What the HELL is wrong with the Ottawa Senators!?

[X66]

Of all the things that is wrong with the Sens at the moment, I think nothing is scarier than the fact they have $14.25 million tied up in Bobby Ryan and Dion Phaneuf.

 

[Tuggy]

Of all the things that is wrong with the Sens at the moment, I think nothing is scarier than the fact they have $14.25 million tied up in Bobby Ryan and Dion Phaneuf.

Bobby Ryan at a 7.25 million dollar cap hit is unbelievably bad.

But at least he only has 4 more years left on the contract.

And Phaneuf at 7 million for 3 more years, yikes.

 

[BLNY]

Button addresses it perfectly on tsn. They lived above margins last year. Negative goal differential. Subpar special teams. Got hot and carried very hot goaltending through playoff run.

Goaltending this year has been average and they're not getting enough production from Stone, Hoffman, Ryan, etc. to make up for their shortcomings.

 

[RDTBay4]

They need to end the experiment and just put Karlsson back at forward.

 

[InAllOurLeafsCommand]

Bobby Ryan at a 7.25 million dollar cap hit is unbelievably bad.

But at least he only has 4 more years left on the contract.

And Phaneuf at 7 million for 3 more years, yikes.

Those contracts make it hard to do a rebuild, along with all the future picks Dorion has given away for nothing. The team is in a tough situation right now, and I'm not sure Karlsson will be willing to commit in its current state.

 

[joe dirte]

Those contracts make it hard to do a rebuild, along with all the future picks Dorion has given away for nothing. The team is in a tough situation right now, and I'm sure Karlsson will be willing to commit in its current state.

unfortunately for them with a thin prospect base, lots of traded picks, and lots of bad contracts, they're not only starting from scratch, they're starting from below zero. it's a minimum 5 year process from where they are.

 

[Pyrophorus]

That's such a lazy answer. There's no way you look at the team last year and the team this year and tell me that they are playing the same kind of hockey and its just luck catching up to them.

What? He has played maybe a handful of shifts on the wing, later in games and has played less than 16 minutes twice, while averaging 18:07. How did you manage to come to that conclusion?

Then its the coach/Boucher effect.

 

[Papa Francouz]

unfortunately for them with a thin prospect base, lots of traded picks, and lots of bad contracts, they're not only starting from scratch, they're starting from below zero. it's a minimum 5 year process from where they are.

Bad contracts and a decent few traded picks, yes. Their prospect pool is still strong, though. Chabot, White, Brown, Batherson, Formenton, and good depth after them. If Ottawa has done one thing really well in the recent past, it’s drafting.

 

[Lazlo Hollyfeld]

Ceci is just plain bad, crazy how Boucher continues to play him with Oduya. They have to be one of the worst defensive pairings in the NHL right now.

The bigger question I have watching that clip is where is the puck support?

Oduya has to cover two guys by himself along the boards as the forwards are coasting back and have a really nice view of the goal. The snow angel defense by Ceci is pretty sad though.

 

[SenzZen]

Bad contracts and a decent few traded picks, yes. Their prospect pool is still strong, though. Chabot, White, Brown, Batherson, Formenton, and good depth after them. If Ottawa has done one thing really well in the recent past, it’s drafting.

This is a far more thoughtful reply than that hot take ever deserved.

In the future, I'd recommend just saving the keystrokes.

 

[Fatty McLardy]

Boucher had this problem with TB also, he led them to the ECF in their first playoffs then failed to make the playoffs the next year.

 

[Papa Francouz]

This is a far more thoughtful reply than that hot take ever deserved.

In the future, I'd recommend just saving the keystrokes.

Fair enough, haha. [mod]

 

[joe dirte]

Bad contracts and a decent few traded picks, yes. Their prospect pool is still strong, though. Chabot, White, Brown, Batherson, Formenton, and good depth after them. If Ottawa has done one thing really well in the recent past, it’s drafting.

that's a very thin prospect base. you're pointing to guys literally just drafted, one of them even drafted after being passed over through an entire draft. he's a year older. you seem to even make assumptions about Colin white. he's not exactly tearing up the AHL. while there are about 10 to 15 forwards from his draft class doing reasonably well im the NHL.

1 or 2 players that MIGHT project into decent Nhlers and a few longshots like you've listed does not make a good prospect base.

but I'm not going to argue with you. can you find one publication that evaluates them as a top 10 since the end of last season? I doubt it. the majority would probably have them bottom 10.

