Speculation: What is Vegas doing with Vadim Shipachyov?

[BattleBorn]

I've got a feeling this is Ship's choice for outside reasons.

There are few other options that make sense.

 

[joe89]

This thing is the most Ken Holland thing Ken Holland isn't responsible for himself.

 

[airbus220]

I've got a feeling this is Ship's choice for outside reasons.

It's not because of Ship that 3D are in the pressbox.

 

[BattleBorn]

It's not because of Ship that 3D are in the pressbox.

Totally agree.

 

[Canada4Gold]

"Habs trying to trade Mark Streit"
Next Day "Mark Streit on waivers"
Next Day "Mark Streit clears waivers"

*Vegas send Ship down, attempting to trade 1 of 6 worthless defenseman to make room*
A week and a half later *Still trying to trade worthless defensemen*

Hate the Habs, but at least they saw in 1 day their worthless defenseman was worthless, still mind boggled that GMGM doesn't realize he has a bunch of D that can clear waivers, pick one and get it over with already.

 

[3074326]

He had to take four extra players and most everyone here said they'd do the same as defensemen hold higher value. It's better than picking 4 extra goalies like he said he might.

How's that "higher value" working out?

It's not. He's not handled it well at all. I'm surprised there are people defending him.

 

[Canada4Gold]

Picking the extra defenseman would have been a sound strategy before he worked those deals out, the 10th through 13 best available defenseman could have had some value. But he worked out deals that turned Wild potential D into a forward, Isles potential D into a throwaway goalie(Yes I'm aware the Wild and Isles could have had alternate strategies without deals made), Tampa deal into an overpaid D, Anaheim deal into an overpaid D, Calgary pick of a worthless D from Vegas, Sbisa for some reason. Once he went through watering down the player pool he was never going to be able to get value from them all, should probably have evened out those extra picks a bit.

But at the time I thought there'd b a market for goalies too which there clearly wasn't so it's impossible to know for sure had he did something different would it have worked out any better.

 

[Uncle Gary]

Something else must be going on. It would be incredibly stupid to keep him in the AHL just to try to get a 6th round pick for some crappy dman.

 

[JoemAvs]

Something else must be going on. It would be incredibly stupid to keep him in the AHL just to try to get a 6th round pick for some crappy dman.

Doubt it.

This is just McPhee not willing to admit that he screwed up by picking too many defensemen instead of a few better forwards available just because he thought he could use them as a trade bait.
Waiving them now and losing them for free would be him admitting that he was wrong in picking the guys he did in the expansion draft.

And it looks like that is not something that McPhee is prepared to do anytime soon so early in his new job...

 

[Soundgarden]

Picking the extra defenseman would have been a sound strategy before he worked those deals out, the 10th through 13 best available defenseman could have had some value. But he worked out deals that turned Wild potential D into a forward, Isles potential D into a throwaway goalie(Yes I'm aware the Wild and Isles could have had alternate strategies without deals made), Tampa deal into an overpaid D, Anaheim deal into an overpaid D, Calgary pick of a worthless D from Vegas, Sbisa for some reason. Once he went through watering down the player pool he was never going to be able to get value from them all, should probably have evened out those extra picks a bit.

But at the time I thought there'd b a market for goalies too which there clearly wasn't so it's impossible to know for sure had he did something different would it have worked out any better.

Don't be dense. We turned Dumba, who wouldn't have even been available had a deal not been done, into Tuch and Haula.

They didn't turn the Isles pick into a throwaway goalie, they turned it into Erik Brannstrom, who was the most impressive draft pick at training camp, and a 2nd round pick, you're ignoring the best parts of the deals for Vegas because you hate McPhee, I know he's crap but christ not every thing he has done has been bad.

They didn't pick just pick Garrison, they got the rights to one of the best players not playing in the NHL and after another move got another forward prospect they needed. Every gm in the business does that deal and just because Garrison is overpaid does not mean he is totally useless, he has been decent for us and we need solid defense.

