Value of: Wayne Simmonds or Boone Jenner to the Leafs

[Halla]

switch kapanen for brown

lawl. get lost.

a year and a half of simmonds isnt bringing back a 20g rookie (on pace for 25 this year), a top 4 dman and a 1st.

I honestly wouldnt even do Gardiner and the 1st....or Brown and a 1st

 

[Halla]

Kapanen, Gardiner and a 2018 1st for Simmonds.

take out Gardiner insert Polak and its closer.

and i still wouldnt do it unless there was already a deal in place to move Bozak for assets

 

[Starat327]

so this is what chia did to the percevied value of dmen....sigh

leafs are more than happy with marner. they chose him over hanifin,werenski and provorov.

I think werenski is the only guy they would move magic mitch for

Uhh, It has nothing to do with Chiarelli trades. All other things equal, a 1D is more valuable that a 1W. By insinuating that a bad trade affects the value of the two, I can gather you haven't been paying attention to Provorov playing 27 mins a night regularly at age 20.

I'm not saying Toronto should be bent about it, Marner is abviously a good fit and it works for you. Maybe they wouldn't move Marner for any of them. But saying "we drafted this person before them" as some sort of rationale after draft is just dumb. Im sure the leafs wouldn't want to take Erik Karlsson over Like Schenn in the first round of 2007, either.

 

[CBJFan19*]

Yeah the leafs don't have the pieces to get Jenner with all that off the table.

 

[mikeyp24]

so this is what chia did to the percevied value of dmen....sigh

leafs are more than happy with marner. they chose him over hanifin,werenski and provorov.

I think werenski is the only guy they would move magic mitch for

And the CBJ would decline and say there's also only 1 guy on that team that could pull Z away.

 

[Knies iT]

I'm almost certain Jenner has less league wide than BJ fans advertise. I mean the guy averages 30-40 points (with one outlier season) and is on pace to replicate the same this year. Due to their lack of C depth I wouldn't even bother targeting boon, as it would likely take a quality centre to pry him out; definitely not Kadri, who is on pace for 70+ points after going 30-30 last season.

Also, got a good chuckle at Marner for 1.5 years of Simmonds. Give it a break.

 

[OVO16]

Jenner is unattainable I think. Blue Jackets would want a core piece back for him.

Simmonds, on the other hand, could be had, considering he's going to be a rental. I dont know what it would take though.

 

[CBJFan19*]

I'm almost certain Jenner has less league wide than BJ fans advertise. I mean the guy averages 30-40 points (with one outlier season) and is on pace to replicate the same this year. Due to their lack of C depth I wouldn't even bother targeting boon, as it would likely take a quality centre to pry him out; definitely not Kadri, who is on pace for 70+ points after going 30-30 last season.

Also, got a good chuckle at Marner for 1.5 years of Simmonds. Give it a break.

Bozak and JVR have less value league wide then they do in Toronto but that doesn't stop Toronto fans.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

Bozak and JVR have less value league wide then they do in Toronto but that doesn't stop Toronto fans.

Who is the league doesnt need a guy who regularly scores around 30 goals every year?

 

[mikeyp24]

I'm almost certain Jenner has less league wide than BJ fans advertise. I mean the guy averages 30-40 points (with one outlier season) and is on pace to replicate the same this year. Due to their lack of C depth I wouldn't even bother targeting boon, as it would likely take a quality centre to pry him out; definitely not Kadri, who is on pace for 70+ points after going 30-30 last season.

Also, got a good chuckle at Marner for 1.5 years of Simmonds. Give it a break.

For any Jackets player it's always going to seem like a guy is less capable of putting up higher numbers because our #1 priority is stopping them from putting up numbers. We play for 2-1 style games and know that playing our style keeps them low scoring and gives us 30ish shots on goal a game to give us a fairly good shot at our 2 goals. Guys like Cam, Jenner, Panarin, Foligno, etc put up a lot more points on offensive minded teams with a true 1C.

Watching 10 or more games of any of those guys you can tell box scores don' remotely show the accurate picture of the players they are.

 

[CBJFan19*]

Who is the league doesnt need a guy who regularly scores around 30 goals every year?