 

[Silencio]

unfortunately for them with a thin prospect base, lots of traded picks, and lots of bad contracts, they're not only starting from scratch, they're starting from below zero. it's a minimum 5 year process from where they are.

Thin prospect base?

 

[harrisb]

As a sens fan it's Karlsson, as he goes the team goes and right now he isn't going....I'm not convinced since his surgery that he will ever get back to his dominant self. A significant part of his game was his explosive first 3 steps, since his return those are gone but his value around the league is still sky high. Sell him now and load up with young mostly developed kids, this is the type of move that turns a franchise into a perennial contender. In 3-4 years time when we're ready to contend again with Chabot, White, Brown, Duchene, Hoffman, Stone and our new pieces then Ryan and Phaneuf are both off the books and there is a tone of cap space to go shopping.

Love EK but I believe this is for the best of the team, oh ya, and hope Melnyk sells...

 

[joe dirte]

This is a far more thoughtful reply than that hot take ever deserved.

In the future, I'd recommend just saving the keystrokes.

you cant argue a single thing i said. every single one was true.

I don't see the point of this thread. its already been done once, and some sens fans absolutely refuse to entertain the notion that what they got late last year was not only very fortunate, but overachieving. in the last 5 years, including now, its an obvious outlier. when you consistently get one result for a long stretch, and then with little to no change, get a different result, and then go back to the status quo, isn't the most obvious explanation that the different result is not the norm?

 

[joe dirte]

Thin prospect base?

100% no question.

if you're going to argue it then back it up with something other than your opinion on a few guys.

"but formenton, I love him so much, look how many points he puts up in junior" means nothing.

 

[joe dirte]

As a sens fan it's Karlsson, as he goes the team goes and right now he isn't going....I'm not convinced since his surgery that he will ever get back to his dominant self. A significant part of his game was his explosive first 3 steps, since his return those are gone but his value around the league is still sky high. Sell him now and load up with young mostly developed kids, this is the type of move that turns a franchise into a perennial contender. In 3-4 years time when we're ready to contend again with Chabot, White, Brown, Duchene, Hoffman, Stone and our new pieces then Ryan and Phaneuf are both off the books and there is a tone of cap space to go shopping.

Love EK but I believe this is for the best of the team, oh ya, and hope Melnyk sells...

ibsont know about selling karlsson. that's a rash decision for a 30 game stretch. but a step back and rebuild/retool is clearly needed.

 

[DatSnipeMatthews]

you cant argue a single thing i said. every single one was true.

I don't see the point of this thread. its already been done once, and some sens fans absolutely refuse to entertain the notion that what they got late last year was not only very fortunate, but overachieving. in the last 5 years, including now, its an obvious outlier. when you consistently get one result for a long stretch, and then with little to no change, get a different result, and then go back to the status quo, isn't the most obvious explanation that the different result is not the norm?

What is truth?

 

[harrisb]

ibsont know about selling karlsson. that's a rash decision for a 30 game stretch. but a step back and rebuild/retool is clearly needed.

A retool either starts with Karlsson or we lose Karlsson to UFA once he see's we're retooling. You can't retool without trading him unfortunately, he wants to win AND get paid.

Edit: It's not a rash decision for me, I advocated this a few times already, sell high and buy low. Our household also owns 4 Karlsson jerseys so we're big fans but bigger fans of the team.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

unfortunately for them with a thin prospect base, lots of traded picks, and lots of bad contracts, they're not only starting from scratch, they're starting from below zero. it's a minimum 5 year process from where they are.

White, Chabot, Brown, Jaros, Englund, Lajoie, Formenton, Batherson, Hogberg??????

 

[harrisb]

White, Chabot, Brown, Jaros, Englund, Lajoie, Formenton, Batherson, Hogberg??????

You forgot Chlapik, Gagne, Bowers and Perron

 

[Papa Francouz]

You forgot Chlapik, Gagne, Bowers and Perron

Bowers came to Colorado in the Duchene deal. Your point still stands, though.

 

[harrisb]

Bowers came to Colorado in the Duchene deal. Your point still stands, though.

As you can see we could sort of afford it Totally forgot he was part of that deal.

 

[Statto]

Obviously the impact of the form of EK is an issue, although without him they played okay earlier this season. However no team should be so reliant on one player and I don’t think the Sens were such a team either. Unfortunately they traded away the other guy they relied on. Acquiring Duchene isn’t an issue in itself however losing Turris has hurt the Sens big time. He was a key piece and now looks worth every day of the extra term he reportedly wanted.