Were you wondering just how bad our defense really is?

[TheOtherOne]

I know this isn't really a controversial opinion, but I think our offense from defensemen is bad. "How bad is it?" Well I did some stat digging for details and it's even worse than you might guess if you were purposely exaggerating for comic effect.

Last year, our leading point scoring defensemen were 1: Green (36p) and 2: Jensen (13p). Okay Kronwall was tied with Jensen but Jensen did it in fewer games so.

Among the entire NHL, there were 37 defensemen with more points than Green. Okay, that's bad, but it's not comically bad.

Among the entire NHL, there were 130 defensemen (!!!) with more points than Jensen.

This is the fun part: You could take all the players who had more points than our 2nd leading defenseman, put 4 of them on every single team in the NHL, and still have 6 guys left over.

Every single team had a MINIMUM of 3 defensemen with at least the same amount of points as Jensen. If NJD's #3 guy had one more point I would have said "with more points than Jensen". And that includes teams like AZ and Lolorado even though they had way fewer goals than us and way fewer points in the standings.

Again, I realize the badness isn't really news to anybody. It just blows my mind a little when I add context and perspective to clarify just how bad is bad. This year we're actually doing a little better with Green at #18 and Kronwall at #87, but when you take into account that Kronwall isn't getting any better and Green is probably going to get traded....

Ooo, also, side note, our big free agent signing who was brought in to stabilize the D has 2 whole points so far.

If I were to make an overall point to make this thread less of a waste of time, it would be this: FOR THE LOVE OF GOD stop getting excited about trading Green. I strongly feel that without Green, we will literally be playing 3v5 constantly. If you want any of our young forwards to develop offensive instincts, they need SOMEONE on the backend that they can make plays with...

Click to read more...

 

[Winger98]

I know this isn't really a controversial opinion, but I think our offense from defensemen is bad. "How bad is it?" Well I did some stat digging for details and it's even worse than you might guess if you were purposely exaggerating for comic effect.

Last year, our leading point scoring defensemen were 1: Green (36p) and 2: Jensen (13p). Okay Kronwall was tied with Jensen but Jensen did it in fewer games so.

Among the entire NHL, there were 37 defensemen with more points than Green. Okay, that's bad, but it's not comically bad.

Among the entire NHL, there were 130 defensemen (!!!) with more points than Jensen.

This is the fun part: You could take all the players who had more points than our 2nd leading defenseman, put 4 of them on every single team in the NHL, and still have 6 guys left over.

Every single team had a MINIMUM of 3 defensemen with at least the same amount of points as Jensen. If NJD's #3 guy had one more point I would have said "with more points than Jensen". And that includes teams like AZ and Lolorado even though they had way fewer points than us in the standings.

Again, I realize the badness isn't really news to anybody. It just blows my mind a little when I add context and perspective to clarify just how bad is bad. This year we're actually doing a little better with Green at #18 and Kronwall at #87, but when you take into account that Kronwall isn't getting any better and Green is probably going to get traded....

Ooo, also, side note, our big free agent signing who was brought in to stabilize the D has 2 whole points so far.

If I were to make an overall point to make this thread less of a waste of time, it would be this: FOR THE LOVE OF GOD stop getting excited about trading Green. I strongly feel that without Green, we will literally be playing 3v5 constantly. If you want any of our young forwards to develop offensive instincts, they need SOMEONE on the backend that they can make plays with...

and a team worst -12, though Dekeyser is doing his best to wrestle that accomplishment away. This post, though, seriously takes depressing news about our team to a whole new level. Thanks for putting how god awful our blueline is into perspective.

What's great is that we're so capped that any significant upgrade to the blueline is pretty much off the table. Even if we wanted to make our blueline better, it's pretty much not going to happen outside of a prospect coming in and setting the place on fire.

 

[BinCookin]

I mean i agree, moving Green is a horrible hockey decision.

Salary Cap and Rebuild decision its a great move.

I am fully aware of how bad our D is without green.
if you think you hate watchingg this team now.....
Just wait till Green is gone.

I for one embrace our new reality. Arm Chair GMing is the most fun in chaotic times... which we are entering

 

[jkutswings]

So you're saying Detroit will use their first rounder on a RW with steady yet unremarkable two-way play. Ooh! And grit. Gotta have tons of grit.

 

[crashnburnluder]

Lol green has to be traded, HAS TO, because we can be awful without him for the last 30 games of the season and picks, or with him (were still awful with him) and no picks and lose him to FA. No way Green returns to Detroit he will chase a cup.

 

[Pavels Dog]

Our D doesn’t drive offense at all, so these numbers aren’t surprising. Our PP was also garbage last year which doesn’t help.

My course of action would be trading Green and XO/Jensen and bringing up Hronek and Russo/Hicketts post-TDL. Start the transition to better PMDs.

 

[Redder Winger]

Honestly, I wanted Green when we signed him.
But really, this dude is nearly a negative value because of all the awful decisions he makes in the Dzone.
I hope some sucker of a GM is willing to give a first rounder for him.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Honestly, I wanted Green when we signed him.
But really, this dude is nearly a negative value because of all the awful decisions he makes in the Dzone.
I hope some sucker of a GM is willing to give a first rounder for him.

He has a place on a good team, just like Nyquist does. They can both be slotted further down on a good hockey club and contribute both EV and PP point production. Both guys look worse given how bad we are overall. Both should be traded before the TDL.