England may seem worthless, but he's one of the few local Vegas players and he's been surprisingly good so far. He's definitely a leader on and off the ice.

We didn't do the Anaheim deal for Stoner, do you really think that? We got our no.1 prospect. Vatanen and Manson weren't available. We got Theodore instead.

 

[Jeremy Hronek]

Doubt it.

This is just McPhee not willing to admit that he screwed up by picking too many defensemen instead of a few better forwards available just because he thought he could use them as a trade bait.
Waiving them now and losing them for free would be him admitting that he was wrong in picking the guys he did in the expansion draft.

And it looks like that is not something that McPhee is prepared to do anytime soon so early in his new job...

Is not willing to admit he screwed up by picking too many defenseman any better than sending down your 4.5 million dollar signing who was expected to be your top center?

 

[Revelation]

It's pretty obvious that while higher level D might hold more value than higher level F, lower level D hold much less value than lower level F. You only have 7 spots on defense vs 14 on forward, and there is a much greater surplus of crappy defensemen to choose from (plus you can only have 1 or 2 crappy defensemen whereas you can carry more crappy forwards on strength of roster). It's much easier to make room for a Thomas Nosek than a Griffin Reinhart or a Cody Eakin vs a Luca Sbisa. Then again McPhee is a legendary too-smrt-for-his-own-good idiot.

Now he's flat out Nylandering his best player and biggest FA signing in franchise history so he can get a 7th rounder for an 8D.

 

[Canada4Gold]

Don't be dense. We turned Dumba, who wouldn't have even been available had a deal not been done, into Tuch and Haula.

They didn't turn the Isles pick into a throwaway goalie, they turned it into Erik Brannstrom, who was the most impressive draft pick at training camp, and a 2nd round pick, you're ignoring the best parts of the deals for Vegas because you hate McPhee, I know he's crap but christ not every thing he has done has been bad.

They didn't pick just pick Garrison, they got the rights to one of the best players not playing in the NHL and after another move got another forward prospect they needed. Every gm in the business does that deal and just because Garrison is overpaid does not mean he is totally useless, he has been decent for us and we need solid defense.

England may seem worthless, but he's one of the few local Vegas players and he's been surprisingly good so far. He's definitely a leader on and off the ice.

We didn't do the Anaheim deal for Stoner, do you really think that? We got our no.1 prospect. Vatanen and Manson weren't available. We got Theodore instead.

Clearly that's not what I meant. I know the assets you got from those deals. What I'm saying is if Vegas straight up took the best players they could the 10th through 13th guys(the extra slots) would have had some value in a trade and they wouldn't have been stuck with so many worthless guys. When people were advocating for Vegas to take 13 D it was because they could have taken 13 D worth value which they would have been able to trade. By doing these trades to bring in those other assets first they ended up with a bunch of their D slots with guys who are worthless. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, I liked a lot of the deals they made(not all of them however). But in doing those deals it no longer made sense to take 13 defenceman like people were suggesting. What you were inevitably going to end up with is a bunch of worthless guys.

I was posting more in defence of GMGM in that post than anything. Guys saying things like "Hey he tried to corner the D market and in doing so screwed up by having a bunch of worthless guys". No, he made trades to get him value, but in doing so it was obvious that all the extras he was going to take was going to leave the bottom of his D core pretty bad and worthless compared to the 10th through 13th guys had he just taken the best he could from every team. Again, that's not to say he did something wrong in making these deals, I didn't like all of them, but most of them made total sense to me. It's just once you already have Stoner, and Garrison. Drafted Engllend for the reasons he did, taking guys like Sbisa and Reinhart, hell possibly even Merrill, he may have been better off not stocking up all his extra picks on these defenceman. Especially when he's unwilling(for good reason) to trade guys like Schmidt, McNabb, or Miller. It's just too many defenceman you're either unwilling to move or have no value. I'm surprised he managed to move Emelin(I would have taken Hudon). And at this point, he should waive someone and get it over with. Or retain again like they did with Emelin. Nobody is going to take these guys straight up, or grab them off waivers.

