VOTE ... when to start ATD12

[pitseleh]

I'm indifferent to the choices, so I won't vote for the sake of voting.

I do think it's worth mentioning that a number of (potential) GMs are participating in the Top-100 list on the History board, and at this rate the list will probably be complete early October. It's not the biggest commitment but it's one more thing GMs will be busy with.

 

[Sturminator]

Option 3

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

I'd just like to point out. If we start ATD 12 in November, when is ATD 13?

We'll have to put the whole thing on hold over the Holidays, so being done at the end of January is the best case scenario. And then what? We want to keep interest up, so June, July and August are the worst times to recruit. But would people really be willing to wait that long?

Personally, if we start in November, I'm out. After last year, I made myself a promise that I would not be involved in an ATD between December 19th and January 2nd. Even if we bring it to a complete halt, I don't want it on my mind.

But, I recognize that a lot of people want a break. So, honestly, why not have January 15th/16th as an option?

No, that's not its purpose at all.

Are you saying that if we didn't have an MLD, we'd just start another ATD all over again?

No, I'm saying the MLD gives those who want a chance to have a break a break, and those who want more ATD more ATD.

 

[seventieslord]

I'd just like to point out. If we start ATD 12 in November, when is ATD 13?

We'll have to put the whole thing on hold over the Holidays, so being done at the end of January is the best case scenario. And then what? We want to keep interest up, so June, July and August are the worst times to recruit. But would people really be willing to wait that long?

Personally, if we start in November, I'm out. After last year, I made myself a promise that I would not be involved in an ATD between December 19th and January 2nd. Even if we bring it to a complete halt, I don't want it on my mind.

But, I recognize that a lot of people want a break. So, honestly, why not have January 15th/16th as an option?

The later the better.

Anything to make me say "oh man, can't wait, it's been a while since the last ATD!" and not "oh great, another draft I can't say no to"

No, I'm saying the MLD gives those who want a chance to have a break a break, and those who want more ATD more ATD.

Well, I disagree. the time between one ATD and the next is what gives those who want a chance to have a break a break. the MLD is separate and optional.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

Well, I disagree. the time between one ATD and the next is what gives those who want a chance to have a break a break. the MLD is separate and optional.

But what I'm saying is we have 3 months + between ATDs, why is a bigger break needed? I've got a great idea for how to build a team, and I can't wait to get a chance.

 

[VanIslander]

I thought a step in the right direction would be to tighten things uptimewise, finish the fall draft by the start of December and finish the spring draft by the beginning of May. This would require an earlier start and shortened time windows, midSept and lateFeb as beginning dates. This would give all of January and half of February to get a minor league draft done; half of May and all of June to get a minor league draft done. July and August ought to be downtime around here, perhaps with a triple-a draft for any diehards or newbies who don't like summer weather.

In contrast, if we have a draft go from mid-fall through to mid-winter then perhaps making it a once-a-year event (?) might be the way to go. Certainly no one would get burnout; though, if anything, interest wanes with a drawn out process imo.

A draft which essentially uses up October-November and then a clear break, then March-April isn't too much, is it? Tightening up the time windows and the playoff format ought to remove the lagging December and lagging June endings of some past drafts.

I dunno. We'll see what we do. We've never done the third option, so who knows how it'll go. It might catch on, or we might go back to the traditional schedule the following fall. Time will tell.

At least the voting turnout has been encouraging. We'll have no trouble going with 32 teams.

Those who haven't voted yet, do!

 

[VanIslander]

23 so far...

the want-early division (option 1):

Hedberg, papershoes, VanIslander, Leafs Forever, chaosrevolver, Nalyd Psycho, Mr.Bugg, EagleBelfour

the want-later division (option 3):

seventieslord, cottonking, Hockey Outsider, Chigurh, Jungosi, Vakar Lajos, Zamboni Mania, DoMakc, sturminator

the cool division (because they want the usual... or whatever):

Rzeznik, vancityluongo, arrbez, ... Reds4life, pappyline, pitseleh

...

We'll almost certainly hear from God Bless Canada, raleh, Transplanted Caper, reckoning, Evil Speaker, Leopold Stotch. I'm hoping we get some of Murphy, Evil Sather, Spitfire11, MXD, wisent, among others I PM'd.

It's the middle of August and summer vacations are on.

Let's give them a couple of weeks. No hurry. There's no need to end this voting process until the end of the month, September 1st a natural endpoint (exactly two weeks before an early start, if the majority votes for that, so that's when a sign-up thread would start if we end up going with that option).

 

[seventieslord]

But what I'm saying is we have 3 months + between ATDs, why is a bigger break needed? I've got a great idea for how to build a team, and I can't wait to get a chance.

