Will Leafs Pursue Stamkos? Part 2

[thewave]

I wonder if winning a ring though would make him more comfortable joining the Leafs in a rebuild, because he now has a ring, which for most players is the goal. But in Toronto he could then focus on winning "the Ring," that every hometown boy dreams of growing up.

I think winning is addictive and if you've just won and see a team that has sustainability... Very attractive.

 

[MJ65]

I wonder if winning a ring though would make him more comfortable joining the Leafs in a rebuild, because he now has a ring, which for most players is the goal. But in Toronto he could then focus on winning "the Ring," that every hometown boy dreams of growing up.

Money is the biggest objective and then where you feel comfortable - yes you do want to win but money is the biggest factor in your decisions (and that's the fact)

Love of game or the city is a bs (most of the time)

 

[thewave]

Money is the biggest objective and then where you feel comfortable - yes you do want to win but money is the biggest factor in your decisions (and that's the fact)

Love of game or the city is a bs (most of the time)

Guys leave money on the table for a city and chance all the time. It really is a big thing.

 

[MJ65]

Guys leave money on the table for a city and chance all the time. It really is a big thing.

Money is the biggest objective my friend - the most recent example is David Price (I am surprised he signed with Boston when he had an offer from another team)

Show me the money

 

[burpsalot]

Money is the biggest objective my friend - the most recent example is David Price (I am surprised he signed with Boston when he had an offer from another team)

Show me the money

TheWave is right. Many players, especially after they have made big money & learned how hard it is to win the Cup, will put more importance to a chance of winning or a preferred (original 6 sometimes) city or team.

Teams shied away from Hull because of the perception he was difficult -- until the Red Wings, partly on the urging of captain Steve Yzerman, decided to give him a try. So a handful of Detroit players (Yzerman, Chris Chelios and Shanahan) deferred salary so general manager Ken Holland could shoehorn Hull onto his payroll too.

The Stars chose not to exercise their option on Hull's contract that would have paid him $7 million for the 2001–02 NHL season, making him a free agent. Although he received superior financial offers from the Montreal Canadiens and New York Rangers, Hull chose to sign a two-year, $9 million contract with the Detroit Red Wings to pursue a second Stanley Cup championship.

 

[Gary Nylund]

To me, the conservative, status quo choice doesn't mean there's no risk. You can keep Bozak and re-sign a Kadri or someone for a combined $10 million odd and keep your cap relatively clear, but if it came down to it, is that so much of a better option than to delete both of them and add one Stamkos for that dollar amount?

Signing Stamkos could give the franchise the jump start Curtis Joseph gave us years ago. Maybe he helps some of our kids going earlier, maybe he starts making Toronto a viable destination so the rebuild is actually 'accelerated' but in a good way. Maybe the Leafs continue to bank blue chip prospects while carefully adding quality free agents in 2017 and 2018 and the result is a good combination of young veterans and absolutely impressive kids pushing up from the farm. This looks like what Tim Murray's trying to accomplish in Buffalo.

Absolutely there's risk with "status quo", there's always some risk involved with any decision. And with Phaneuf gone, we could get Stamkos without having to ditch KAdri or Bozak, I really think Phaneuf being gone changes everything, plus Stamkos is playing better lately, I'm now of the mind I think that we could pay Stamkos up to 10.5m and I'd say it's worth the risk. Yes his play perhaps doesn't justify that kind of money but we need vets who can set an example not just by being vets, but by being able to play some as well. Say what you want about Dion but he was a pretty good player, now are best veterans are Kadri, JVR, Bozak and then Komarov and Holland? There's a gaping void there and Stamkos would fill it instantly.

Ideally the contract is set up so we can trade him after 5 years but honestly, I doubt he goes for that. If he wants to come home, he'll want to know that he can stay here for the entire 7 years. Best case scenario IMO is that he takes a bi t less money, say 9.5 and announces to the world that he took a bit of discount to help the team build a winner. That would be an awesome precedent that we can use to try to get 10% discounts when we sign Rielly, Nylander etc. in the future. But even if it costs 10.5 for 7 years with a NTC, I'd probably do it now. Not a penny more though, if Stamkos wants more than what Kane, Toews and Kopi got then he can take his ego elsewhere.

