business setting. It is normal. The issue is if doing so at the expense of better candidates hurts the product more than keeping your guy in place. At least that's my take,and where I see Snow making a mistake. I'be yet to see anyone say Jack is at the top of the coaching scale. I see the defense of him here almost every time say he isn't in the upper echelon of coaches, but that he isn't the worst, or is good enough,etc. We can do better. Why Don't we?

That isn't an explanation. I understand you think it is normal. I'm asking how it would work in this situation and any evidence to suggest that dynamic does in fact exist. Because the GM and the Coach have a lot of incentive to win hockey games for the sake of their own career. I simply can't imagine any issue that a GM would be so stubbornly set on handling in a particular way that he purposely and willfully hires 'idiots' at the expense of better odds of winning (tremendously better odds if Capuano is as moronic as he is often purported to be). That suggests that control over that issue must supersede the benefits of winning. Which does not at all make any sense to me because a GM, ESPECIALLY one that is trying to establish himself a competent professional so as to ensure his future livelihood, will build his reputation and resume on winning. All of this confusion goes away if you go with the alternative explanation that he was hired simply because he was cheap. A conclusion that doesn't require logical leaps of faith and one that is supported by years of cap circumvention, salary floor spending, public announcements of loss on part of Wang, and every other hire under Wang. Of course, this would require putting down the pitchforks that some of you have held at Snow's neck and pitchforks are fun to poke at people. So I get it.

 

[GrandmaSlices51631]

This is the Islanders were talking about . Barring a total implosion, such as missing the playoffs or pulling a San Jose style exit, the usual suspects will be around to taunt us again.

I could see us getting owned in another game 7 and Capuano back.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

Under Wang, the only coaches the Islanders have had have been guys during their first stint as an NHL head coach. The only exception to that was Nolan, who was generally considered blackballed by the league. There has never been an in demand proven NHL coach though. Blaming this trend on Snow seems to ignore that the trend started long before him. The most likely answer is that the owner hasn't been willing to pay the salary that an in demand proven NHL coach would demand. But we'll see when the new owners take over.

I agree, but you would hope Snow would convince Wang to get someone better. The question then becomes what happens after the new guys take over. If there is no change it will suck in more ways than one.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

That isn't an explanation. I understand you think it is normal. I'm asking how it would work in this situation and any evidence to suggest that dynamic does in fact exist. Because the GM and the Coach have a lot of incentive to win hockey games for the sake of their own career. I simply can't imagine any issue that a GM would be so stubbornly set on handling in a particular way that he purposely and willfully hires 'idiots' at the expense of better odds of winning (tremendously better odds if Capuano is as moronic as he is often purported to be). That suggests that control over that issue must supersede the benefits of winning. Which does not at all make any sense to me because a GM, ESPECIALLY one that is trying to establish himself a competent professional so as to ensure his future livelihood, will build his reputation and resume on winning. All of this confusion goes away if you go with the alternative explanation that he was hired simply because he was cheap. A conclusion that doesn't require logical leaps of faith and one that is supported by years of cap circumvention, salary floor spending, public announcements of loss on part of Wang, and every other hire under Wang. Of course, this would require putting down the pitchforks that some of you have held at Snow's neck and pitchforks are fun to poke at people. So I get it.

Snow has an ego and likes total control. Banishing Chris Botta, quickly trading Nino, etc.

I agree on the cheap part. Let us see what happens once Wang is not controlling everything. If he does even after this summer, well, we are screwed.

 

[periferal]

I just don't buy into these power-obsessed Snow narratives. What issue is Snow so stubborn about, so immovable on his resolve that he is willing to jeopardize the team's success? Because there are plenty of selfish reasons for a GM to want his team succeed, especially a first job GM. It's the team's success that will secure his job, build his resume and reputation and secure future jobs. I just can't logically fathom Snow not hiring someone because he doesn't want their input on his signings, trades and roster moves. Especially considering Capuano's hire is much better explained by the entirely more reasonable explanation that Cappy was a cheap coach for a cheap owner. This explanation is substantiated by a lot of evidence over the past 10 years. Wang reporting his loses, salary cap floor rosters, moves to get around the cap etc. Your conspiracy explanation is predicated on a whole bunch of speculative points:
1) Snow gets off on being unchallenged
2) This is so important to him that he would forego trying to build his reputation as a winner so that he could hire someone that won't question what he does.
3) Capuano doesn't challenge anything Snow says

We don't have any knowledge of the interactions of any of these players that work for our franchise. So why go with the theory that relies on assumptions when it's so easily explained by money

OK - So instead of Snow being somewhat smart, but "power-obsessed," the only other option for hiring capuano, and sticking with him this long, has to be that Snow is actually inept.