 

[TheMule93]

Blashills system always involved activating the D and getting them really involved in offense. Honestly must suck for him to have the worst defense corps in the entire league with that system lol

 

[Redder Winger]

He has a place on a good team, just like Nyquist does. They can both be slotted further down on a good hockey club and contribute both EV and PP point production. Both guys look worse given how bad we are overall. Both should be traded before the TDL.

I wouldn't even trade Gus, except the salary situation in Detroit almost requires it at this point.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

Honestly, I wanted Green when we signed him.
But really, this dude is nearly a negative value because of all the awful decisions he makes in the Dzone.
I hope some sucker of a GM is willing to give a first rounder for him.

Ah, I see you fell for the trap that hf has set for you. Green isn’t terrible in the dzone and is actually one of the better defenders on the team

 

[turkleton85]

Ah, I see you fell for the trap that hf has set for you. Green isn’t terrible in the dzone and is actually one of the better defenders on the team

in the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is the king

 

[ArGarBarGar]

Topics like these make me hate Daley more. The bar is so low yet you still aren't able to reach it.

 

[Frk It]

It's trash. It's been trash.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Agree the blueline needs a major over-haul and hopefully it begins once we get out new GM next summer.

 

[Datsyukian Deke]

Lidstrom took any resemblance of defense with him when he retired, sadly. Since then it's just been a bunch of guys standing around the net, bewildered as what they are supposed to be doing, or who they are to be defending.

 

[jkutswings]

Lidstrom took any resemblance of defense with him when he retired, sadly. Since then it's just been a bunch of guys standing around the net, bewildered as what they are supposed to be doing, or who they are to be defending.

Yes and no. For as much grief as he received on these boards (myself included), a guy like Kyle Quincey wasn't exactly the worst defender in the world. And Kronwall, for all his injuries, hasn't been the weakest link, either.

It's been a few steps, leading to the basement they're currently in.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

This organization is a dumpster fire.

They basically ignored addressing the defense because they still had a 40+ year old Lidstrom on the roster.

Trash GM has ruined this organization for the next 10+ years.

 

[turkleton85]

This organization is a dumpster fire.

They basically ignored addressing the defense because they still had a 40+ year old Lidstrom on the roster.

Trash GM has ruined this organization for the next 10+ years.

I always have to think of a warren zevon song when looking at hollands masterpiece

Well, I went to the doctor
I said, "i'm feeling kind of rough..."
"Let me break it to you son,
you're shit's f***ed up!"
I said, "My shit's f***ed up?!
Well, I don't see how!"
He said, "The shit that used to work,
won't work now!"

 

[Frk It]

Our D doesn’t drive offense at all, so these numbers aren’t surprising. Our PP was also garbage last year which doesn’t help.

My course of action would be trading Green and XO/Jensen and bringing up Hronek and Russo/Hicketts post-TDL. Start the transition to better PMDs.

I like the idea of bringing up either Cholowski or Hronek after the TDL and letting them play the remainder of the season in Detroit. Russo and Hicketts are just gonna be more bleh, IMO.

 

[SpookyTsuki]

I like the idea of bringing up either Cholowski or Hronek after the TDL and letting them play the remainder of the season in Detroit. Russo and Hicketts are just gonna be more bleh, IMO.

Not sure about cholo. Hronek may deserve a couple games but Idk.

 

[RedWingzz]

Our D is astronomically bad. Last year I think only NJ had a worse D than us. We are 31 out of 31 right now. Ottawa has bad D, but they still have Karlsson.

Green: At this point he would be a perfect 2nd pair, PP specialist. I like Green, never had many complaints. He is a good player on a terrible team. Bring on a 1st rounder at the deadline and go win a Cup.

Dekeyser: Being paid like a #1-2, in reality he's a good #4. One of the worst contracts in the NHL. I like him, but Kenny is forcing me to hate him based on the amount he is paying him.

Daley: Underwhelming. He looked good on good teams, and now looks bad on a bad team. He must be regretting his choice already. I wonder is he is tradeable? His contract isn't awful, but 2 more years and his rough play will probably scare teams away. (Holland!)

Ericsson: Has actually been better this year than in previous years, however he is still prone to boneahead turnovers that directly results in goals for the opposition. At least Big E tries hard and competes most nights, he is just lacking skills and footspeed. Would be a good 3rd pair guy right now, but 4.25 is a terrible contract. (Holland!)

Kronwall: Please retire after this year. I appreciate your services, you were a great player in your day and were a big part of the 2008 Stanley Cup win. Please retire though, you don't have it anymore.

Jensen & Ouellet: They are your average 3rd pair/ 7th Defencemen. If you could somehow combine these 2 guys into 1 player, we'd have a pretty good Defenceman, but overall at the individual level they are nothing special.

 

[RedWingzz]

I like the idea of bringing up either Cholowski or Hronek after the TDL and letting them play the remainder of the season in Detroit. Russo and Hicketts are just gonna be more bleh, IMO.

Hronek and Cholowski won't get games just yet. I agree Russo is another fringe NHL/solid AHL player, and you're probably right about Hicketts, but I'd give Hicketts some games at the end of the year just to see what we have before completely writing him off.

 

[Frk It]

Our D is astronomically bad. Last year I think only NJ had a worse D than us.

Where did that Sami Vatanen guy come from? You can improve your defense through trades? Who knew....

 

[obey86]

Honestly, I wanted Green when we signed him.
But really, this dude is nearly a negative value because of all the awful decisions he makes in the Dzone.
I hope some sucker of a GM is willing to give a first rounder for him.

hogwash.