I'd appreciate you not calling me dense when you don't even understand the point I was trying to make. Thanks.

 

[Sun God Nika]

Am i the only one who thinks Ship to Pittsburgh makes sense?
He would have Malkin to help explain things to him on the bench.
Pittsburgh would have a 1 - 2 - 3 Punch. Teams would not be able to shut down three elite scoring lines.
Low cap hit (4.5M) and signed for this season and next
With Crosby and Malkin playing the first unit always he would be the perfect centre for a second unit.

To Vegas - Pittsburgh 1st 2018 (24th-31st ovr)
To Pittsburgh Shipachyov 50% (2.75M)

Guentzel - Crosby - Rust
Hagelin - Malkin - Kessel
Hornqvist - Shipachyov - Sheary
Kuhnackle - McKegg - Reeves

 

[Tryamkin]

Tuch and Theodore should be in the NHL too. GMGM has not been impressive.

 

[SotasicA]

McPhee is waiting for another team to have a season-ending injury happen to one of their d-men.

THEN he can unload a defenseman for a conditional 6th, and call up Shipachyov. So, maybe some time December. Just so he can save face and not "waste" an asset.

 

[Reality Czech]

McPhee is waiting for another team to have a season-ending injury happen to one of their d-men.

THEN he can unload a defenseman for a conditional 6th, and call up Shipachyov. So, maybe some time December. Just so he can save face and not "waste" an asset.

Which is funny because "wasting an asset" is exactly what he's doing with Shipachyov.

 

[GordieHoweHatTrick]

George McPhee is literally a joke.

The name itself should make you belt out in laughter.

From avoiding the best players available in the expansion draft to keeping your best scorer out of the lineup for no good reason, the dude must have a hollow Ping-Pong ball for a brain.

 

[CamelToews]

George McPhee is literally a joke.

The name itself should make you belt out in laughter.

From avoiding the best players available in the expansion draft to keeping your best scorer out of the lineup for no good reason, the dude must have a hollow Ping-Pong ball for a brain.

Their best scorer? James Neal says hello with 6 goals in 4 games.

McPhee is a joke though, it's sad.

 

[IranCondraAffair]

McPhee is waiting for another team to have a season-ending injury happen to one of their d-men.

THEN he can unload a defenseman for a conditional 6th, and call up Shipachyov. So, maybe some time December. Just so he can save face and not "waste" an asset.

I just don't see anyone wasting an asset on Sbisa, Merrill, or Reinhart since they are the only realistic options to trade. There are other options out there.

 

[LeafChief]

Waive Hunt.

Assign Hunt to the minors 1 day later (because no one will take him).

Recall Shipachyov.

Profit.

 

[Sens]

I just don't see anyone wasting an asset on Sbisa, Merrill, or Reinhart since they are the only realistic options to trade. There are other options out there.

Or maybe he's trying to trade one of his better defensemen and use those guys as in house replacement

 

[glovesave_35]

Or maybe he's trying to trade one of his better defensemen and use those guys as in house replacement

He could almost certainly do that later in the season as teams actually develop a need for those defensemen. Send the AHL fodder down now. They will clear. Play the better D. Play Ship. Trade better D when you can (if you want) and bring up the other guys later.

It really is simple. Everyone is dumping on McPhee because what he is doing is indefensible.

 

[Ola]

George McPhee is literally a joke.

The name itself should make you belt out in laughter.

From avoiding the best players available in the expansion draft to keeping your best scorer out of the lineup for no good reason, the dude must have a hollow Ping-Pong ball for a brain.

This, he could have built a contender from the get go but screwed literary everything up. Completely clown, he went from doing a worthless job in Washington to doing a worthless job in Vegas.

 

[Coastal Kev]

I could have done a better job at the expansion draft than Mcphee did with zero preparation and while drunk...that's a fact.