He's scored more than 25 goals just 4 of his 8 years in the league, so no he's not even close to scoring around 30 goals nor is he close to doing it every year but yet he always gets passed off as a 30/30 guy

Your lie of a post does nothing but prove my point. Hess not 1/5th as good around the league as leaf fans are desperate for him to be.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

He's scored more than 25 goals just 4 of his 8 years in the league, so no he's not even close to scoring around 30 goals nor is he close to doing it every year but yet he always gets passed off as a 30/30 guy

Your lie of a post does nothing but prove my point. Hess not 1/5th as good around the league as leaf fans are desperate for him to be.

He has scored 29, 27 and 30 goals in 3 out of the last 4 years. The 4th year he scored 14 goals in 40 games due to injury so pacing for around 29 goals.

He is also has 12 goals in 26 games this year so pacing for over 30...

What more do you want? Notice how I said scored around 30 goals as I know some fans love to argue the semantics even though he has paced for close to 30 goals the entire time he has been a leaf...

Using his time in Philly playing in the bottom 6 as a young player maybe isn't the most relevant data to today...

 

[CBJFan19*]

He has scored 29, 27 and 30 goals in 3 out of the last 4 years. The 4th year he scored 14 goals in 40 games due to injury so pacing for around 29 goals.

He is also has 12 goals in 26 games this year so pacing for over 30...

What more do you want? Notice how I said scored around 30 goals as I know some fans love to argue the semantics even though he has paced for close to 30 goals the entire time he has been a leaf...

Using his time in Philly playing in the bottom 6 as a young player maybe isn't the most relevant data to today...

He's also played more than 4 years, I mean if you're going to say every year, then count every year. Otherwise is just trolling since it's changing your opinion to fit your agenda.

Nobody cares about injuries and projecting, this is real life not NHL 18, injuries happen. He didn't score or come close to 30 goals that year, period, and of story.

Notice how I said 25? You know, like not even close to being last 30? I mean Cam Atkinson has more total goals than JVR over the last 5 years for Christ Sakes lol

But keep pretending he's some goal scoring God, he's average at best to everyone else that lives in the real world outside of fantasy land Toronto that plays what if pretend 24/7/365.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

He's also played more than 4 years, I mean if you're going to say every year, then count every year. Otherwise is just trolling since it's changing your opinion to fit your agenda.

Nobody cares about injuries and projecting, this is real life not NHL 18, injuries happen. He didn't score or come close to 30 goals that year, period, and of story.

Notice how I said 25? You know, like not even close to being last 30? I mean Cam Atkinson has more total goals than JVR over the last 5 years for Christ Sakes lol

But keep pretending he's some goal scoring God, he's average at best to everyone else that lives in the real world outside of fantasy land Toronto that plays what if pretend 24/7/365.

It is not changing my agenda lol... the NHL is a league of what have you done for me lately. Not many GMs are too concerned how good a player was like 8 years ago lol.

Voracek has only scored more than 50 points 4 times in 9 season so i guess he is around a 50 point player? No because context is important.

By the way JVR scored 112 goals in 310 games over the last 5 year for 23rd most of any player while Atkinson scored 111 in 342 games for 24th most. So ya the 'average' top 25 goal scorer in the league.... and you say I'm the one with the agenda haha

 

[CBJFan19*]

How are you not changing your agenda? You literally said the words "every year" and then when someone did some fact checking you resorted to "well in the last few years" you literally word for word changed your whole argument lol the first statement is where I stopped reading, because I'm sure it turned Into a loljvrisagoalscoringgod and a ifheplayedhewouldhavescoredseventybilliongoalsin5games post.

He's not as good as you want him to be, facts agree with me. Sorry.

It is not changing my agenda lol... the NHL is a league of what have you done for me lately. Not many GMs are too concerned how good a player was like 8 years ago

 

[TaketheCannoli]

he might be a rental to Toronto depending on what kind of money he commands after next year, we'll have cap constraints - rental in the sense that he might not be a long term roster player, not in the traditional "he's going to walk as a UFA" sense

That's fine. It doesn't change what it would take to get Columbus to move him. A young cost controlled top 6 C or maybe a young cost controlled top 4 rhd. Columbus is not going to want futures unless it's a dramatic, crazy overpayment.

 

[Viqsi]

He's also played more than 4 years, I mean if you're going to say every year, then count every year. Otherwise is just trolling since it's changing your opinion to fit your agenda.

Nobody cares about injuries and projecting, this is real life not NHL 18, injuries happen. He didn't score or come close to 30 goals that year, period, and of story.