I was giving him the benefit of the doubt in the brains department, but if we assume your theory then Snow is a much worse GM than we thought.

 

[PK Cronin]

You might be right; I'l have to look more closely about how the forwards are positioned. To me it looks like a 2-3. Whatever the case its clear their forcheck is not nearly as relentless and this is hurting them. If this is a conscious decision by Cappy it just adds to the list of reasons why he should be fired.

Is the theory that the Washington series led Cappy to adopt a new system? Could moving one forward from the direct forcheck to betwen the dots have nerfed the entire team so much?

It's a 1-2-2 on the forecheck, with a 2-3 in zone scheme. Really passive having that F3 so high in the zone, by the blue line. It absolutely has hindered the teams ability to generate goals. So many of our scoring opportunities last season came from hounding the puck in the corner and on the wall, now we simply don't do a whole lot of that. Forcing turnovers deep is where our players shine, because they're very good in transition. Having that F3 so high also limits the ability to cycle the puck and lend support to the puck carrier when he gets into trouble. Also, it's definitely being coached. Every line does it and it's very clear that's what the coaching staff wants it.

The reason for the switch is likely to cut down on goals against. Which, that part has worked. I'm a firm believer that defense wins championships, while running and gunning gets you President's Trophies. This system isn't just defensive, it's passive, and I'm not sure this system will work in the playoffs. It's creating a tighter game that doesn't necessarily lend a hand to this team's strengths, which is scoring in transition and crashing the net after cycling.

 

[LeapOnOver]

It's a 1-2-2 on the forecheck, with a 2-3 in zone scheme. Really passive having that F3 so high in the zone, by the blue line. It absolutely has hindered the teams ability to generate goals. So many of our scoring opportunities last season came from hounding the puck in the corner and on the wall, now we simply don't do a whole lot of that. Forcing turnovers deep is where our players shine, because they're very good in transition. Having that F3 so high also limits the ability to cycle the puck and lend support to the puck carrier when he gets into trouble. Also, it's definitely being coached. Every line does it and it's very clear that's what the coaching staff wants it.

The reason for the switch is likely to cut down on goals against. Which, that part has worked. I'm a firm believer that defense wins championships, while running and gunning gets you President's Trophies. This system isn't just defensive, it's passive, and I'm not sure this system will work in the playoffs. It's creating a tighter game that doesn't necessarily lend a hand to this team's strengths, which is scoring in transition and crashing the net after cycling.

And that F3 high does help with cutting down on goals as long as the high forward is defensively sound and not lazy with the puck. However, there are too many forwards up there dangling with it or taking on two guys. It's lead to really risky turnovers so I don't know how much that has been the reason goals against is low. I feel like our goaltending has had to be a lot stronger to make up for it. I feel like we are giving up more shots against than last season but I haven't looked at the stats. I don't really like it either, but it's really difficult to gauge how much of a problem it is causing. I think the system is cramping JT as well. I wish they would go back to it, but if the players have bought in than and it's not as much of a concern. Maybe they are just not executing properly. I felt like that's why our PK was so bad last year. It wasn't so much the system as the execution. This year they are still doing the same czech thing as last year, however they are not sticking to it as stubbornly and reacting better. I think it was just better execution.

 

[YesCubed]

OK - So instead of Snow being somewhat smart, but "power-obsessed," the only other option for hiring capuano, and sticking with him this long, has to be that Snow is actually inept.

I was giving him the benefit of the doubt in the brains department, but if we assume your theory then Snow is a much worse GM than we thought.

What if he's being told by his boss to keep Capuano?