Don't you put a lot of thought into who you'll ultimately select, a lot of time into research, into your player bios, roster assassinations, and playoff arguments? I do. It pretty much takes up all my spare time when it's on.

The less often we have the ATD, the less often I have something dominating my time. I can't say no to it, and yes, it's a character flaw on my part.

I would like to just be able to say "aw, #### it" one of these times but no matter how early you start the next one, I'll be there. By the end of AAA11, I'll have been in 12 straight drafts and I'll feel like Garry Unger must have felt when he got the flu: "Well, I'd really rather not play, but it's what I do. And I have a streak going."

 

[seventieslord]

In contrast, if we have a draft go from mid-fall through to mid-winter then perhaps making it a once-a-year event (?) might be the way to go. Certainly no one would get burnout

- Too many drafts, too often, runs the risk of cheapening what should be a prestigious event.

- There would be no burnout, and fewer Evil Speakers and Hockey Outsiders saying "I'll sit this one out, fellas."

- We could start it after the new year, take it nice and slow, and watch it conclude at some point during the playoffs, or stick with the "go go go draft draft draft" mindset we have now and finish by the trade deadline.

Either way, a once a year draft is inevitable. Exactly 10 years from now, do you think we'll all be sitting here discussing when to start ATD32? I doubt it.

 

[VanIslander]

Exactly 10 years from now, do you think we'll all be sitting here discussing when to start ATD32? I doubt it.

I can't think of a cheaper retirement hobby. Hockey is a lifelong passion. We should at least have a re-union draft!

In the meantime the drafts march on like Neurath's boat, getting fixed as it goes along, each plank replaced eventually without ever being drydocked. Spitfire11 was the last of the original ATDers, and unless a Leaf Lander or John Flyers Fan returns, we'll be running with an entirely different crew than what started this voyage six years ago. There's no reason to think an entirely different bunch won't be doing this six years from now.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

Don't you put a lot of thought into who you'll ultimately select, a lot of time into research, into your player bios, roster assassinations, and playoff arguments? I do. It pretty much takes up all my spare time when it's on.

The less often we have the ATD, the less often I have something dominating my time. I can't say no to it, and yes, it's a character flaw on my part.

I would like to just be able to say "aw, #### it" one of these times but no matter how early you start the next one, I'll be there. By the end of AAA11, I'll have been in 12 straight drafts and I'll feel like Garry Unger must have felt when he got the flu: "Well, I'd really rather not play, but it's what I do. And I have a streak going."

There's a reason I don't do write ups on every player. I'll pick one or two each draft to upsell if I think a player is underrated and I can prove it. I don't bother writing up a player if there is consensus on his value. Honestly, I don't even bother reading write ups on players unless someone is answering questions about a pick. To me, that's the purpose of the line-up assassination, to find the areas that people question and then answer those questions. I don't want to read answers to unasked questions.

I've also toned down my playoff arguments because it was getting upsetting. And with a tighter playoff schedule, boom, that problem is solved. I think a major burnout problem is we have a small handfull of GMs that can argue for ever and everyone else gets bored. No one wants to actually read 3 pages of arguments before voting, and then they don't vote.

To be honest, I tend to wing it during the draft. I have loose prepwork, but I spend 10-30 minutes tops every 2-3 days making sure I'm ready for my next few picks. And I have a few ideas going in. That's the big thing for me. I get an idea and try to build around the idea. My motivation isn't even to win, it's more to successfully develop my idea to the best of my ability. And hope that my idea is an winning one.

So, yeah, for me the thought of a once a year thing sucks. I get so many ideas. So many combinations of players I want to build around. Twice a year and I'm constantly ravenous. I'd be primed and ready for 3 or 4 times a year. Once a year and it might be easier to just not do it. The unfulfilled ideas would kill me.

I can't think of a cheaper retirement hobby. Hockey is a lifelong passion. We should at least have a re-union draft!

In the meantime the drafts march on like Neurath's boat, getting fixed as it goes along, each plank replaced eventually without ever being drydocked. Spitfire11 was the last of the original ATDers, and unless a Leaf Lander or John Flyers Fan returns, we'll be running with an entirely different crew than what started this voyage six years ago. There's no reason to think an entirely different bunch won't be doing this six years from now.

Yeah, I can't help but think, what's wrong with having GMs retire or take time off? As long as there is interest. As long as new GMs are signing up. I don't see why this has to be an exclusive event with the same GMs over and over.

 

[nik jr]

option 1

 

[Leaf Lander]

Option 1

 

[Dreakmur]

I don't care, so I'll throw my vote into the category that won't matter...

Option 2

 

[raleh]

I suppose Option 1. Ideally I'd say 2, but with 24 hours per playoff matchup, but of the options presented, 1 is the best one I think.