Notice how I said 25? You know, like not even close to being last 30? I mean Cam Atkinson has more total goals than JVR over the last 5 years for Christ Sakes lol

But keep pretending he's some goal scoring God, he's average at best to everyone else that lives in the real world outside of fantasy land Toronto that plays what if pretend 24/7/365.

Oh FFS. Can we please be fair? JvR is definitely a good goal scorer; those goal scoring totals are very good in today's league. What makes him unsuitable for the CBJ is the fact that he's yet another winger and we have eleventy billion of them; there's no need to tear him down further to make the point that we don't need or want him.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

so this is what chia did to the percevied value of dmen....sigh

leafs are more than happy with marner. they chose him over hanifin,werenski and provorov.

I think werenski is the only guy they would move magic mitch for

Uhh, It has nothing to do with Chiarelli trades. All other things equal, a 1D is more valuable that a 1W. I can gather you haven't been paying attention to Provorov playing 27 mins a night regularly at age 20.

But saying "we drafted this person before them" as some sort of rationale after draft is just dumb. Im sure the leafs wouldn't want to take Erik Karlsson over Like Schenn in the first round of 2007, either.

For some, anybody in a blue uniform with a leaf on it is automatically worth ten times more. Those folks live in a blissful cloud. That's the way it rolls around here.

 

[Randy Randerson]

That's fine. It doesn't change what it would take to get Columbus to move him. A young cost controlled top 6 C or maybe a young cost controlled top 4 rhd. Columbus is not going to want futures unless it's a dramatic, crazy overpayment.

wasn't suggesting otherwise, that's why I'm not in favour of the Leafs going after Jenner

 

[Randy Randerson]

We've got some decent C pieces that project as mid or bottom 6C, but really only Frost and Rubstov for a top 6 kind of role. I wouldn' feel comfortable moving them until Patrick asserts himself a little more though.

I don't know if Johnsson/Bracco etc would be on the Rubtsov level, but I'd be fine with someone who has middle 6 type upside. Our top 2 center spots are full for a while, but we don't have much in the system at the position so it would be nice to be deeper and we can spare some wingers with good upside

Bracco - star upside lottery ticket, hasn't shown much (in very little opportunity) as a pro yet, has defensive concerns

Johnsson - complimentary top 6 upside, he's been good in the SHL and AHL and seems to play both ways. Good wheels, good shot, small

 

[Flyerfan47]

What would it take?

Unavailable:
Matthews
Nylander
Marner
Anderson
Rielly
Kadri​

Than neither is Simmonds. Mathews is understandable and you can keep Kadri.

 

[garyturner3]

I am 100 percent serious.

I think Simmonds for Marner is a legitimate offer Philly should be seeking and value isn't insanely off. Remember, we got Top 5 picks in Schenn and Voracek (plus more) for Richie and Carter. Sure there's arguments to be made about their contracts being longer and being better (maybe), but that's why it's a 1-1 swap I'm proposing.

Marner seems to be the one struggling of the top 3 or 4 big guns in TO...Simmonds could really help them. Gotta give to get -- this may be the price to "get" a Wayne Simmonds.

Ya, actually it is.

 

[CBJFan19*]

Oh FFS. Can we please be fair? JvR is definitely a good goal scorer; those goal scoring totals are very good in today's league. What makes him unsuitable for the CBJ is the fact that he's yet another winger and we have eleventy billion of them; there's no need to tear him down further to make the point that we don't need or want him.

What's fair about hearing how Toronto has alot these all star great players and that Columbus players are just trash all the time ? Fairness must go both ways, and it doesn't from Toronto's side.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

What's fair about hearing how Toronto has alot these all star great players and that Columbus players are just trash all the time ? Fairness must go both ways, and it doesn't from Toronto's side.

Lol your so deluded... but judging from the fact your not a Leaf fan but have exclusively posted in all leaf threads tells me all I need to know.

Lol...

 

[Viqsi]

What's fair about hearing how Toronto has alot these all star great players and that Columbus players are just trash all the time ? Fairness must go both ways, and it doesn't from Toronto's side.

For one, you're focusing exclusively on the loudmouth headcases. Don't do that. There are Leafs fans who are capable of being reasonable, but shouting them down as though they're more of the same doesn't help.

And for another, this "they're being jerks so being a jerk back is perfectly okay" approach is not something one should be leaning on in any case. It's an occasional "whoops, mea culpa, I'll do better next time" thing, not a long-term posting strategy.