An owner who said "It's not like we're getting killed out there" during one of the longest losing streaks ever and you can't believe that he wouldn't want to keep a coach who is more than likely on the cheapest contract in the league and keeps the team competitive?

It's a 1-2-2 on the forecheck, with a 2-3 in zone scheme. Really passive having that F3 so high in the zone, by the blue line. It absolutely has hindered the teams ability to generate goals. So many of our scoring opportunities last season came from hounding the puck in the corner and on the wall, now we simply don't do a whole lot of that. Forcing turnovers deep is where our players shine, because they're very good in transition. Having that F3 so high also limits the ability to cycle the puck and lend support to the puck carrier when he gets into trouble. Also, it's definitely being coached. Every line does it and it's very clear that's what the coaching staff wants it.

The reason for the switch is likely to cut down on goals against. Which, that part has worked. I'm a firm believer that defense wins championships, while running and gunning gets you President's Trophies. This system isn't just defensive, it's passive, and I'm not sure this system will work in the playoffs. It's creating a tighter game that doesn't necessarily lend a hand to this team's strengths, which is scoring in transition and crashing the net after cycling.

It's only working because the goaltending (especially the backup goaltending) is vastly improved from last season. They're giving up identical chances and shots from last year.

 

[BillD]

Snow has an ego and likes total control. Banishing Chris Botta, quickly trading Nino, etc.

I agree on the cheap part. Let us see what happens once Wang is not controlling everything. If he does even after this summer, well, we are screwed.

After Ledecky and Malkin sign checks to Wang, control of the existing New York Islanders Hockey LP will be transferred to a new controlling entity (name TBD), a holding company of at least 3 or more partners, of which Wang will be among the minority owners of the holding company and one of Ledecky or Malkin will be the majority or controlling partner.
Wang will only have influence or control ceded to him as seen fit by the controlling partner. He likely will be clipping coupons and be the landlord of some or more of the practice and office facilities he owns personally and rents to the hockey club.
In other words, he is done with hockey ops.

 

[periferal]

What if he's being told by his boss to keep Capuano?

An owner who said "It's not like we're getting killed out there" during one of the longest losing streaks ever and you can't believe that he wouldn't want to keep a coach who is more than likely on the cheapest contract in the league and keeps the team competitive?



It's only working because the goaltending (especially the backup goaltending) is vastly improved from last season. They're giving up identical chances and shots from last year.

100% a possibility, but then whatever the reason we have a "yes man" as coach (and one as GM as well).

All comes down to the fact that wang is a total failure running the Isles. The obstructed view seats at a brand new arena is a metaphor for his time as owner.

 

[Isles Fan]

This team has gone as far as it can with the current coaching/ management staff. It is the ONLY thing holding them back.

I think once the new owners take over we will see a lot of changes both on ice and off.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

After Ledecky and Malkin sign checks to Wang, control of the existing New York Islanders Hockey LP will be transferred to a new controlling entity (name TBD), a holding company of at least 3 or more partners, of which Wang will be among the minority owners of the holding company and one of Ledecky or Malkin will be the majority or controlling partner.
Wang will only have influence or control ceded to him as seen fit by the controlling partner. He likely will be clipping coupons and be the landlord of some or more of the practice and office facilities he owns personally and rents to the hockey club.
In other words, he is done with hockey ops.

I so hope you are right. I just have so many dashed hopes with this club under Wang it is like some twisted Islanders version of PTSD.

 

[BillD]

I so hope you are right. I just have so many dashed hopes with this club under Wang it is like some twisted Islanders version of PTSD.

Wang regretted buying the Islanders and has said so. he initially wanted to buy and NBA/ABA franchise but when there were none in the area, he was talked into the Islanders by Alphonse D'Amato.
Wang had one season of required spending on talent, then he pulled the purse strings tight. With this sale he recovers most if not all his investment and operating losses. He has been and would continue to be all about the Benjamins. I am not sure who is funding the excess payroll above the cap floor last year and this, but I don't think it is Wang.
He cannot and will not have say in hockey ops or the business end. His investment is related only to holding company accretion and profit.