This is a very solid post.

I'll pile on a bit here

Stammer is a known gym rat, work out fanatic and we have a coach who embraces the philosophy of "best players need to be your hardest working", I have 0 issue with those two as our leaders and examples of excellence . Basically the complete opposite of fat fill.

Toss in the little nugget that Stammer is a C, a #1C arguably the hardest commodity in the nhl to get (fair argument can be made for #1D),

for me it's a no brainer , we sign Stammer if able , with one saving grace, if Stammer wants to be like Dion and demand a contract that he can never possibly live up to, then I utterly pass.

Yes, this is why I'm on the Stamkos train now. Not so much for what he brings on the ice, but for the leadership. Normally I'd be loathe to pay so much for that but the way I see it, we're kind of desperate for that now with all the prospect we expect to make their debut in a Leaf sweater over the next few years.

 

[Stephen]

Is the point of getting Stammer so we finish 9th in the East ?

We are not ready for Stammer.

Management would trade almost every player if they could.
They want to start fresh with their "own players" ... not hand me downs.

He would be bad for the Tank.

You have to start taking some baby steps at some point, and a 9th place finish (and lottery pick) authored by Stamkos, and a handful of the kids is not the same as when we were 9th with a veteran team with nowhere to go.

 

[Faltorvo]

You have to start taking some baby steps at some point, and a 9th place finish (and lottery pick) authored by Stamkos, and a handful of the kids is not the same as when we were 9th with a veteran team with nowhere to go.

and in world class cap hell to boot.

 

[Stephen]

I don't see Tampa winning this year.

 

[dirk41]

Not having an established star player to bring in the kids is a big mistake.

Why do you need an established star to bring in the kids? To help their development?

Has the lack of an established veteran star really hurt the development of the following:

RNH
Hall
Draisaitl
McDavid

All produce and play decently in their own ends. RNH had 50 points in his rookie season and is a good two-way centre; Hall has produced at or near a PPG since his second season; Draisaitl is at near a PPG pace in his second season; McDavid is at a PPG as a rookie and dominating play. Yakupov is the only one of their top picks who hasn't' developed well, and he may have been a bust no matter what.

These players don't need an established vet for the sake of having an established vet: they need d-men, goalies, and depth players.

If you put in an established star forward what happens? You get slightly better, the kids get less ice time, and the ****** D and goaltending remains ******.

edit:

Who is first, second, and fifth in possession on the Oilers? Draisaitl, Hall, and McDAvid. Who is near the bottom? Depth players and d-men. The young players don't need help being brought along--they need help on the ice, and they don't need it from a top six forward.

If only Hall, Draisaitl, and McDAvid had a veteran to bring them up than maybe they could produce around a PPG while having great possession numbers--oh wait!--they already do.

 

[kk87]

Yes, this is why I'm on the Stamkos train now. Not so much for what he brings on the ice, but for the leadership. Normally I'd be loathe to pay so much for that but the way I see it, we're kind of desperate for that now with all the prospect we expect to make their debut in a Leaf sweater over the next few years.

I mean, when you're getting a past 60 goal scorer, you're probably signing them, at least in part, for what they bring on the ice

In response to the poll, I'm pretty confident that Stamkos has already made up his mind with regards to whether he wants to sign with Toronto or not. If he does, nothing is going to sway him from doing so, and if he doesn't, at this point nothing will convince him to change his mind.

I really do believe he wants to be here though.

 

[Menzinger]

Absolutely needs front loaded and any NTC lifted or expanded for year 7. 10.5 is tops.

Toronto is in a high tax local compared to some of his other suitors.

They will need to likely have to offer 11+ million if they want to have a competitive bid

Leafs don't really have much leverage here - they'll have to give in to his agent's demands.

I peg his on ice value at around 9 million per - so overpaying by 2ish million is t a total disaster.

 

[AppsSyl]

Toronto is in a high tax local compared to some of his other suitors.

They will need to likely have to offer 11+ million if they want to have a competitive bid

Leafs don't really have much leverage here - they'll have to give in to his agent's demands.

