who's a worse GM- Chuck Fletcher or Kyle Dubas?

[c9777666]

One guy gets skewered because he overpays the top 4 and emphasizes skill.

The other guy gets skewered because he emphasizes guys with less skill but more toughness

Fletcher does everything the #FireDubas brigade wants him to do (i.e. don't overpay top guys)

Leaf fans would have probably demanded they sign Deslauriers instead of Malgin

Dubas does stuff Fletcher couldn't dream of doing- i.e. build around actual hockey players

But Fletcher actually has won a first round series, which seems to trump everything

These might be the 2 most maligned GM's now that jim benning is gone

Basically, do you think Fletcher or Dubas would find work elsewhere?

Who's the lesser of 2 evils?

Click to read more...

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

where vis the poll

 

[c9777666]

where vis the poll

poll now up

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I don't like Kyle Dubas , I have called for his firing but holy shit it's Chuck Fletcher and it's not close.

You can say what you want about Kyle trading draft picks or using the 1st to move Mrazek but you know what he doesn't do?

Kyle isn't out there trading a 1sst, 2 2nds a 3rd and a 4th for Risto and Deangelo

he's not out there taking on Ryan Ellis Anchor contract or signing a pure enforcer to 4 years at nearly 2 million per

Chuck does not know how do spend money.

and you can say "well what about the Marleau trade?'

I don't blame Kyle for that because Lou signed that contract that one is 100% on Lou.

there is A LOT to be critical of Dubas for but when it comes to spending money he's usually pretty good.

Bunting, Kase, Kampf were all great signings last year, the Giordano extension is fantastic

He had a 115 point team last year

Fletcher doesn't do those things he just spends like a drunk in vegas and his team is awful.

In fact he spends like Vegas spends but he's MUCH MUCH worse at it.

my team has some question marks, it has some holes butt I know the Leafs are going to be good next year short of team killing injury

I don't know that with Philly.

 

[ijuka]

Dubas is bad but Fletcher is something else.

Take the Tavares signing for example. He fell in Dubas's lap, but at least Dubas signed him and got himself a free asset. Fletcher couldn't even do that - Gaudreau wanted on Flyers and Fletcher couldn't get it done.

 

[CanuckistanFlyerfan]

Kyle isn't out there trading a 1sst, 2 2nds a 3rd and a 4th for Risto and Deangelo

Actually it was Ghost and a 2nd to clear capspace, a 1st. 2 more 2nds 3rd 4th 7th and Hagg.

Fletcher might be the worst GM in any sport ever.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Actually it was Ghost and a 2nd to clear capspace, a 1st. 2 more 2nds 3rd 4th 7th and Hagg.

Fletcher might be the worst GM in any sport ever.

that's even worse you just proved my point even more

 

[Hostile Offer]

Haha interesting that the title and actual poll question have it upside down. Voted for Dubas, which means that Fletcher is worse. By far.

 

[CanuckistanFlyerfan]

Kyle isn't out there trading a 1sst, 2 2nds a 3rd and a 4th for Risto and Deangelo

Actually it was Ghost and a 2nd to clear capspace, a 1st. 2 more 2nds 3rd 4th 7th and Hagg.

Fletcher might be the worst GM in any sport ever.

I fully expect him to trade the Flyers 1st next season for yet another one of Haysees buddies...the Flyers end up dead last and that team gets Bedard.

How do you build a team around Kevin Hayes and expect it to be anything other than bad?

 

[King 88]

Suter, Parise for Wilds, Hayes for Flyers and now these few trades in Flyers oh my

 

[TheGroceryStick]

Emotional damage!

 

[bobholly39]

Haha interesting that the title and actual poll question have it upside down. Voted for Dubas, which means that Fletcher is worse. By far.

Yeah same. Such a straightforward thread title, I almost didn't read poll question before voting, glad I did.

I agree with you also - Fletcher is bad.

I actually like a lot of the moves Dubas has made. Trades etc in past seasons, I think he usually does a good job. He's had a few bad moves too, but overall above average

 

[centipede2233]

Typically when a new GM takes over a team, they are taking over a tire fire from their predessesor. In dubie case, no GM, atleast in the cap world, inherited a loaded team with high end talent on ELC, all the picks in tact, and all the cap space in the world. Dubas “we can and we will” little did most leafs know, would be the start of a series of bad decisions with the matthews, marner and taveras contracts and nylander hold out that would create a domino effect of cap destruction. His reluctance of not moving a big caphit forward to help reproportion the cap elsewhere shows how stubborn dubas is.

if you recall, initially dubas wanted zero grit. But I’m sure shanahan told him they needed grit, so what does dubas do? Goes out and gets grit in the form of Thornton, simmonds, Clifford, an injured folign, his best years behind him muzzin. All players who were either on a serious decline or on the verge of being out of the league because their expiry date had long past.

trading picks away to fix mistakes has been a hallmark trait of dubas. And if he had properly negotiated a bridge deal for matthews and marner to keep the AAV down, he wouldn’t have been forced to move out the marleau contract.

then the goaltending carousel. The kadri trade for the wrong types of players in kerfoot and Barrie.
and going back to the 3 big contracts of taveras, marner and matthews prevented you from retaining hyman, mikayev, campbell. Sure he hit with bunting, and mikayev but they were invisible for most of the Tampa series which was the final exam they yet failed miserably.
fletcher is the worse gm only because he didn’t inherit a franchise center and Winger on their ELC like Dubas did with M&M.