 

[BroadwayJay*]

Wang regretted buying the Islanders and has said so. he initially wanted to buy and NBA/ABA franchise but when there were none in the area, he was talked into the Islanders by Alphonse D'Amato.
Wang had one season of required spending on talent, then he pulled the purse strings tight. With this sale he recovers most if not all his investment and operating losses. He has been and would continue to be all about the Benjamins. I am not sure who is funding the excess payroll above the cap floor last year and this, but I don't think it is Wang.
He cannot and will not have say in hockey ops or the business end. His investment is related only to holding company accretion and profit.

Who else could it possibly be?

I think there is a more obvious answer to this:

At NVMC it was too much of a risk to spend to the cap because it was so challenging to turn profit in the building because of the ticket prices, the lease, etc...

At Barclays, the team is profitable and there is no additional risk spending to the cap because they're guaranteed to profit from the floor contribution of the building and the TV deal alone.

In anticipation of this year, spending was ramped up since there was no issue forecasting the guaranteed profits.

You don't think that makes a lot more sense than some mystery investor footing the bill for payroll?

 

[MJF]

Wang regretted buying the Islanders and has said so. he initially wanted to buy and NBA/ABA franchise but when there were none in the area, he was talked into the Islanders by Alphonse D'Amato.
Wang had one season of required spending on talent, then he pulled the purse strings tight. With this sale he recovers most if not all his investment and operating losses. He has been and would continue to be all about the Benjamins. I am not sure who is funding the excess payroll above the cap floor last year and this, but I don't think it is Wang.
He cannot and will not have say in hockey ops or the business end. His investment is related only to holding company accretion and profit.

All owners of pro sports franchises want to make money and not have annual operating losses. Unfortunately Wang and the previous ownership tandem did this at the cost of trying to ice a competitive team, and the fans suffered for it.

If you're in the business of pro sports and you're not trying to win every year, you're in the wrong business.

 

[mack809f]

One thing I like about Snow.

The way he trades up in the draft to get the player he targets. He did it twice last year with Barzal and Beauvillier. In prior years he traded up to draft Brock Nelson and Calvin De Haan. Fellow Giant fans on this board may remember losing out on Revis (we ended up with Aaron Ross) and Doug Martin (Charles Wilson). Its nice to be on the other side of that. I think Snow has drafted pretty well.

 

[Frankie41987]

OK - So instead of Snow being somewhat smart, but "power-obsessed," the only other option for hiring capuano, and sticking with him this long, has to be that Snow is actually inept.

I was giving him the benefit of the doubt in the brains department, but if we assume your theory then Snow is a much worse GM than we thought.

You really ignored everything in my post. You're presenting the situation as seemingly having two possible explanations:
1) Capuano was hired because he doesn't "threaten Garth's power"
2) Capuano was hired because Snow actually thinks he is a qualified, decent coach

Both of those scenarios allow you to complain about Snow, which seems to be your goal. Like I said (for the reasons listed in my other posts) I don't buy into the power-obsessed Snow theories because A) there is no evidence for it B) the current situation is more logically explained by an alternative (for which there IS reason).

Perhaps Snow did think Capuano was qualified or a good fit. No one can possibly know that and I'm not interested in asserting something that I would have no evidence for. But I am willing to assert that there is reason to assume (again, reference my previous post for why) that money and its discretion probably played a role in Capuano's hire.

 

[periferal]

You really ignored everything in my post. You're presenting the situation as seemingly having two possible explanations:
1) Capuano was hired because he doesn't "threaten Garth's power"
2) Capuano was hired because Snow actually thinks he is a qualified, decent coach

Both of those scenarios allow you to complain about Snow, which seems to be your goal. Like I said (for the reasons listed in my other posts) I don't buy into the power-obsessed Snow theories because A) there is no evidence for it B) the current situation is more logically explained by an alternative (for which there IS reason).

Perhaps Snow did think Capuano was qualified or a good fit. No one can possibly know that and I'm not interested in asserting something that I would have no evidence for. But I am willing to assert that there is reason to assume (again, reference my previous post for why) that money and its discretion probably played a role in Capuano's hire.

Yes yes yes yes and yes.

BUT...