 

[EagleBelfour]

For my own personal good, even as an ATD junkie, I'm really starting to like Option 4, once a year draft. We could take our time to select, research and right proper bios. We will have the time to do an MLD a AAA and a AA in between.

If option 4 ever become an option, I'll switch my vote.

 

[ck26]

Exactly 10 years from now, do you think we'll all be sitting here discussing when to start ATD32? I doubt it.

Yes, and by then you're going to need to trade up into the top 10 pick if you want a shot at getting Alex Ovechkin.

 

[Transplanted Caper]

Option One, or convserely, an alternative Option Four that would see the draft start in January. I don't think options 2 or 3 will be done in time for the inevitable Christmas swoon, and a suspension over the Holidays doesn't help in that regard either. Tough to get people back once they've left for a few weeks.

 

[VanIslander]

For my own personal good, even as an ATD junkie, I'm really starting to like Option 4, once a year draft. We could take our time to select, research and right proper bios. We will have the time to do an MLD a AAA and a AA in between.

If option 4 ever become an option, I'll switch my vote.

your vote should be for option 3 then, as it'll likely be only once a year if we start mid-November, and besides, if that option wins, there will be a couple of months to decide to wait even further, to start in january instead, if people want. it's options 1 and 2 that need a decision to be made by the end of this montrh. so eagle. perhaps vote option 3 now and bring up a 3 vs. 4 option in october, putting it to a vote at that time... after all, option 3 is a vote for starting LATER than usual

 

[EagleBelfour]

your vote should be for option 3 then, as it'll likely be only once a year if we start mid-November, and besides, if that option wins, there will be a couple of months to decide to wait even further, to start in january instead, if people want. it's options 1 and 2 that need a decision to be made by the end of this montrh. so eagle. perhaps vote option 3 now and bring up a 3 vs. 4 option in october, putting it to a vote at that time... after all, option 3 is a vote for starting LATER than usual

I thought you were for option 1? But why would you want me to change my vote for option 3? My head hurts

Yea thinking about it I'll change my vote to option 3, I know myself and I'll pass too much time on the ATD instead of studying like I should

 

[VanIslander]

I thought you were for option 1? But why would you want me to change my vote for option 3? My head hurts

I really want option 1. But the issue here is what you want. My undergrad degree was in Ethics. I know the difference.

28 votes so far... 10-3-10

option 1: Hedberg, papershoes, VanIslander, Leafs Forever, chaosrevolver, Nalyd Psycho, Mr.Bugg, nik jr, Leaf Lander, raleh

option 2: Rzeznik, vancityluongo, arrbez

option 3: seventieslord, cottonking, Hockey Outsider, Chigurh, Jungosi, Vakar Lajos, Zamboni Mania, DoMakc, sturminator, Eagle Belfour

(and maybe Transplanted Caper who wants to start early option 1 to end before Christmas or else start much later in January, the so-called option 4 which might basically be a vote for option 3 because it is the 'later' vote category and if option 3 wins then in October a date can set, maybe another poll then as to whether make it November or January.)

no preference regarding options: Reds4life, pappyline, pitseleh, Dreakmur

 

[VanIslander]

Change my vote to: no preference. I only voted for an option because I thought we had to. I want into the draft and I don't care when.

 

[camperjr]

Option 3

 

[DoMakc]

28 votes so far... 10-3-10

option 1: Hedberg, papershoes, VanIslander, Leafs Forever, chaosrevolver, Nalyd Psycho, Mr.Bugg, nik jr, Leaf Lander, raleh

option 2: Rzeznik, vancityluongo, arrbez

option 3: seventieslord, cottonking, Hockey Outsider, Chigurh, Jungosi, Vakar Lajos, Zamboni Mania, DoMakc, sturminator, Eagle Belfour

i voted for the Option 2, not 3.

 

[VanIslander]

i voted for the Option 2, not 3.

Corrected.

29 votes so far... 10-4-9

option 1: Hedberg, papershoes, VanIslander, Leafs Forever, chaosrevolver, Nalyd Psycho, Mr.Bugg, nik jr, Leaf Lander, raleh

option 2: Rzeznik, vancityluongo, arrbez, DoMakc

option 3: seventieslord, cottonking, Hockey Outsider, Chigurh, Jungosi, Vakar Lajos, sturminator, EagleBelfour, camperjr

(and maybe Transplanted Caper who wants to start early option 1 to end before Christmas or else start much later in January, the so-called option 4 which might basically be a vote for option 3 because it is the 'later' vote category and if option 3 wins then in October a date can set, maybe another poll then as to whether make it November or January.)

no preference regarding options: Reds4life, pappyline, pitseleh, Dreakmur, Zamboni Mania