 

[CanuckistanFlyerfan]

Typically when a new GM takes over a team, they are taking over a tire fire from their predessesor. In dubie case, no GM, atleast in the cap world, inherited a loaded team with high end talent on ELC, all the picks in tact, and all the cap space in the world. Dubas “we can and we will” little did most leafs know, would be the start of a series of bad decisions with the matthews, marner and taveras contracts and nylander hold out that would create a domino effect of cap destruction. His reluctance of not moving a big caphit forward to help reproportion the cap elsewhere shows how stubborn dubas is.

if you recall, initially dubas wanted zero grit. But I’m sure shanahan told him they needed grit, so what does dubas do? Goes out and gets grit in the form of Thornton, simmonds, Clifford, an injured folign, his best years behind him muzzin. All players who were either on a serious decline or on the verge of being out of the league because their expiry date had long past.

trading picks away to fix mistakes has been a hallmark trait of dubas. And if he had properly negotiated a bridge deal for matthews and marner to keep the AAV down, he wouldn’t have been forced to move out the marleau contract.

then the goaltending carousel. The kadri trade for the wrong types of players in kerfoot and Barrie.
and going back to the 3 big contracts of taveras, marner and matthews prevented you from retaining hyman, mikayev, campbell. Sure he hit with bunting, and mikayev but they were invisible for most of the Tampa series which was the final exam they yet failed miserably.
fletcher is the worse gm only because he didn’t inherit a franchise center and Winger on their ELC like Dubas did with M&M.

Fletcher took a 2nd overall pick (Nolan Patrick) and turned him into 4 games total and a 6 year $6 Million per contract of Ryan Ellis. Traded for a terrible defenceman in Ristolainen, and after actually watching him be terrible all year signed him to a 5 year $5 million per contract. Gave Kevin Hayes, after he said the only way he'd sign with Philly is if they overpaid him, a 7 year $7 Million per contract. He just gave a 31 year old goon a 4 year $2 million per deal. He builds his team around either guys with a Minnesota connection or Hayes buddies. The result is the 4th worst team in hockey...and this is after he's been going for it.

Dubas is a genius compared the Fletcher.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Fletcher just signed Deslauriers instead of Johnny Gaudreau.

A grapefruit could manage a team better than him.

 

[c9777666]

Fletcher just signed Deslauriers instead of Johnny Gaudreau.

A grapefruit could manage a team better than him.

Dubas haters think a real GM should have signed Deslauriers because LEAFS NEED GRIT

 

[cg98]

Idrc about Dubas, he just seems kind of a meh GM to me. But trying to say Chuck Fletcher is better? Lmfao good luck

 

[Peasy]

One gm'd a team to 115 points.

The other traded multiple assets for Risto and then decided to re-up him.

HF boards is cringe af at times.

 

[AKL]

Why can't they both be equally bad? Of the two of them, Fletcher is the one who has assembled a team that's made it past the first round of the playoffs before.

 

[Bouboumaster]

Dubas is a mixed bag but still, you can't argue with his season results.

Since Bergevin and Benning are gone, we're looking at arguably the worst GM in the league in Fletcher

 

[Captain Mountain]

I voted for Dubas because he's the lesser of two evils (meaning better than Fletcher). But I can't tell if that was the intention of the poll given the thread title.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Both are bottom 10 but Fletcher is on a whole other level of bad.

 

[HandshakeLineRespect]

Dubas is an atrocious GM. Just imagine if he didnt have all the money, resources and ability to disappear contracts on robida island that come with running the leafs. Hes like a Peter Chiarelli level type of gm.

 

[TheGreenTBer]

Dubas is a mixed bag but still, you can't argue with his season results.

Since Bergevin and Benning are gone, we're looking at arguably the worst GM in the league in Fletcher

No Leafs fan with a brain cares about regular season results anymore. They could go 82-0-0 and it wouldn't matter until they win a playoff series.

 

[Xspyrit]

Actually it was Ghost and a 2nd to clear capspace, a 1st. 2 more 2nds 3rd 4th 7th and Hagg.

Fletcher might be the worst GM in any sport ever.

I think you guys might not know what a bad GM is.

Feb. 23, 2019

Columbus Blue Jackets Acquire: ​ Ryan Dzingel · $1,800,000 2019 7th round pick (CGY - #212 - Tyler Angle) Sum: $1,800,000 Change: +$1,150,000

Ottawa Senators Acquire: ​ Anthony Duclair · $650,000 2020 2nd round pick (CBJ - #52 - Joel Blomqvist) 2021 2nd round pick (CBJ - #37 - Josh Doan) Sum: $650,000 Change: -$1,150,000

Great trade, no? Here's what happened with the assets obtained :


1) Not too bad but Murray was extended at 6.25 AVV x 4 years despite being the most injury prone NHL players the 3-4 years prior... and coming out of his worst season in 2019-20

. 7, 2020

Ottawa Senators Acquire: ​ Matt Murray · $0 (Signing Rights) Sum: $0 Change: $0

Pittsburgh Penguins Acquire: ​ Jonathan Gruden · $0 (AHL/JR) 2020 2nd round pick (CBJ - #52 - Joel Blomqvist) Sum: $0 Change: $0

2) All teams pay to dump their players... Ottawa PAID a 2nd round pick to acquire a 6.5 AAV dump...

c. 26, 2020

Arizona Coyotes Acquire: ​ 2021 2nd round pick (CBJ - #37 - Josh Doan) Sum: $0 Change: -$6,500,000

Ottawa Senators Acquire: ​ Derek Stepan · $6,500,000 Sum: $6,500,000 Change: +$6,500,000

3) Anthony Duclair scored 31 goals in 87 games with Ottawa but was let go as a RFA, then went on to score 41 goals and 90 points in 117 games with Florida...

Now that is bad GMing, and this is just one random example.