Now that money is not an issue...WHY IN THE HELL IS CAPUANO STILL SITTING BEHIND THE BENCH??? Does someone who could fire capuano (really only wang or snow) actually think he's going a good job?

You assert that my goal is to complain about snow. You were right to swing with that theory, but you were looking curveball and missed the fastball. My goal is to complain about capuano until he's gone.

I actually think Snow's done an ok job with his on-ice moves (but cannot be considered a good GM until I see a playoff series win). That said when I see such an inept person, in any job, who is not qualified and in over their head I'm going to call it out. That goes if it's at the AT&T store or head coach of my favorite hockey team.

Aside from Wang, Capauno is the worst person employed by the Islanders., and he's not just some regional scout - He's the frickin' head coach. I could complain about wang, and prior to this sale of the Isles being announced I couldn't complain anymore than I did about him. I strongly believed we were never winning the Cup with wang as owner and I also believe that about capuano as head coach. Now that I see the light at the end of the darkest tunnel with Ledecky/Malkintaking over, I've let off of wang because he's gone soon.

However Snow is auditioning for his job with the new owners and money is no longer an issue. So to go into this season with capuano still head coach is embarrassing to Snow - Even if wang told him to keep capuano.

So until snow, wang, or whomever you feel is pulling the strings (or actually pulling the strings) replaces capuano with a competent head coach to maximize the best amount of talent we've had in 20+ years, I'm going to be vocally upset about it. When I see my brothers on here complaining about him as well I know they get it, even if there isn't much we can do about it.

 

[A Pointed Stick]

However Snow is auditioning for his job with the new owners and money is no longer an issue. So to go into this season with capuano still head coach is embarrassing to Snow - Even if wang told him to keep capuano.

That is the part I don't get either. All I come up with is that they signed a really cheap contract with Capuano ending this season (no one knows the length) and Wang is stapled to it in his cheap, team destroying way.

Staple-ed to it.

 

[Quicklime]

An owner who said "It's not like we're getting killed out there" during one of the longest losing streaks ever and you can't believe that he wouldn't want to keep a coach who is more than likely on the cheapest contract in the league and keeps the team competitive?

This has been my opinion all along.

 

[Lame Lambert]

This is the Islanders were talking about . Barring a total implosion, such as missing the playoffs or pulling a San Jose style exit, the usual suspects will be around to taunt us again.

I could see us getting owned in another game 7 and Capuano back.

I wouldn't even bother watching next year.

 

[Volek25]

Side note on Capuano - he was on my flight home from Vegas Sunday morning. I saw him as I boarded flight sitting in first class (which I was not). But I passed by him and quietly wished him good luck rest of the season. He gave me a quick "thank you".

My gf wondered why I didn't try to talk to him more, not only was it an early flight and I'm not one to interrupt ppl when they're just trying to hang but I really don't support this guy. I believe this team should and can be so much better than they are right now. A lot of these slow starts and inconsistent play is coaching and with someone that commands a room and knows how to win, this team can really be something. As much as I hope and pray for playoffs this year part of me says the only way Cap doesn't return is missing the playoffs. I think Garth has a much longer leash that Cap.

Anyways, interesting to see him on the flight but this team needs a step up in the coaching position as most of you know already.

 

[Lame Lambert]

Side note on Capuano - he was on my flight home from Vegas Sunday morning. I saw him as I boarded flight sitting in first class (which I was not). But I passed by him and quietly wished him good luck rest of the season. He gave me a quick "thank you".

My gf wondered why I didn't try to talk to him more, not only was it an early flight and I'm not one to interrupt ppl when they're just trying to hang but I really don't support this guy. I believe this team should and can be so much better than they are right now. A lot of these slow starts and inconsistent play is coaching and with someone that commands a room and knows how to win, this team can really be something. As much as I hope and pray for playoffs this year part of me says the only way Cap doesn't return is missing the playoffs. I think Garth has a much longer leash that Cap.

Anyways, interesting to see him on the flight but this team needs a step up in the coaching position as most of you know already.

I would've heckled him from coach

 

[Islesfan22]

I would have asked him why do you always play 2 defensman in overtime when almost everyone else plays one defenseman.