I peg his on ice value at around 9 million per - so overpaying by 2ish million is t a total disaster.

A lot of people are forgetting that he will be paid in US $ and will be spending CAD $ while living here. That makes up for the tax thing in a big way considering how brutal the CAD $ is.

 

[Gary Nylund]

I mean, when you're getting a past 60 goal scorer, you're probably signing them, at least in part, for what they bring on the ice

In response to the poll, I'm pretty confident that Stamkos has already made up his mind with regards to whether he wants to sign with Toronto or not. If he does, nothing is going to sway him from doing so, and if he doesn't, at this point nothing will convince him to change his mind.

I really do believe he wants to be here though.

You got me, poorly worded, allow me to try again.

I think I'd be willing to pay Stamkos 10.5m not just for what he brings on the ice, but also for the example he would set off the ice. If he was the same player on the ice but was a "what's a weight room", "first off the ice after practise" kind of guy like Kessel was, I wouldn't be willing to pay anywhere near that, hell I might not want him on the team at all.

 

[dirk41]

A lot of people are forgetting that he will be paid in US $ and will be spending CAD $ while living here. That makes up for the tax thing in a big way considering how brutal the CAD $ is.

What will he be paying for in CAD? A house? They're crazy expensive in CAD? Luxuries will be in USD. Securities and investments will be in USD. I don't see a giant savings.

 

[kk87]

You got me, poorly worded, allow me to try again.

I think I'd be willing to pay Stamkos 10.5m not just for what he brings on the ice, but also for the example he would set off the ice. If he was the same player on the ice but was a "what's a weight room", "first off the ice after practise" kind of guy like Kessel was, I wouldn't be willing to pay anywhere near that, hell I might not want him on the team at all.

Yup, I hear ya. I definitely admire his dedication and drive on and off the ice

 

[Faltorvo]

Yup, I hear ya. I definitely admire his dedication and drive on and off the ice

and to add to Gary's point a little bit

I see talk about getting Rielly a proper partner for down the road

well I'll toss in the

"how about we get Marner a proper C to feed and play/learn off of. Grow confidence with, gain advice from. A threat so large out there that it will open time and space for him , yada yada.

For me at least, the whole "what about Marner" is as big a motivation to get Stammer as any I have see or heard.

 

[Le Cobra]

Does anyone know Stamkos well enough (either personally or character-wise) to gauge whether he would welcome the challenges of not only playing in this most demanding of markets but to grind in a team that is perceived to be tanking?

 

[HellasLEAF]

We don't have anyone that can shoot a puck like Stammer can. When you consider that it's only a matter of time before the NHL goes to bigger nets it would be a good 'net' investment lol.

But seriously. Special teams alone he would improve by having that threat on the half wall.

 

[barilko05]

What will he be paying for in CAD? A house? They're crazy expensive in CAD? Luxuries will be in USD. Securities and investments will be in USD. I don't see a giant savings.

Doesn't he already have a house in the area? Or does he stay at Mom and Dad's when he comes home in the summer?

 

[UllmansTiger]

Stamkos' agent was asked about the tax situation recently, he said it wasn't about the money with his client, at least not that part of it.

 

[Pookie]

This thread is fuelled by hope.

 

[Willie Oree]

Big picture thinking.

For me it might not be such a bad thing if Stamkos does re-sign in TB for $10 mil plus and then Leafs go hard after his teammate Viktor Hedman who is a potential UFA the following year.

Hedman as a #1D might have a much bigger impact paired with Rielly as Leafs top pairing then Stamkos might add.

TB might have a hard time fitting both Stamkos and Hedman and all their other RFAs.

What makes you think it will come down to money for Hedman? The reason why Stamkos to toronto has any steam at all is because many believe this is where he wants to play. Hedman is entering his prime years, why would he throw that away for a rebuilding Leafs team? He will have many suitors should he hit free agency.

 

[burpsalot]

Does anyone know Stamkos well enough (either personally or character-wise) to gauge whether he would welcome the challenges of not only playing in this most demanding of markets but to grind in a team that is perceived to be tanking?

Yes.

He was made to be the leader of the Leafs.

 

[saltming]

Sounds like he is ready to test FA